Ethernet or Wifi to workshop?

[cwbullet]

I need to run the internet to my 3D printing workshop. I need it to go about 300-500 feet. I plan to set of a 3D printing farm and CNC workship and want it connected sp I can monitor my work from the house. Anyone have a suggestion? I am trying to avoid another DSL bill.

 

[jadebox]

Of course, you could run an ethernet cable from your home router to the workshop and use a wireless access point in the garage.

I use a mesh network using eero to create Wi-Fi coverage that extends to our external garage. As long as no two eero devices are farther than 50 feet apart, it works with cables.

But, you could run a length of ethernet cable to cover the 300 to 500 between two eeros.

Mesh networks are nice because there is really nothing you have to do but plug in the devices and set them up through an app. If there is a dead spot in coverage, just plug in another device. Mesh networks are reliable and easy to set up and maintain.

There are wireless alternatives. Five-hundred feet is not a long distance for directional wi-fi antennas. My work used to use a wi-fi connection between two buildings almost a mile apart. I don't have any experience with long-range Wi-Fi, though, so I can not recommend anything. I do know that it will be harder to set up because you will need a Wi-Fi bridge.

 

[Bill S]

Maybe try what this guy did to attach to Internet 2000 feet from his house?

https://electronics.stackexchange.c...nection-for-internet-and-other-data-2000-feet

 

[kyle]

Maybe something like this would work? One reviewer mentions getting good signal at 600 feet.

https://www.amazon.com/Tupavco-TP513-Antenna-2-4GHz-17dBi/dp/B008Z4I7WQ

 

[dhbarr]

Don't string copper between two buildings if you can help it. Typically you'll get some variation in grounding that causes gremlins to leak one way or the other.

Directional wireless is the easy way, but fiber media converters aren't all that spendy anymore either.

 

[n27sb]

I need to run the internet to my 3D printing workshop. I need it to go about 300-500 feet. I plan to set of a 3D printing farm and CNC workship and want it connected sp I can monitor my work from the house. Anyone have a suggestion? I am trying to avoid another DSL bill.

I just set up a TP-link AP to client system that works great. I am not an IT person or computer guy.
This system actually will work up to 2 miles but I only needed about 1000'.
You will need to buy 2. One for Access Point (Plug into your router) the other for the Client.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00P4JKQGK/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1


It will give you a circle of coverage at the AP or home device as well as a circle of coverage at the client or your shop.

If you go this route I will be happy to walk you through the setup.
This system will give you solid coverage instead of average to poor signal.

Steve

 

[CalebJ]

There are lots of good options for a wireless bridge like that. As mentioned above, I definitely wouldn't run copper if I could help it.
A few years ago, Ubiquiti was probably the best game in town with their nano station product line. There may be better/cheaper options now.

 

[neil_w]

I would try directional wireless before I started laying cable. Looks like you can get started pretty cheap.

 

[n27sb]

I saw and used the TP-Link system while in St. Lucia last year. They used it to beam internet about a mile up the mountain to get signal from the Lobby to the Villas. They make a 2.4 GHz as well as a 5 GHz so make sure you get the frequency you need. Mine is a 2.4 GHz.

 

[Marc_G]

I'm also on the directional wireless bandwagon. The product n27sb links to will likely, "get 'er done" but that same link also shows a couple higher end solutions; if it were my project I would go with the AC867 variant. Still just $70 each. Your project may need significant, reliable bandwidth and this would give it.

Please, start a thread on the printing farm project. I'd love to follow your project step by step.

 

[FredA]

Max run length on Ethernet is 384 feet as I recall -- you might be forced to go wireless.
However, wireless is likely to suffer from rain/snow/leaf fade.

 

[CalebJ]

Max run length on Ethernet is 384 feet as I recall -- you might be forced to go wireless.
However, wireless is likely to suffer from rain/snow/leaf fade.

True, but with an adequate fade margin that's not an issue. A bridge that short is easy to keep stable.

 

[heada]

Wifi with directional antenna will go the distance just fine. You can get over a mile with a Pringles can, seriously! Standard twisted pair ethernet (cat5, cat5e, cat6, etc.) is limited to 100m unless you do special stuff. Fiber is 1km unless you use different fiber (single-mode/multi-mode) and switch between longwave/shortwave ($), plus you have to have devices that support fiber on either end ($)

Standard wifi mesh devices with a 2.4Ghz yagi on both ends (good access points have replaceable antennas) should be more than good for any line-of-sight connection. An I'd go with 2.4Ghz rather than 5Ghz as the yagi's are cheaper/easier to get and 2.4Ghz has better penetration vs 5Ghz. Down side is 2.4Ghz is lower bandwidth vs 5Ghz. Unless you'll be streaming multiple 4K videos over the link, it should be OK.

