2nd bad can of Rustoleum 2X

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The problem with 2x gloss is titanium dioxide [and VOC's]. This is what gives white it's white.
It's in many paints as a binder for other tints. But with white it's the only one.
The difference between Flat...Semi and gloss is the grind of Titanium.

In theory Ti is ground like small plates [fish scales] as it dries they overlay each other bonding together. The smaller they are, the tighter they bond overlapping, giving a glossier finish.

Think of sandpaper and difference between 100 grit and 600 grit. one is much finer grit than the other.

Same for paints. Flat is heavier grind....high gloss is the finest .

Back to the issue, now that you know how it works. There is a special high gloss paper used for testing. I called Sherwin Williams who makes Krlylon and spoke with a chemist in research. Sprayed 2x white gloss on said paper sent it in for analysis.

He called back explaining the above. The problem is Ti getting into cans that is not ground enough so the finish looks like sand in it OR the cans have been exposed to below freezing and the solids which settle in bottom have aa reaction crystalizing the Ti . Same results when sprayed. U shake the can clumps of crystallized Ti don't break up enough and us end up with sand finish.

He took batch numbers off my cans and tracked the shipping. My cans sat overnight in a truckstop .that night Atlanta had freezing condition so the paint went bad.
You may keep it in ideal conditions, but where it's been stored and during shipping, before the stores get it.....who knows.
Gloss white has the highest content of Ti so it reacts the worst....now u know "the rest of the story"!

I used to do warrant work for SW dealing with all types of faulty coatings, so I knew what to do/call to get to the bottom of it. :)

And yes its due to reformulation and VOc's. The industrial brand is exempt from EPA and uses old school liquids less prone to freezing issues compared to the cheaper consumer brand.
I'm not defending SWP just letting other know there is a real issue with white and others loaded with Ti.

Other brands may use different methods, and have zero, or fewer issues. Krylov is sold at discount outlets and as such let the 'buyer be ware'.


PS Now I only buy it during spring and summer for use later, since doing this no issues with whites.
 
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I had all of those problems before switching to Duplicolor lacquer. Still got the occasional bad spray can though. Finally bought a Paasche HVLP touchup paint gun and am using it with Duplicolor paints in the quart cans. Its a bit more work cleaning the gun but the results are well worth it. The lacquer doesnt crinkle and it dries fast and is not sticky afterwards. Recoat anytime. Its worth the investment.


https://www.paascheairbrush.com/product/hg-10/
 
I had all of those problems before switching to Duplicolor lacquer. Still got the occasional bad spray can though. Finally bought a Paasche HVLP touchup paint gun and am using it with Duplicolor paints in the quart cans. Its a bit more work cleaning the gun but the results are well worth it. The lacquer doesnt crinkle and it dries fast and is not sticky afterwards. Recoat anytime.
Second for Duplicolor Paint Shop Paints. Short of HS Urethane's, I swear by Paint Shop. I have over half of my flee painted with it, Much of it white, and no problems.
 
FWIW I've had very good luck with Rusto 2x so far.

Gloss white has the highest content of Ti so it reacts the worst....now u know "the rest of the story"!
I'm getting more and more tempted to switch to semi-gloss, for (perhaps) slightly reduced chance of problems.

PS Now I only buy it during spring and summer for use later, since doing this no issues with whites.
Interesting. I guess I should restock ASAP before winter hits.
 
Interesting thread. I've use a lot of rusto 2x with no problems for a lot of different projects besides rockets. It has become my go-to paint the last couple years. Maybe I'm just lucky though.:)
 
I have a fair amount of spray painting equipment; HVLP gun, touch up gun, 2-Iwata airbrushes and have sprayed enamel, lacquer, epoxy, latex, etc.
Decided to be lazy and paint my first HPR with Rusto 2X. It seems to me that this paint works well when warm. Luckily I live in Arizona! Used 2X primer; grey for first coat then white for 2nd coat. Wet sanded primer with 400 grit first and 400 then 600 on final coat.
Used 2X high gloss black and white. Three light coats of each. Found using Rusto Comfort Grip very useful.
Only problem I had was one run on a fin (my fault). After a few days drying it sanded easily and then re-painted with no issue.
Rattle cans need to be shaken a lot; minimum 2 minutes at first then frequently while painting. They have a lot of solvents; the reason light coats are important and also the reason to follow guidelines for subsequent coats.
I paint giant scale RC warbirds with Behr exterior latex. Costs $3 for 1/2 pint and Home Depot will color match samples for free. It works fantastic!
For my next HPR I'm going to try Duplicolor Metalcast paint. Read that it's tricky to work with and very light coats are critical.
Here's a picture of my Madcow Black Brant II painted with Rusto 2X and a picture of my FW-190 painted with latex.
Rocket.jpgSist FW-190.jpg
 
