AeroTech Open Thread

[crossfire]

Why would you attach a shock cord to the forward closure? Sounds like a bad idea. Plenty of other places/ways to attach a shock cord.

It's a great place to attach your recovery cord. Plus it's kind of a back up for a motor retainer

 

[Luzwingnut]

I concur, Bungie64... my point exactly. I just started a thread with this very concern. Must be a supply back-up in the system somewhere...

My question is when you will be carrying 38/720, 29/40-120, and 24/60 casea again. As well as any other case from 38mm on down. I have been checking your webstore and still only find 18mm cases. This question quite possibly has been answered already but too many posts to read to find the answer I am looking for. Thank you for your time.

 

[Nytrunner]

They're probably filling vendor orders before their own web stock.

Check Wildman, CSrocketry, OffweGo, etc....

 

[Luzwingnut]

Thanks, Nyrunner.

Looked over the "Aerotech Open Thread" and found another forum member raising this very concern on/or about Jan. 25, 2019.

https://www.rocketryforum.com/threads/aerotech-open-thread.125657/page-94

Seems odd that a product such as the Aerotech 29mm hardware case, a mainstay in the MPR field with F, G, and baby H power systems, would NOT be better stocked and/or supply chain is not better managed.

"We can sell you the rocket, but you'd like to purchase the motor, too??"
(Kinda like going camping and forgetting the matches).

 

[Nytrunner]

If you read over the thread (yeah that's big task lol), you'll learn more of why there's a hardware shortage. From fabricators exiting the business, to backed up vendor orders, etc...

Most of their orders come through the vendors across the country, so it does make sense to try and keep them supplied as best they can. It's a small hobby with very unpredictable logistics, so some patience helps.

 

[Luzwingnut]

Fair enough.

Nyrunner?
May I share your reply and explanation on my current thread at "Aerotech 29/40-120 OOS?"
Thanks.

 

[Bungie64]

Nytrunner, I have checked all sites I can find and no one has any. Apogee, Sirius rocketry, Wildman, Chris' rocket supply, balsa machining services, Off we go..etc
They simply aren't producing any. For my 38/360 case I had to get the parts from 3 seperate sources at a higher cost juat to get what I needed. The case and adapter system I got from Apogee, the rear closure from Balsa machining services and the front closure and seal disk from a guy on facebook.

 

[3stoogesrocketry]

Thanks, Nyrunner.

Looked over the "Aerotech Open Thread" and found another forum member raising this very concern on/or about Jan. 25, 2019.

https://www.rocketryforum.com/threads/aerotech-open-thread.125657/page-94

Seems odd that a product such as the Aerotech 29mm hardware case, a mainstay in the MPR field with F, G, and baby H power systems, would NOT be better stocked and/or supply chain is not better managed.

"We can sell you the rocket, but you'd like to purchase the motor, too??"
(Kinda like going camping and forgetting the matches).

Aerotech's main problem has been production of hardware for a while now. Why they have not found a shop that can keep up with production ( or AT pony up and by x amount of hardware ahead of time instead of waiting till y amount of orders are placed and then they are rushed to get z amount made ) is beyond me.
Rant off , and no , this is not a bash against AT.

 

[jjwb22101]

If you read over the thread (yeah that's big task lol), you'll learn more of why there's a hardware shortage. From fabricators exiting the business, to backed up vendor orders, etc...

Most of their orders come through the vendors across the country, so it does make sense to try and keep them supplied as best they can. It's a small hobby with very unpredictable logistics, so some patience helps.

I try to be patient, but when my onsite vendor has had zero 29 or 38mm reloads for the last 6 months, and backorders take 6+ months to fill, I start to lose my patience. For example, my school placed an order in September for motors for our competition (6 G75's and 6 I600's), and the order just came in yesterday. This has pushed the schedule for this project back a full two months, and we are now going to be hard-pressed to get everything tested before the competition.

 

[afadeev]

I keep re-reading the same complaint template in these threads: Vendor-X doesn't have everything I want, therefore it's AT (or CTI, or some other manufacturer's) fault.

Have you explored online sources as an alternative?
Vendor / supply-chain management is a skill, and going with the first one you find nearby may, or more frequently may not, be the best course of action.

I try to be patient, but when my onsite vendor has had zero 29 or 38mm reloads for the last 6 months, and backorders take 6+ months to fill, I start to lose my patience.

Perhaps, there is something not right with your onsite vendor?

For example, my school placed an order in September for motors for our competition (6 G75's and 6 I600's), and the order just came in yesterday. This has pushed the schedule for this project back a full two months, and we are now going to be hard-pressed to get everything tested before the competition.

