TARC Team Cleaning 1010 Rails

[VinceC]

Happy New Year Everyone,

One only needs to review this Forum for a short time to see just how much you don't know and how much there is to learn - lol!

I am a volunteer/mentor for a high school rocket club started in 2019. This year the Club has a Team entering it's third ARC. Through a lot of hard work, what I am sure was some luck, and the grace of God, two years ago the Team was a Finalist Alternate and last year a Finalist finishing 62nd!

It only took that one weekend at the National Finals for the Team to see how high "the bar" was set by the other teams and how much room there was for improvement. (And it did not go unnoticed that maybe the Team is hindered in part by the level of experience of it's Mentor and Advisor)

But from their experience the Team has already "upped" their game this year. For example, while still trying to keep things simple but to "get better". the Team has spent time incorporating 3D printed parts into this years rocket design and build. So in two years the Team has progressed from designs and builds that included balsa fins, metal washer mass ballast, and glued transitions to plywood fin designs, and 3D printed mass ballast and twist lock transitions. So the excitement continues.

Last year trying to remove as many variables from their test launches the Team focused on the steadiness and cleanliness of their launch pad and the 1010 rail. Their SOP's include anchoring the pad legs with sand bags and cleaning the rail before each launch. They have tried a number of household cleaners such as Simple Green and finished the process with different "cleaning" lubricants such as WD40 and spray teflon - Triflo, getting with mixed results along the way.

As a result the Team proved the flight results were effected by how dirty/clean the rail was but never found a solid procedure to provide consistent results. (The Team uses Apogees's urethane resin universal rail guides in their rocket builds.)

So the "long story" - "short question is" does anyone have any experience with how they keep, clean, maintain their 1010 rail to minimize it's impact on flight results, that they would like to share?

As always, the Club would like to thank anyone in advance for sharing their experience.

The Onteora Rocket Club

 

[SolarYellow]

Not sure if APCP will work the same, but for smokeless powder, removing the residue while the metal is still warm allows it to be wiped clean easily with a dry paper towel. Waiting until you get home and it's cooled off gives the residue molecules a chance to cross link, and you'll be scrubbing with nasty chemicals for awhile to get it off. For best possible results, I would recommend maintaining your own rails and cleaning immediately after every flight.

The rails are anodized. That means the surface is coated with a crystalline aluminum oxide matrix. It is extremely hard and abrasion resistant, and resistant to most solvents. However, any strong acid or base will eat it rapidly, so keep any cleaning chemicals neutral pH.

Most sporting goods stores around here stock a variety of brushes and swabs for cleaning firearms. There is probably a plastic bottle brush-type insert that would be a good fit in the slot of 1010 rail. It could be used by itself or with a cloth wrapped around it.

I like Hornady ONE SHOT® GUN CLEANER & LUBE for my firearms. Haven't used it on the rail yet. Wear gloves and use outdoors. It leaves a nice, almost-dry lubed surface with excellent corrosion protection.
https://www.hornady.com/reloading/case-care/lubes-and-cleaners/one-shot-cleaners

 

[3stoogesrocketry]

Happy New Year Everyone,

One only needs to review this Forum for a short time to see just how much you don't know and how much there is to learn - lol!

I am a volunteer/mentor for a high school rocket club started in 2019. This year the Club has a Team entering it's third ARC. Through a lot of hard work, what I am sure was some luck, and the grace of God, two years ago the Team was a Finalist Alternate and last year a Finalist finishing 62nd!

It only took that one weekend at the National Finals for the Team to see how high "the bar" was set by the other teams and how much room there was for improvement. (And it did not go unnoticed that maybe the Team is hindered in part by the level of experience of it's Mentor and Advisor)

But from their experience the Team has already "upped" their game this year. For example, while still trying to keep things simple but to "get better". the Team has spent time incorporating 3D printed parts into this years rocket design and build. So in two years the Team has progressed from designs and builds that included balsa fins, metal washer mass ballast, and glued transitions to plywood fin designs, and 3D printed mass ballast and twist lock transitions. So the excitement continues.