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I use regular Rustoleum Enamel (now called "Rustoleum Protective Enamel), works great. Don't know what the deal is with 2X, but since the regular enamel works so well, why change? Occasionally, a nozzle will clog, I just replace it. Rustoleum will send you a bunch if you ask nicely.

Of course, I still use lacquer sometimes, either old-formula Krylon, Dupli-Color, or Testors. For scale military colors, Tamiya has a the best selection I've found, so many shades of green! For primer, *always* Dupli-Color or 3M Bondo.
 
I used Rustoleum for years with great results. About two years ago something changed. I started running into issues with cracking, crinkling, poor adhesion and a couple of instances where the paint wouldn't dry even when left for several days.

My process never changed, Paints are stored indoors. Paint and the item to be painted are both warm to the touch. If it was warm outside I'd set everything in the sun for a while to let it warm up. If it was below 80F I'd warm the paint can in warm water and use a hair dryer to warm the item being painted. Paints were shaken for at least a couple of minutes, Usually more. Always used light coats and stuck to the recoat windows. If I couldn't apply the next coat within 15 mins. I waited at least a week.

After fighting this for almost a year and buying replacement can of paint, I finally gave up and threw all my Rustoleum in the trash. I switched to Krylon for most and Duplicolor for the items where I wanted a special color or some type of metallic.

I had a Phoenix that I put together and painted with normal Rustoleum white on a warm summer day. Did two light coats about 15 mins. apart then one medium coat. Left the rocket in a warm shop for 24 hrs. Thinking it was dry the next day I grabbed it and the paint was still wet. I left it sit for several more days and it never cured. The paint remained soft and had a slick almost oily feel to it. I left it sit for weeks before I decided to start scrapping it off and stated over.

I don't know what changed with them but I won't even consider their products for the most basic of projects.
 
Rustoleum changed their formula a few years ago to be in compliance with new EPA guidelines regarding lower VOC solvents. Paint does seem to take a long time to dry. Temperature and humidity are factors in curing and results.
 
I used Rustoleum for years with great results. About two years ago something changed. I started running into issues with cracking, crinkling, poor adhesion and a couple of instances where the paint wouldn't dry even when left for several days.

My process never changed, Paints are stored indoors. Paint and the item to be painted are both warm to the touch. If it was warm outside I'd set everything in the sun for a while to let it warm up. If it was below 80F I'd warm the paint can in warm water and use a hair dryer to warm the item being painted. Paints were shaken for at least a couple of minutes, Usually more. Always used light coats and stuck to the recoat windows. If I couldn't apply the next coat within 15 mins. I waited at least a week.

After fighting this for almost a year and buying replacement can of paint, I finally gave up and threw all my Rustoleum in the trash. I switched to Krylon for most and Duplicolor for the items where I wanted a special color or some type of metallic.

I had a Phoenix that I put together and painted with normal Rustoleum white on a warm summer day. Did two light coats about 15 mins. apart then one medium coat. Left the rocket in a warm shop for 24 hrs. Thinking it was dry the next day I grabbed it and the paint was still wet. I left it sit for several more days and it never cured. The paint remained soft and had a slick almost oily feel to it. I left it sit for weeks before I decided to start scrapping it off and stated over.

I don't know what changed with them but I won't even consider their products for the most basic of projects.
That’s a bummer. I haven’t seen that with Regular rusto enamel, though I almost never paint over 80F. Can is always at room temp, between 65-75, model is anywhere from 25F to 75F. I wonder if it’s temp related, humidity related, or maybe the phase of the moon? 😉
 
You're having the same problem with Rustoleum as I had with Duplicolor. It went from my paint of choice to a bunch of crap after I had to throw out brand new cans that wouldn't work.
 
