Attention HPR Rocket Manufacturers. Label your Kits!

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For my money, Binder Designs is the gold-standard in terms of packaging, labeling, and branding.

To answer Dr. Wogz,

1.) All HRP shipments do not come with a packing slip.
2.) All shipments do come with a return address. But that is only a little help if you're ordered more than one kit from the same maker, or if they ship multiple kits in one box.
3.) Record of purchase, account summaries do exist. In some cases they are easy to access--in others more difficult. Still no help if you order frequently or have more than one kit in a box. And why should the customer have to do the detective work? Make it easy for the customer to enjoy your product and order more.
4.) As I explained--I travel a lot on business. When you order several kits, and are gone for weeks it can be hard to just remember. Plus some HPR makers have very long delivery times...not uncommon to wait weeks or months on orders.

Including a packing slip, or a simple printed sheet of paper could save an hour of searching or more. Am I really asking too much here?
 
Originally I did not put anything in my RC RG kits to denote what it was, since I only do direct sales via paypal, I figured people know what they ordered, their paypal says what they ordered if they want to look it up, and they are going to build and fly it right away because it only takes a couple of hours to put one together. I finally realized people are not like me and might sit on it for a while, so now I include a sheet with the kit name and some notes on how to safely upack the kit :) My instructions have always been online since it is easier to update and view them in full color large size without the cost of printing.


Frank
 
I always prefer machine parts or commercial sample as obfuscatory lingo, I once got a knife I ordered from Italy that was labeled, "kitchen handle sample"

Instead of model rockets they could label the boxes "model airplane parts".....


Having fun here..
 
Ok, I take back my snarky comment. I see now what lowga is saying. I was also taken aback the first time I opened a box o' fiberglass from one of the notable sellers. If said vendor packs multiple kits in one box like this, then that would be annoying and confusing.

I picked up a HPR kit from Apogee. Many of the individual parts themselves are labeled.
 
I think I have a second career in my future. I can become a highly paid consultant for the Fortune 500, introducing them to the miracle of "serving your customers." This unique and novel concept will be fodder for a business/leadership book deal (Amazon best seller in its category), a lucrative stint with a Speaker's Bureau, and of course, the obligatory podcast.

Now I understand why I scan and bag my own groceries, from companies that work their employees for 39 hours a week while paying no benefits and raking in massive profits.

All I asked for was a freaking packing slip. Now I'm seriously considering leaving this hobby and wondering why I ever rejoined it.

MODERATOR: Is there a way to unsubscribe for a thread that you started yourself?
 
Now, now Les, take a deep breath before doing anything rash. Do you really want to walk away from this?
hojo31261__72561.1504137786.1280.1280.jpg


and this?

honestj55__82247.1505167605.1280.1280.png


and this?

0930191911.jpg

Feeling better?:D
 
...

All I asked for was a freaking packing slip. Now I'm seriously considering leaving this hobby and wondering why I ever rejoined it.

MODERATOR: Is there a way to unsubscribe for a thread that you started yourself?

This thread is just another example of something my Mama always said. "Posting on TRF is like a box of chocolates. You never know what you're gonna get." ;)

FWIW, I agree that a packing slip in a box of parts is not too much to ask.

low, don't go !
 
< kidding mode on >They make vitamins that help with memory retention. < kidding mode off >

Your prices aren't low because you use self check out. They're low because they've been that way. They put self check out in place to stop hiring folks to work the cash registers, thus saving the company ~50k annually, per team member... That adds up pretty quickly. Wal-mart has 4,759 stores. Figure 6 team members, 2 shifts, $50k annually, that's $2.85 Billion dollars. There isn't any customer service associated with these self checkouts.

They don't care about customer service. They care about the bottom line - the almighty dollar. Today's world is not about catering to the customer anymore. It's about catering to the stockholders, who only care about the company's bottom line.
 
Thanks Les for the reply, I was not aware, or had made an assumption, which, to me made sense. As I've done purchasing & receiving for a few companies, this was always the norm. And, all my online rocket orders, so far, have come with either a packing slip or the kit was clearly marked. I guess I'm not 'HPR' enough! :D

And at Mike (Fisher): the Binder Stealth Jr. was one of my first MPR / HPR kits.. I was blown away at how you package it!! So I bought a few more! I'll 2nd the "gold standard"!! :D
 
Not all HPR manufacturers are guilty of this. Some do a great job of labeling packages. I'm not naming names to avoid hurt feelings--but as a customer, I find the practice inexcusable.
Do, by all means, do name names. It doesn't do much good to rant against an industry where many suppliers are not offenders. Spell it out: "I'm talking to you, Rockets-Я-Us. And you, Rocket Land." Don't worry about hurting their feelings.