 

[neil_w]

Standard twisted pair ethernet (cat5, cat5e, cat6, etc.) is limited to 100m unless you do special stuff.

Actually it's 100m at 68 degrees F. I don't know how much temperature swings affect performance, but in general when I hear 300-500 ft I'm thinking that a standard run of twisted pair is not going to cut it.

 

[CalebJ]

Honestly I'd be shocked if it doesn't actually connect on a decent ethernet cable at that distance, but I'd expect it to auto negotiate down to a lower speed. To me the issue is mostly about parking a giant lightning rod outside when there are other inexpensive options that will work perfectly.

 

[jimzcatz]

Teamviewer allows you to control your computers from the internet remotely. Free for home use. I check on all my computers from my phone

 

[Marc_G]

My view is that presuming you have two antennae, both outside, pointing at each other separated by a few hundred feet, 5Ghz is the better choice since they can be had on Amazon for $50-70 each. However @heada makes a great point about penetration, in the scenario where you want the signal to go through walls. If you have a scenario where one antenna is pointing at your shop hundreds of feet away, and you aren't using a receiver antenna, just devices on their own inside the shop, 2.4 is the way to go.

 

[CalebJ]

Yeah, I'd only look at 2.4 or 900mhz if you are either punching through walls (900 or 2.4) or directly connecting to clients (2.4).

 

[Tobor]

I don't know why people (in general) are so set on wireless tech. Sure it's convenient, but it also prone to all sorts of issues. And, it will always be less secure then a wired connection.

For less than the cost for a set of "good" Access Points in bridge mode, and much less than upgrading to a quality mesh network, you can run a Cat 6e cable. The cable run will be infinitely more reliable and definitely more secure.

You can get 500' of Cat 6e Direct Burial cable for less then $100 on Amazon.

To bury low voltage cable just make a trench 6"~12" deep using the cutting edge of a shovel, drop the cable into the trench, seat the cable to the bottom using something with a non-cutting edge like a 1"x4" of appropriate length and back fill the trench.

Edit: Oh, I forgot to mention that a wired network smokes even a good mesh network no matter which set of metrics (burst speed, overall throughput, headroom, etc...) you wish employ for comparison.

 

[CalebJ]

?
There's nothing unreliable or unstable about a secured point to point wireless connection with adequate signal. And you eliminate all concerns about lightning intrusion from the long cable run. Five hundred feet is far beyond the specified maximum for ethernet also.

If you need the link to be cabled, at least use fiber.

 

[dhbarr]

100m is the spec limit sure, but it's not like the electrons go on strike one centimeter over.

 

[CalebJ]

Right, I'd push the limit if there were no good alternatives. But given cheap, simple, effective options....

 

[heada]

Wireless networks by default, are encrypted. Wired networks by default, are not. Wireless networks can extend for kilometers with simply adding high gain directional antennas. Wired networks are certified for 100m and drop off signal and speed quickly after that. Wired networks can exceed wireless in both speed and distance but require very expensive hardware (switches, SFPs, etc.) and infrastructure (fiber cabling) at orders of magnitude higher costs.

To me, its a no-brainer to get a pair of wireless devices for connections over 100m. (as I sit in my home office building a BOM for 32x 100Gb/s inter-switch-links to give data center to data center redundant connections)

 

[Tobor]

And let the raging begin.

 

[CalebJ]

?

 

[Tobor]

Any network switch can extend the max length.

Wireless requires encryption because it is inherently insecure.

Any wired connection can be easily encrypted without adding anything to the network. It can be implemented at the OS level.

There are literally hundreds of Whitepapers regarding wireless security issues. Just run a search through Google.

And btw, I mentioned security as only one of a host of issues regarding wireless connections.

Also, no one has even mentioned the possible long term (accumilated risk) health problems of constant exposure to high frequency energies.

 

[CalebJ]

Where are you putting this network switch??

 

[CalebJ]

Don't get me wrong - if you're planning a commercial site build and two buildings five hundred feet apart that will be there for years, it should certainly be wired. Long term installation with properly buried fiber for a dead nuts reliable connection.
But a home owner connecting a building on their property for a project? Vastly different scenario. And copper shouldn't be on the table at all at that distance.

 

[Marc_G]

Hey wow! We found another reason to argue beyond just glue!

 

[Sandy H.]

Interesting thread. I would have assumed the answer was 100% hard wired, 0% wireless. I'm obviously way out of touch with modern wifi!

Having said that, is this an existing building that already has the power run or is this a complete new build? If its a new build and you have to trench and run power anyway, that might factor in to the decision. Obviously you wouldn't run the Ethernet in the same conduit as the power, but I assume you could run it in the same trench at a different depth - code would answer that for sure.

Either way, I'm going to read up on some of the suggestions above, as there is apparently much better stuff out there than I knew about.

Sandy.