Wildman, BMS, and Sirius both have G75 and I600 motors in stock:
https://wildmanrocketry.com/search?q=G75
https://www.balsamachining.com/
https://www.siriusrocketry.biz/ishop/aerotech-g75j-10a-29mm-reload-kit-hazmat-303.html

a

 

[Luzwingnut]

Contacted APOGEE ROCKETS and was referred to their blog posting concerning this issue:

https://www.apogeerockets.com/index.php?main_page=blog&cat=Latest News&bID=91

 

[rharshberger]

Contacted APOGEE ROCKETS and was referred to their blog posting concerning this issue:

https://www.apogeerockets.com/index.php?main_page=blog&cat=Latest News&bID=91

Your link goes to a general blog header, not a specific section. The "shortage" complaint comes up frequently and usually someone is able to point the individual to a source that has X product available, maybe not at a cheap price but available. As to pricing the cost of materials has taken a jump over the last few years and it becomes necessary to raise prices. 10 year old prices are not viable for businesses even if its an entry level product for hobbyists.

 

[roytyson]

Just got my 75/7680 and 54/1760 case from Wildman. Gave me goosebumps!

 

[jnobels]

“International” rocketeers often have very very few vendor options (I can can count my options on 2 fingers) and I seriosly doubt my vendor is the problem. It simply takes months or years for aerotech to fill orders and the quantities are limited when they do. Importing casings is possible, but really expensive.

The struggle is real. I lost my only 29mm casing in the fall and procuring a cost effective replacement seems unlikely for this flying season.

Disposables it is I guess. CTI is tempting, but (luckily for aerotech) the last time I checked their 29mm loads were pricier than the ~equivalent aerotech su motors.

 

[Bungie64]

I keep re-reading the same complaint template in these threads: Vendor-X doesn't have everything I want, therefore it's AT (or CTI, or some other manufacturer's) fault.

Have you explored online sources as an alternative?
Vendor / supply-chain management is a skill, and going with the first one you find nearby may, or more frequently may not, be the best course of action.




Perhaps, there is something not right with your onsite vendor?




Wildman, BMS, and Sirius both have G75 and I600 motors in stock:
https://wildmanrocketry.com/search?q=G75
https://www.balsamachining.com/
https://www.siriusrocketry.biz/ishop/aerotech-g75j-10a-29mm-reload-kit-hazmat-303.html

a

I lost my only 29/40-120 last june and just now found a replacement. I contacted Aerotech months back and was told it was a manufacturing problem. They were having issues with the company they were partnered with and were looking for a new manufacturer. So it is a supply issue on Aerotech's end.

 

[slothead]

Thanks for the offer Joe. I forgot how many folks from our side will be there.
We're still a ways from seeing this motor available, but you would think that by August we could pick up a few.
Nothing beats a Dark Matter Drag Race!

Photo credit to Dr. David Reese, who sponsored this race at ROCStock 2017.

I really like the looks of those Dark Matter exhausts. It gives the impression of a real Sci-Fi movie! I'm going to be looking for Dark Matter motors in the future.

 

[slothead]

I really like the looks of those Dark Matter exhausts. It gives the impression of a real Sci-Fi movie! I'm going to be looking for Dark Matter motors in the future.

Hey Charlie,
How do I buy the forward seal disk O-ring (#00025) by itself? Otherwise I have to spend a minimum of $14.95 for a motor kit which seems a bit high for a 1.3" x 1/16" o-ring!

 

[jimzcatz]

Which specific oring? I get mine from McMaster.

 

[Dave A]

Which specific oring? I get mine from McMaster.

All the o-rings right here. Mcmaster-carr gets them to me in about 48hrs.View attachment AeroTech - O-ring-Washer Chart.pdf

 

[slothead]

It is the one Forward Seal Disk O-ring 1-5/16" x 1/16" 025, but Aerotech identifies it differently on the 38-720 motor assembly drawing. On that drawing it is described as find #10, part number 00025, (1.313" X 1/16"). The only real difference in the ident is the “1.313 (versus 1-5/16), but that’s pretty damn close if not exact. Thanks for the tip on McMaster.

 

[Rocketjunkie]

O-rings come in standard sizes known as dash numbers. The last 3 digits of the Aerotech part number is the dash number, in this case -025. All dash numbers starting with 0 are 1/16" thick, 1 are 3/32" thick, etc. This McMaster page https://www.mcmaster.com/o-rings lists the O-rings in dash number order and gives the nominal and actual sizes. Click on the first entry, oil resistant Buna o-rings.