I don’t think it’s a good idea to start labeling boxes in the shipping systems with pictures of rockets. It can cause undue attention and unwanted questions from shipping companies.
OK, that's fair, no pictures on the outside.
We have thought about individual packaging inside of the boxes and found that most customers would prefer the nesting and less expensive shipping instead of individual packaging.
How much expense does it create to print a single sheet on the office printer with the company name and logo, the name of the rocket, and a picture, then toss it in the box with the parts? if it costs you an extra dollar (which I doubt) that's insignificant compared to the price of most HPR kits. If the price goes up a dollar, fine. If you pay the dollar for the branding and marketing practice, even better (from my point of view).

Would a packing slip be too much to ask for?
Or as above
And yes, I've sent e-mails to the companies.
Good, but there's nothing wrong with a public shaming on top of that.

This is a GREAT Monday morning read!!! LOL I'm chuckling because on our end, we HAD to start labeling individual parts even. Not as much to help the customer, but to keep our scatter brains organized so WE know what is what!!
I notice one of my kits in your build pile. :) Just to be clear to potential customers viewing this thread, he's not talking about my kits. We provide a printed instruction manual and all parts are sub-packed in an orderly fashion and can be opened individually as the build progresses. And they come with decals that even if you lost the instruction set, you could identify the kit by the name/logo.
Originally I did not put anything in my RC RG kits to denote what it was, since I only do direct sales via paypal, I figured people know what they ordered, their paypal says what they ordered if they want to look it up, and they are going to build and fly it right away because it only takes a couple of hours to put one together. I finally realized people are not like me and might sit on it for a while, so now I include a sheet with the kit name and some notes on how to safely upack the kit :) My instructions have always been online since it is easier to update and view them in full color large size without the cost of printing.
Good for you three, and I'm sure there are others doing it right.

Your prices aren't low because you use self check out. They're low because they've been that way. They put self check out in place to stop hiring folks to work the cash registers, thus saving the company ~50k annually, per team member... That adds up pretty quickly. Wal-mart has 4,759 stores. Figure 6 team members, 2 shifts, $50k annually, that's $2.85 Billion dollars. There isn't any customer service associated with these self checkouts.
Yes, this, mostly. Saving those billions may result in lower prices, or at least in slower price rises, if the market is cometitive enough. It's worth it for a huge company like Wal Mart to keep only $2B of that $2.85B (numbers out of my backside) if it means more customers coming in the door.

But that's beside the point. It's not going to cost an HPR kit maker-seller billions, or even thousands to put an in-office printed sheet in each box. Not even hundreds unless their volume is greater than I suspect.
 
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Would a packing slip be too much to ask for? And yes, I've sent e-mails to the companies.

Honestly, I'm disappointed because of a rare break in my work schedule that would have allowed for me to complete an important rocketry project in time for a high-ceiling opportunity. Instead, I wasted hours identifying kits--and the delay may be the difference between finishing it in time and not.

That's a lot of disappointment that could have been solved with a packing slip.

Yes. A packing slip is not too much to ask for IMHO. However, if that qualifies as "a lot of disappointment" for you I'd suggest evaluating your life and understanding just how good you have it apparently. ;)
 
Dave--I am blessed, and thank god for that everyday. As problems go, this one is trivial.

I did a poor job of explaining the complete situation. Let me try again before losing total faith in my fellow man.

Been working on a minimum-diameter project called "Blackout" for several months. Working through the simulations, and several alternative designs. The rocket will reach mach + speeds, and travel way beyond our normal club field's waiver. For me, that means that my best chance to fly the bird is at Bama Blastoff in early October. They have a 30,000 foot waiver.

Once that was worked out, I began assembling parts from several manufacturers. The majority of the parts were going to come from two kits that are going to be kit-bashed into a single rocket.

I travel about 200 days a year on business. Often gone for weeks at a time. When I returned from each trip, I would open any boxes that arrived, inspect them, and return them to their original shipping boxes. These are labeled with a black marker and placed on a shelf until I have time to build.

Also ordered other kits to build in the future. Either because they were on-sale, or I feared that they would be pulled from inventory, the firm would go out of business, etc. HPR kits are often available only for a short time. These too were opened when I was home, inspected, and returned to their box. Box was labeled with a sharpie, and put on the shelf.

One of my two key kits arrived months after it was ordered. It was also shipped in a single box with another kit that I had ordered from that maker (weeks after the original kit order.) The parts for each rocket were placed in the box together with no attempt to separate their components. Given that they were similar in size, and appearance, sorting them out is a chore.

No packing slip. No packaging. Zilch. Return address label only. Also no apology or explanation for why the kit took months to receive. (Also no indication that it was out-of-stock when ordered either)

Fast forward to last weekend. Only my second full weekend off since last Thanksgiving. With the launch date rapidly approaching, I had time to assemble my project, ground test, and be ready to fly at Bama Blastoff. But just barely.

