E85

Handeman said:

Why? If it came from someone outside the corn belt? I think most of America already knows that the subsidies aren't right. Here in Virginia they don't grow much corn because the are "discouraged" so they don't impact the markets in the midwest. Thousands die because food cost are so high they starve, but it's politically incorrect to allow farmers to up the supply? If this keeps up, it might be political suicide to support the subsidies much longer.

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It has nothing to do with the corn belt. It has to do with the popular opinion that ethanol is "green" and "emissions free".

poke44 said:

One thing about Brazil...
alot of their ethanol is produced with sugar cane and sugar beats.... Using those crops the process is alot more efficient in turning growing, transporting, producing engery costs into the ethanol from those 2 crops.

I personally like biodiesel as an alternative small engine fuel... way more efficient for this country to be able to produce with our climate. think soybeans.

Also there was a guy down in texas making biodiesel out of algea in big clear plastic tubes... and if you ever seen an algea bloom happen in a lake or creek its kinda scary how fast that stuff can grow.

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Mostly sugar cane, but there's not enough land in the world suitable for growing enough sugar cane to even come close to meeting demand.

Biodiesel is currently more expensive to produce than gasoline. Just like corn ethanol, though, the issue becomes one where there is simply not enough agricultural capacity in the U.S. to make even a small dent in our oil dependency.

Almost off topic....

My uncle owns several large Dodge diesel trucks used in his business. In an effort to cut costs (and because he likes to tinker) he is brewing his own "bio diesel".

He collects used cooking oil from area restaurants. None charge him for this...matter of fact some have actually offered to pay him to take it.

He heats and strains this dirty oil and then mixes in a very small amount of methanol. Don't ask me for specifics because I have none. I will try to find out more detail if anyone really wants to know.

The only modification needed on the vehicle is a different fuel filter. Mileage difference after 3 months testing in 4 vehicles is +/- 5%....meaning little to no difference between his fuel and pump diesel (at least in the short term).

His cost per gallon? $2.80!!! Considering that pump diesel is over $4 that's a pretty significant savings. Of course it will take a little time to recover his set up costs....Tanks, filters, pumps, etc...

Time will tell but it looks good so far. Maintenance records and costs will be monitored closely over the next year and compared to prior years to determine "actual" costs. Right now I am looking for an old diesel Rabbit to try it out on...

The agriculture lobby in the US is massive, and they are doing a lot to push E85. More ethanol means more expensive corn, which means better profits.

The future is defiantly elsewhere - Ethanol cannot replace gasoline, at least not on its own. Good luck finding a politician willing to go against agriculture, though. At best there will be some support for other alternatives, but not much opposition to ethanol.

A while back I was wondering how much corn it would take to replace all the gas with ethanol. I do not have the numbers around anymore but….

I looked up,
Annual US consumption of gasoline
Difference in energy ethanol vs. octane
Bushels of corn to make a gallon of ethanol.
Bushels of corn grown in the US.

If I remember correctly it worked out we would need to plant 11 times the acreage to meet the need. This does not seem very practical.

A real answer to reduce gasoline consumption overnight is for everyone to go out to their cars with a really big box. Open the trunk and all the doors, take all the junk out from under the seat, crammed behind the spare tire (maybe even the tire), the two out of date phone books, the case of water… everything-- even the floor mats in the back seat where no one ever sits, and throw it in the box and drag it into the garage. City MPG is nearly directly proportional to weight, if your care weighs 2500 lbs and you take out 50 lbs of stuff you will get 2% better city mileage.

Mark

Bohica said:

He heats and strains this dirty oil and then mixes in a very small amount of methanol. Don't ask me for specifics because I have none. I will try to find out more detail if anyone really wants to know.

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It's actually not too hard
https://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_make.html (I didn't have time to read this entire link, but I assume it's basically the same process as what I had read before)

Bohica

If he is getting the veggie oil free I wonder why his cost are up that high per gallon. Unless methanol has gone up that much, wich it probably has.


In the Guide, it talks about decanting off the biodiseal, bad bad bad, you want to have an aparattus where you can drain off the glycerine from the bottom... its way way easier, gravity is your friend...

I talked to him last night and the figure I listed includes his start up costs. His cost could drop as low as 1.20 in roughly 90 days...More details after I see him this weekend.