 

[gldknght]

“International” rocketeers often have very very few vendor options (I can can count my options on 2 fingers) and I seriosly doubt my vendor is the problem. It simply takes months or years for aerotech to fill orders and the quantities are limited when they do. Importing casings is possible, but really expensive.

The struggle is real. I lost my only 29mm casing in the fall and procuring a cost effective replacement seems unlikely for this flying season.

Disposables it is I guess. CTI is tempting, but (luckily for aerotech) the last time I checked their 29mm loads were pricier than the ~equivalent aerotech su motors.

Actually, when you compare the cost of At hardware (way very much higher) vs. the cost of Cti hardware, and the cost of At reloads vs. the cost of Cti reloads (slightly more expensive), the Cti systems are much less expensive overall.

 

[slothead]

O-rings come in standard sizes known as dash numbers. The last 3 digits of the Aerotech part number is the dash number, in this case -025. All dash numbers starting with 0 are 1/16" thick, 1 are 3/32" thick, etc. This McMaster page https://www.mcmaster.com/o-rings lists the O-rings in dash number order and gives the nominal and actual sizes. Click on the first entry, oil resistant Buna o-rings.

Thanks for this info rocketjunkie - I learn something (however minuscule) every day and thank everyone for their contribution. Thanks again, Tom

 

[Ez2cDave]

Aerotech's main problem has been production of hardware for a while now. Why they have not found a shop that can keep up with production ( or AT pony up and by x amount of hardware ahead of time instead of waiting till y amount of orders are placed and then they are rushed to get z amount made ) is beyond me.
Rant off , and no , this is not a bash against AT.

( 1 ) They could use multiple shops to produce hardware in sufficient number.

( 2 ) Perhaps there are "cash flow" problems at Aerotech . . . Not a good sign !

Dave F.

 

[Ez2cDave]

Aerotech's main problem has been production of hardware for a while now. Why they have not found a shop that can keep up with production ( or AT pony up and by x amount of hardware ahead of time instead of waiting till y amount of orders are placed and then they are rushed to get z amount made ) is beyond me.
Rant off , and no , this is not a bash against AT.

Outsource hardware manufacturing to China . . . Cheaper, faster, volume production would not be an issue !

Dave F.

 

[3stoogesrocketry]

Outsource hardware manufacturing to China . . . Cheaper, faster, volume production would not be an issue !

Dave F.

Dave as a tradesman , I highly disagree , and believe this to be one of the biggest problems we are facing . Cash flow should not be a issue , look what has been spent developing the new abcd motors . Aerotechs main problem I will go out on the edge of this cliff , and just say , their machinists suck , bad . I will stop my rant before anybody thinks this is political or a bash against Aerotech.

 

[Ez2cDave]

Dave as a tradesman , I highly disagree , and believe this to be one of the biggest problems we are facing . Cash flow should not be a issue , look what has been spent developing the new abcd motors . Aerotechs main problem I will go out on the edge of this cliff , and just say , their machinists suck , bad . I will stop my rant before anybody thinks this is political or a bash against Aerotech.

The bottom line is that Aerotech is unable to supply hardware and reloads in sufficient quantity, and has been for quite some time.

So, either they outsource, get numerous outside machine shops involved, or release the rights to the RMS hardware, so that "independent contractors" can produce the products.

As for the insufficient number of reloads, that is another major problem.

If "cash flow" isn't an issue, why aren't they "stockpiling" hardware, rather than waiting for enough, pre-paid, orders for a "batch run" to be made. Also, why are reloads in such short supply ?

Dave F.

 

[tbonerocketeer]

The bottom line is that Aerotech is unable to supply hardware and reloads in sufficient quantity, and has been for quite some time.

So, either they outsource, get numerous outside machine shops involved, or release the rights to the RMS hardware, so that "independent contractors" can produce the products.

As for the insufficient number of reloads, that is another major problem.

If "cash flow" isn't an issue, why aren't they "stockpiling" hardware, rather than waiting for enough, pre-paid, orders for a "batch run" to be made. Also, why are reloads in such short supply ?

Dave F.

Aerotech hardware is selling faster than the machinist supply. I've heard from other places that the aluminum tubing is having a many month lead for Mill run....and by many month I mean 7 plus. I just visited Aerotech and they are wide open, working 6 days a week.

 

[BF Rockets]

Like if you please:
https://twitter.com/fly_AT_fly/status/1093662197966753792

 

[Ez2cDave]

Aerotech hardware is selling faster than the machinist supply. I've heard from other places that the aluminum tubing is having a many month lead for Mill run....and by many month I mean 7 plus. I just visited Aerotech and they are wide open, working 6 days a week.

What about the low availability of reloads ?

Dave F.