Sat down at the bench, and begin opening boxes--starting with the "two rockets in the same box". An hour or so later, I had finally sorted out which kit was which--separated them, and placed them in new boxes.

Started opening the remaining kits, looking for the 2nd rocket that I needed to start work. Five boxes-from three different makers. None of them contained labels, packing slips, instructions--etc. My preference for minimum diameter rockets made identification of the correct kit even more difficult. Brought in the laptop and started searching past orders. That works great for some makers, whose shopping carts allow you to view past orders.

But others don't have this feature. Hmmm...let's pull up PayPal and see if I can sort it out from there. No joy. OK, let's search all the rockets that are close from their web site and see if I can remember what was ordered....

Hours later, my build evening was gone, and I hadn't applied the first drop of epoxy or even washed the fiberglass.

The next day, I end up working late. Spent another hour or so before finally getting everything identified and labeled. Washed the parts, and laid everything out on the bench to build.

Next morning, office manager has a problem with her aging mother. Client has a problem, and we spend an entire day working on that. Near the end of the day, another client calls with their own crisis. 5PM turns into 10PM.

My point is that some people have very little time for their hobbies. That time can be spent building a project, flying, and enjoying the hobby or it can be spent doing detective work.

Can I do things differently? Sure--and I will. My wife had already suggested printing out pictures of any kits and the order form, and putting them into a file. When the kit comes in, transfer that into the box, and put it on the shelf.

Also, I won't be ordering more kits for months--because my build pile is already too large.

And the black sharpie will be hard at work whenever something new comes in. As someone suggested, pencil marking individual parts isn't even a bad idea.

But I think the manufacturers could also help. A packing slip, a label, maybe even instructions for those of us still new to the hobby. Something. Recognize that while your time is precious, so is that of your customers.

With any luck, I'll be able to attend one day of this weekend's launch. (Gotta work of course) and I'll fly some low-power stuff, and try to enjoy a nice day at a launch. It will be a welcome change from the past year. But I won't be flying that sleek new bird that I've been waiting months to complete. And there won't be an opportunity to fly it until 2020. Maybe I shouldn't be disappointed about that--but I am.
 
I have to agree that marking each part during the initial inspection and reboxing of each order will solve most of your problems. I also agree that is shouldn't be your problem. Or mine, so thanks for the warning; when the day comes that I"m ordering kits that arrive like this I'll be forewarned and thus forearmed.

First world problems? Yes! I'm lucky enough to live in the first world, and I'm not sorry.
 
Labor is one of the most limiting factors in a small business. Time is the other but they kind of play into each other.

If it saves 5 minutes to not label every part in a kit or hold my hand as I build it.... I'm OK with that.

You ran into a problem due to your situation. No need to blame others for it. Find a solution that you control.
 
Sure. And it saves a few minutes at the drive-thru window when they fail to include the burger that you ordered, or to remove the mustard as your requested. But you should "find a solution that you can control" and not blame it on the business owner or employee.

You're right. I'm "lucky" that someone makes a kit that I can spend hundreds of dollars on, wait months to receive, and then spend more time trying to figure out which kit it is. And for the last time, NO ONE is discussing individual parts. This is an entire kit, stuffed into a box without so much as a "Thank you for your order."

Let's end this thread now. It's my problem. I'll fix it.
 
I'm sure an internet tantrum will inspire someone else to solve your problem.

I'm sure that when a kit manufacturer sits down and decides how to process their orders and kits the first guy they think of is " how can we make sure all the customers who order a dozen kits and let them sit in boxes for months or longer before looking at them are going to remember which kit it is when they don't take the time to track their own shipments or inventory of kits? we need to make sure we spend tons and tons of time on orders to keep them from being inconvenienced."

I'm sure this is the biggest concern for them and they just haven't been able to figure out a solution until you came forward.
 
It's a packing slip.

I would hope that any business owner would want their customers to be happy with the product that they purchased. I have owned and ran a small business for twenty years. If a customer called and asked me to do something so trivial, regardless of how unique their situation was--I'd be more than happy to oblige.

It's called customer service. This is why Chik-Fil-A has lines around the corner, and Taco Bell, McDonalds, Arbys, and others don't. Sure it costs them a bit more in labor, but they make up for it in customer loyalty.

This is why there are entire threads devoted to praising companies like Jolly Logic (John Beans is a rock star), or Binder Designs, Apogee, and others. They think about their customers and they go the extra mile.
 
I thought it was standard practice for companies to include a packing list or at least the pull sheet, with someone's initials on it to denote they've done their bit..

Or, at the very least some form of confirmation that this is what you ordered, and this is what we packed.. "And should there be a discrepancy, please contact us as soon as possible.."
 
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