Best protection against aggressive dogs

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When the dog is charging, as in the OP, it's already too late to engage the owner. Of course non-violent means of handling the mostly-reasonably-well-behaved-for-the-moment-dog-not-on-a-leash-as-required-by-law situation are best and will work most of the time. Those situations were not the topic.
 
Yes, presumably if I have to choose whether to hit a dog with my hiking stick or let it bite me, the time for de-escalation has largely escaped.
 
I've seen Bobcats and other wild animals quite a bit where I live. I have also encountered dogs that the owners have allowed to just roam the neighborhood. I take a bodyguard 380 on the walks with my leashed dogs. I carry a shield 9mm most of the time to be prepared for the various rattlesnakes, gators, bobcats, aggressive dogs and other various dangerous wildlife.
 
jqavins said:
When the dog is charging, as in the OP, it's already too late to engage the owner. Of course non-violent means of handling the mostly-reasonably-well-behaved-for-the-moment-dog-not-on-a-leash-as-required-by-law situation are best and will work most of the time. Those situations were not the topic.
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OP
“Today while on the barren frozen lake on park property, 2 people with 4 unleashed dogs walking, let one of their dogs come up to the launch site aggressively barking at my young son.”

Not exactly charging, and not necessarily a situation where hitting the dog with a stick (or something else) is the best first option. As long as the dog is barking and not biting you have options, including things that may DE-escalate the situation in your favor. Avoiding eye contact with the dog and getting your kid to slowly back away from the dog and get BEHIND you is one.
 
BABAR said:
Just claim you are a drum major or a majorette and it, um, slipped.

I know in high school I almost conked myself out a couple times. That mace was heavy.
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That is a great idea, I actually was a drum major my senior year in High School.

Go light on the mace, it can overpower other spices in the dish.
 
BABAR said:
Not sure of a “defense”, although you would be entitled to it, I hate seeing an animal suffer (even pepper spray or mace) because the owner is stupid (sort of like, “there is no such thing as an illegitimate child, simply one [or more commonly two] recklessly irresponsible quasi-adults.”). Spraying the OWNER although tempting and certainly poetic justice is probably not advisable. SPAYING the owner, preferably before they procreate, likewise tempting but in most cases not practical.

You may want to try out some of those pocket pen spy cameras, I don’t know how well they work, and I am sure there is a lot of variation in quality, but you could surreptitiously turn it on when uninvited dogs or people approach you (may want to check your local laws on this). AFTER turning it on as they, without your permission, approach, THEN get out your real phone or camera and tell the owner that you are about to take pictures to document violation of park rules (BTW, make sure your rocket launching is okay, first! Sorta like, You don’t go into a police station to report a theft carrying a loaded weapon without a permit.)

The reason for the first camera is some ill mannered people (there are other terms but this is a family forum) may threaten you if you try to film them openly. Assuming surreptitious video is legal under these circumstances, their actions may dig them a deeper hole.

The other good thing about having a body-cam on you that YOU know is documenting things is YOU are more likely to stay calm and reasonable. Ideally when you pull out your phone or camera the violator will restrain his or her dog and back off, if not you want clear continuous unedited audio and video footage that shows you being calm and rationale and the dog owner, well, not.

I also think a really good source of information (although I also believe in the tooth fairy) would be to contact your local police station and ask them how a civilian should handle such a situation. They should also be able to provide input of the legality of both announced and surreptitious video without the other’s consent. I don’t want to get YOU in trouble!
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My opinion only, it’s the owner that needs to be dealt with; I generally have a soft spot for animals, the one exception are pit bulls. I had a pit bull jump through glass in a window to get at me, but I got away since I was only feet away from my car.
 
BABAR said:
The attached link article (to me) was interesting and encouraging, although I think it would be wise to check with your local law enforcement. They may actually recommend it

Note California doesn’t allow audio. :(:(:(


I particularly liked this part

As of 2020, only five states require some police departments to wear body cameras. California, Connecticut, Florida, Nevada, and South Carolina have police body camera laws. In California, police are typically required to wear body cameras. However, police recording requires consent from all parties.



Aaahhh, yeah, right.....:rolleyes:

https://www.aircraftcompare.com/blog/body-cameras/#is-it-legal-to-wear-a-body-camera-in-public
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I know, shouldn’t quote yourself, but I am still having fun with this one.

So California requires police to wear body cameras.

So they ask the (alleged) perp if they can turn the camera on......

(Alleged) perp says, “hell, no!”

Police can’t document this (because they can’t turn camera on without permission)

Police arrest (alleged) perp and perp shows up in jail in a fairly, let’s say, rumpled state.

Now the (alleged) perp accuses police of brutality.

Police say, “the (alleged) perp wouldn’t give us permission to film the arrest.”

The (alleged) perp claims he DID give permission.

The police can’t PROVE he DENIED permission.

Is this just a stupid law or am I missing something.
 
I used to be a dog owner and still am quite comfortable with dogs.

One day, a guy asked me to leave a package at his door (or was it him who left a package there for me? doesn’t matter). He wouldn’t be home but said his dog, a German Shepard, would be there alone on a leash.