Last year trying to remove as many variables from their test launches the Team focused on the steadiness and cleanliness of their launch pad and the 1010 rail. Their SOP's include anchoring the pad legs with sand bags and cleaning the rail before each launch. They have tried a number of household cleaners such as Simple Green and finished the process with different "cleaning" lubricants such as WD40 and spray teflon - Triflo, getting with mixed results along the way.

As a result the Team proved the flight results were effected by how dirty/clean the rail was but never found a solid procedure to provide consistent results. (The Team uses Apogees's urethane resin universal rail guides in their rocket builds.)

So the "long story" - "short question is" does anyone have any experience with how they keep, clean, maintain their 1010 rail to minimize it's impact on flight results, that they would like to share?

As always, the Club would like to thank anyone in advance for sharing their experience.

The Onteora Rocket Club

For a 1010 rail, get some 2 inch pvc pipe longer then the rail and cap one end . Insert the rail and fill with a white vinegar water mixture. Plug the open end either with a screw cap or push another end on. Then let it sit fir 24 hours. Pull out and wash/lube and it'll be almost new. This is how CTRA cleaned all our rods/rails.

 

[SolarYellow]

Vinegar is acidic. It attacks the anodizing.

 

[user 30299]

The vinegar treatment is fine. Just buy a cheap supermarket brand. You can do the dip treatment with the PVC tube,
or use a spray bottle (filled with the vinegar) and some small brushes.

The dip treatment will get in all the nooks & crannies - especially inside the rail's groove. This is where you
get a heavy buildup of soot from the motor exhaust, and it's the hardest area to clean.

The motor exhaust already causes a noticeable amount of rail degradation anyway so there should
be no worry about the vinegar treatment.

 

[3stoogesrocketry]

Vinegar is acidic. It attacks the anodizing.

If left undiluted and submerged for over 90 days (yes I found out) it will pit the anodizing

 

[user 30299]

If left undiluted and submerged for over 90 days (yes I found out) it will pit the anodizing

Hmmm, 90 days.

 

[3stoogesrocketry]

Hmmm, 90 days.

Maybe at the end of the flying season I put them all in a tube and forgot about it till spring time. Oops lol they still were usable and after 2016 when we shut down, they went to Metra and are still being used

 

[SolarYellow]

Vinegar is acidic. It attacks the anodizing.

I'm sensitive about it after many, many cases of customers with very expensive performance brake hardware having the anodized finish ruined by car detailers using acidic wheel cleaners. I just try to avoid mixing anodizing and acids in general.

 

[rcktnut]

I spray my rails with vinegar let sit 1/2 hour and then run a piece of Scotch Brite pad cut just big enough to fit inside the rail channels and push through the channels with a "cooler" stick. Then I rinse well with water from the garden hose. I always do this within a day after use. I think the worst thing for the rails is letting the propellant residue on them for an extended period of time. Rails are still in excellent condition with 20+ years of use.
Edit: Forgot to add, when dry, I spray the side/ channel being used with silicone spray. The silicone makes the rail much easier to clean, keeps propellent residue from "eating" into the aluminum.

 

[user 30299]

Maybe at the end of the flying season I put them all in a tube and forgot about it till spring time. Oops lol they still were usable and after 2016 when we shut down, they went to Metra and are still being used

Nothing like a good story with a happy ending . . . .

 

[mikec]

I just try to avoid mixing anodizing and acids in general.

Fair enough, but as QFactor says there's typically hydrochloric acid residue from APCP combustion so the anodizing is already not in a happy place. Some weak acetic acid won't hurt as much as that.

 

[VinceC]

Thank you to everyone for the valuable information and maintenance suggestions. We will definitely combine these suggestions into a monthly/annual maintenance plan.

Does anyone have a "cleaning regiment" they implement between test flights conducted on the same day? The Team launches at a remote location in the middle of a field with no utilities close by.