I’m having a very difficult time this spring with spray painting. First, I can’t find the correct color Army Green for my Honest John and V2. Now I’m attempting to paint the Little Joe II and the white Rustoleum 2X paint is coming out of the nozzle like dust! Can was shaken, warmed in hot water. Same thing happened with the Rustoleum camo green paint that wasn’t the right color anyway. It’s 65 degrees and no humidity. I’m at my wits end on finishing these rockets. Anyone have any advice?


I had some bad cans of WHITE rustoleum 2x also. Dry spray. Check the batch number and try a different run of cans if possible.
 
In my opinion after reading all these paint problems I will be going back to Testors paint. I to fell sucker for Rustoleum 2X paint and primer. Hay for the price you get a lot of paint compared to the small cans of Testor paint. Think about it, are we looking for quality or quantity. The rockets are models. The Rustoleum is for desks, chairs, porcelain flower vases ect. I’m not going to store my paperwork in my rockets or sit on them or put flowers in them. I have building model cars, semi trucks and rockets back in the day and all I ever used was Testors model paints with no problem. That’s because they are made for models like rockets. Even the Duplicolor color paints are used for the automotive industry not for models. There are so many colors offered in those little rattle cans and lacquer with lacquer, enamel with enamel. I seen in Hobby Lobby that the cans say lacquer but also say Rustoleum for models. Yea the same price you would pay for a large can of Rustoleum but is it worth all the headache to experiment with all these other cans hopping there is no reaction between paints? I have several Rustoleum 2X paint colors all new and a couple of cans in Krylon that I will finish off what I started, but this will be the last that I will be buying this stuff. Model paints are for models and I will leave the other stuff for people to sit on or drive it.
 
In my opinion after reading all these paint problems I will be going back to Testors paint. I to fell sucker for Rustoleum 2X paint and primer. Hay for the price you get a lot of paint compared to the small cans of Testor paint. Think about it, are we looking for quality or quantity. The rockets are models. The Rustoleum is for desks, chairs, porcelain flower vases ect. I’m not going to store my paperwork in my rockets or sit on them or put flowers in them. I have building model cars, semi trucks and rockets back in the day and all I ever used was Testors model paints with no problem. That’s because they are made for models like rockets. Even the Duplicolor color paints are used for the automotive industry not for models. There are so many colors offered in those little rattle cans and lacquer with lacquer, enamel with enamel. I seen in Hobby Lobby that the cans say lacquer but also say Rustoleum for models. Yea the same price you would pay for a large can of Rustoleum but is it worth all the headache to experiment with all these other cans hopping there is no reaction between paints? I have several Rustoleum 2X paint colors all new and a couple of cans in Krylon that I will finish off what I started, but this will be the last that I will be buying this stuff. Model paints are for models and I will leave the other stuff for people to sit on or drive it.

I have never had a good can of Rustoleum... It's mainly because of the low VOC requirements in many states.

Tamiya paints are very good, but tiny cans and expensive... no good for big rockets unless you are wealthy...

Get This stuff, not as many colors available but I have had very good luck with it. It's not the same as the Krylon you get at Small*Warts

https://www.fullsource.com/krylon-industrial-products/
 
In my opinion after reading all these paint problems I will be going back to Testors paint. I to fell sucker for Rustoleum 2X paint and primer. Hay for the price you get a lot of paint compared to the small cans of Testor paint. Think about it, are we looking for quality or quantity. The rockets are models. The Rustoleum is for desks, chairs, porcelain flower vases ect. I’m not going to store my paperwork in my rockets or sit on them or put flowers in them. I have building model cars, semi trucks and rockets back in the day and all I ever used was Testors model paints with no problem. That’s because they are made for models like rockets. Even the Duplicolor color paints are used for the automotive industry not for models. There are so many colors offered in those little rattle cans and lacquer with lacquer, enamel with enamel. I seen in Hobby Lobby that the cans say lacquer but also say Rustoleum for models. Yea the same price you would pay for a large can of Rustoleum but is it worth all the headache to experiment with all these other cans hopping there is no reaction between paints? I have several Rustoleum 2X paint colors all new and a couple of cans in Krylon that I will finish off what I started, but this will be the last that I will be buying this stuff. Model paints are for models and I will leave the other stuff for people to sit on or drive it.
I agree with many of your points. But the issue with compatibility/unexpected reactions can exist with any product, not just the cheap crap.