As I got out of the car and walked towards the door, the dog started barking. I walked to the door, took (or grabbed) the package and came back to the car in one long continuous movement, mostly ignoring the dog, as unfazed as I could possibly be (or act).

The dog mostly barked, made advances toward me, “touched” my arm a first time, and lightly bit my hand as I got closer to the door. I just never reacted. I took (or left) the package and walked back to my car.

The strategy here was just to stay as calm as I possibly could and act as though the dog wasn’t there, even if he bit.

Of course I also trusted the owner.
 
I've had many encounters with dogs running towards me. Back in the 80's I was a UPS driver. Something about the sound a UPS truck makes, dogs don't like. Plus, they associate the driver with the truck. (Next time a UPS truck drives through your neighborhood listen and you will hear the barking.)
People would open the door to get their package and sometimes their dog would get out. More often than not they would say, "Don't worry, he's friendly". What many don't realize is that dogs are instinctively territorial.
I got bit a few times but usually it was the little ankle biters! Big dogs would usually charge, then stop and bark.
 
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If you can't use the "most obvious" means of protection ( firearm, mace, taser, etc ), get yourself a "cane".

There are two good options . . .

The first is HICKORY, which is extremely hard and strong.

The second is a "modified" aluminum cane ( the "modification" consists of a length of Re-Bar inside the cane, with masking tape or some sort of "padding" to keep it from rattling around ) . . .

Think "skull fracture", when using either one !

Dave F.
 
I worked as an electrician years ago and always carried a can of wasp and hornet spray
A little shot of that works just as good or better than bear spray on dogs
Would probably work on the owner as well if things escalate
 
Kimber Pepper Blaster. don't leave home without it. 2 loads. save one for the idiot owner. you may need it.
 
Ez2cDave said:
If you can't use the "most obvious" means of protection ( firearm, mace, taser, etc ), get yourself a "cane".

There are two good options . . .

The first is HICKORY, which is extremely hard and strong.

The second is a "modified" aluminum cane ( the "modification" consists of a length of Re-Bar inside the cane, with masking tape or some sort of "padding" to keep it from rattling around ) . . .

Think "skull fracture", when using either one !

Dave F.
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I had to use a Maglite for protection on a call when someone attacked us. The letter we got from the lawyer was rather creative about the client being attacked with a steel pipe with lithium inserts, but fortunately the judge didn't even hear it.
 
Pem Tech said:
Yeah....
The Llama did it....
That would be an easy sell seeing that Llamas carry a knife anyway.
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Mind you, llama bites can be pretty nasty.
Dwatkins said:
NEVER I Repeat NEVER run from an aggressive animal of any kind! You trigger them into thinking your dinner on the run.
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Dinner outrunning them, if you're VERY sure you can. If you're VERY sure you can then it's preferable to standing and having to punt the tiny, yippy thing.
 
BABAR said:
I also think a really good source of information (although I also believe in the tooth fairy) would be to contact your local police station and ask them how a civilian should handle such a situation. They should also be able to provide input of the legality of both announced and surreptitious video without the other’s consent. I don’t want to get YOU in trouble!
Click to expand...

Hopefully the state laws are better where the OP is. PA's video recording laws are among the worst in the nation... you cannot video anyone in public without their consent - its a 2 party state. Heck, even though its theoretically legal to video the police in their duties, in practice, your butt is going down to the station and tell it to the judge.
 
Bill S said:
Hopefully the state laws are better where the OP is. PA's video recording laws are among the worst in the nation... you cannot video anyone in public without their consent - its a 2 party state. Heck, even though its theoretically legal to video the police in their duties, in practice, your butt is going down to the station and tell it to the judge.
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Although the Supreme Court has never specifically discussed the right to record, the 1st, 3rd, 5th, 7th, 9th, and 11th U.S. Circuit Courts of Appeals have all held that the First Amendment plainly protects the filming of officers and public. PA is in the 3rd district so yes, you can record video while in public in PA even though it is a 2-party state.
 
Salt in a 12 gauge used to work to keep kids of the railroad tracks in PA.
 
heada said:
Although the Supreme Court has never specifically discussed the right to record, the 1st, 3rd, 5th, 7th, 9th, and 11th U.S. Circuit Courts of Appeals have all held that the First Amendment plainly protects the filming of officers and public. PA is in the 3rd district so yes, you can record video while in public in PA even though it is a 2-party state.
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Interesting. I wish it were explicitly stated that its legal though. PA has got some really goofy laws here. Its more of the same old "you'll beat the rap, but you get to take the ride downtown first" situation. Heck, many police around here are still ignorant of the fact that open carry is legal (except Philly and Pittsburg), even though its been legal for years.
 
This looked practical

https://www.wikihow.com/Handle-a-Dog-Attack
I liked the idea of throwing something to the dog for it to bite on while you make a slow and steady getaway.

reminds me of the story of the two guys hiking in Yellowstone.

they are in a field and see a Grizzly Bear charging at then from 200 yards away.

one of them throws down his pack and starts putting on running shoes.

his partner looks at him and says, “Are you crazy? You can’t outrun a Grizzly!”

the other finishes lacing up and replies, “I don’t need to outrun the Grizzly, I just need to outrun you!”
 

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