In the beginning of last year, trying to eliminate and minimize launch variables, the Team started off each launch day with four "clean" launches rotating the pad and using each side of the rail. By the end of the year the Team decided that they wanted to use the same side of the rail oriented the same way at the launch site - leeward or windward side. So the Team started cleaning the rail after each launch.

At times the Team felt any "cleaning lubricant" - like WD40, Triflow/teflon, or silicone actually increased launch drag. So by the end of the year they were just using a household de-greaser - Simple Green/409 and a pad or paper towel to clean the rail between flights.

The Team member responsible for cleaning the rail and "shoving" the pad/towel inside the groove of the rail last year "upped" his game this year and 3D-printed a hand tool with a rail guide shaped end on it to push the pad/towel up and down the rail. "Necessity is the mother of invention."

So the Team was wondering if anyone had experience with cleaning the rail between same day launches.

Thanks again.

The Onteora Rocket Club

 

[JimByrne]

I use black powder solvent (from the local gun store) for cleaning then a automotive spray wax.
I store & transport the rails in a PVC pipe tube. They get cleaned at the end of each launch day.

 

[Donnager]

Vinegar is acidic. It attacks the anodizing.

And a large part of APCP combustion products are acidic (but those and their corrosiveness do depend on formulation).

Why not use dilute baking soda (sodium bicarbonate)? To get rid of the acid residue, among other things.

I soak my motor cases in 1-5% sodium bicarbonate solution for a few hours before cleaning, and washing with soap. I haven't had the "crystal blisters" that you get with corrosion on aluminum.

Post cleaning, most any gun cleaning lube works very well.

 

[rcktnut]

Thank you to everyone for the valuable information and maintenance suggestions. We will definitely combine these suggestions into a monthly/annual maintenance plan.

Does anyone have a "cleaning regiment" they implement between test flights conducted on the same day? The Team launches at a remote location in the middle of a field with no utilities close by.

In the beginning of last year, trying to eliminate and minimize launch variables, the Team started off each launch day with four "clean" launches rotating the pad and using each side of the rail. By the end of the year the Team decided that they wanted to use the same side of the rail oriented the same way at the launch site - leeward or windward side. So the Team started cleaning the rail after each launch.

At times the Team felt any "cleaning lubricant" - like WD40, Triflow/teflon, or silicone actually increased launch drag. So by the end of the year they were just using a household de-greaser - Simple Green/409 and a pad or paper towel to clean the rail between flights.

The Team member responsible for cleaning the rail and "shoving" the pad/towel inside the groove of the rail last year "upped" his game this year and 3D-printed a hand tool with a rail guide shaped end on it to push the pad/towel up and down the rail. "Necessity is the mother of invention."

So the Team was wondering if anyone had experience with cleaning the rail between same day launches.

Thanks again.

The Onteora Rocket Club

Simple Green all purpose cleaner is not good for prolonged periods in contact with aluminum. I think that cleaning the rails in between flights is going way overboard. Your much better off trying to achieve your flight goals with a "dirty" rail. Good idea though to clean the rails after the final launch of the day within a day or 2

I use silicone spray on my rails after cleaning which is thoroughly dry by the time the rail is used again. I don't see why it would increase launch drag.

 

[boatgeek]

A few ideas:
The TARC team I work with cleans the rail at the end of the day after returning to school. Rinse with water, scrub with a cloth or scotchbrite pad to remove residue, rinse with water, dry. That seems to work well to keep a rail in good shape for a few years at least.

It helps if you use clean propellants. Blue is nice, white isn't bad, but smoky leaves more crud to clean up. The less smoke the propellant generates, the less residue there is on the rail.

When you get to Nationals, the rails will all be in good shape first thing in the morning, and they don't seem to get too crudded up in the few flights we're talking about. Your team could bring a spray bottle of water and a paper towel out to the pad if they're worried about someone using a smoky motor before them. It wouldn't take much to clean up the rail.