I've got a few cans of Rustoleum 2X stuff and they work, just not very well. I'll finish them up, but will experiment with other brands that have more opaque finishes. It's no brainer to pay 75% more for a can of spray pain if it has 200% the coverage ability (all else being equal).
 
It's interesting, I would say coverage is the least of the issues with the Rusto 2x. Overall I've had good enough luck with it. I just don't do enough painting to want to start experimenting, so until I really start having problems with the Rusto I'll stick with it.
 
I echo most of the comments so far. I just tried the 2x paints for the first time last week. But I'll try Montana cans next and after that hopefully I'll have my compressor and mini HVLP gun setup going and use the Duplicolor quart cans of lacquer.
 
It's interesting, I would say coverage is the least of the issues with the Rusto 2x. Overall I've had good enough luck with it. I just don't do enough painting to want to start experimenting, so until I really start having problems with the Rusto I'll stick with it.
The only non-coverage issue I've had with Rustoleum's 2X stuff is that its grey primer seems to never dry/not sand well.

When using the 2X cans, it's virtually impossible to get fully opaque coverage in just one coat. Any time I've tried to "save time" by getting full coverage with just one coat, it's resulted in drips.
 
I didn’t think there was any quality spray paint that was really intended for a single coat.
I'm not sure if that's true or not, but I've used plenty of spray paints before where one coat would at least fully cover the surface beneath it without resulting in drips or runs.
 
I will have to use the Rustoleum 2X paint and primer but I will still need to prime first. Customer support for Rustoleum said I didn’t need to prime but as we all know on most of our rockets when you prim first there will be spots of paper fibers lifting from sanding before priming. I told their support that’s why priming Is first needed. You can’t just paint over this because the rough fibers will show through. I don’t have any extra materials to try a test on but not that willing to experiment with is this compatible or will it wrinkle or crack or bla bla bla. I have several cans of Trstors spray paint with a sticker price on it for a $1.99. Well like those days are gone! Like model kits used to be around $10.00 now mid $20 or $30 and up. Tamiya paint is about the best but I will agree $10.00 is a little much for a small can. I was all gunho over the Rustoleum 2X paint until I started reading all the reviews of to many problems with it especially with clear or gloss coat screwing up all the hard work going into the rockets. I had one can of Testors cracking on second coat but my fault. I didn’t wait long enough to recoat as instructions indicated. I’m just hoping when I paint with this 2X it don’t screw up my build and even then what do I now use for a clear coat to protect the decals?
 
Here is another question? I see a lot of rocket builders are using the Rustoleum 2in1 filler sandable primer. I talked with Rustoleum about using 2X paint over this. I also explained that some of my rockets contain plastic parts such as nose cones, transitions and so on. Customer support highly recommend not to use this because it’s not compatible with plastics and it’s geared toward the automotive (metal). They said after a few days the paint can still be tacky and will not dry because of the chemicals the plastic its made out of. I will need to mix paints on some of my fins like the Nike rocket. The orange in 2X looks more like a rustic orange. The only thing that comes close to orange is Rustoleum enamel for metal or, yep Krylon. Has anyone ever had problems with 2in1 not adhering to plastic such as nose cones/ transitions?
 
I avoid the Rustoleum 2X Primer, last time I experienced paint herpes on a rocket was when I topcoated over 2X Primer.

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But I've never had a paint issue IF I use Rustoleum automotive primer 1st, then dry sand that, then topcoat. Sometimes I topcoat with Testor's, sometimes with Rustoleum, sometimes both on the same rocket. I have also used Rustoleum 2X as a top coat over the Rustoleum automotive primer... and not had any issues.

I have yet to have paint issues when using the above combo.

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Has anyone ever had problems with 2in1 not adhering to plastic such as nose cones/ transitions?

I used 2X primer on this spool, and the paint is flaking off the plastic straw I'm using as a Kevlar conduit... and, as previously discussed, when I top coated over the 2X primer, paint herpes occurred.

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