Kilz Rocks

I had the same problem. I went to Home Depot and I thought, "This doesn't look like it", but then I looked at their website and it seemed to be the right kind.

Originally posted by MaxPower
Is Sears the only place that has the spray cans?

About airbrushing... you would have to strain it then reduce it down to spray. I wonder if it would still have all the same qualities?

Reed Goodwin, you don't get good results with kilz if you use a water based top coat? All my airbrush paints are acrylics (water based?). Maybe Kilz isn't for me? I was excited after reading the top post but before I try it, I want to make sure it is OK to use with my airbrush paints.

Thanks

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I have bought it at walmart. They also have colors available.

I finished a rocket by spraying Kilz then Krylon flat white then Createx airbrush paint then Krylon clear. After a few days I have noticed tiny cracks in the clear coat. You can't see them looking straight at the rocket but you can see them look at the side of the rocket.

I waited for each coat to dry. It is entirely possible I did not wait long enough though.

I posted at an airbrush forum about paint compatability and I was told that Krylon clear has a tendancy to crack when it drys. They also warned me about not using Kilz. They thought that it is a varnish and not meant to be sealed with a clear coat. Now I have 5 rockets primed and ready this way and don't want to start them over so I am just going to switch clear coats and see what happens.

I read back through these posts and saw that someone said to wait days (weeks?) after the Kilz dries to completely cure. I did not wait that long.

I will post back when I clear coat the next rocket (this week).

Has anyone else seen this problem with Kilz before? What clear coat are you using?

Thanks

well Kilz is not a varnish, Its a high solids primer. Very inert from my experience. I have sprayed everything from Krylon, to Plasticote to Rustoleum to Testors over it without any problem.

I have used Krylon Gloss clear over Krylon paint without any trouble but I do not use it very often. Most of my rockets get either Testors' Dull Cote or Krylon Matte Clear for the final coat.

Could it be a reaction from the type of air-brush paint you are using? could you possibly be laying the clear on too heavy?

also pay attention to the recoat times listed on the spray paint. I don't think regular Krylon has a recoat window but the clear might.

Thanks for the reply.

It could be the airbrush paint. That is why I posted in an airbrush forum. It is a water based acrylic paint. The Krylon clear says you can recoat anytime.

Thanks

I have not had the problem with krylon clear over createx,

but keep in mind the createx takes time to fully cure. It's super important, do "not" put a wetcoat of createx on - it has to be sprayed in several light coats letting each coat dry or it could take a week to cure!

I normaly speed this up alot with a hairdryer after each coat. and often still wait till the next day for good measure before top coating createx.

same thing goes for kilz .. I sprayed some krylon white onto kilz that probably wasn't dry enough and it developed small long narrow cracks in just certain areas, mainly near the filets where the kilz was the thickest.

>patience<

This is all good information!

Thanks

Of course I could be wrong but I am pretty sure Krylon Spray paint is not lacquer based.

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and of course I WAS wrong - here it is right from the good folks at Krylon:

"The Krylon Interior/Exterior line is an acrylic lacquer line. Dries to the touch in 12 minutes recoat anytime and full cure in 24 hours."

I had a gift certificate from Home Depot for over a year now. I finally spent it on an HVLP spray gun. I used it to spray a 2 part clear coat on 5 of my rockets. I wanted to get them ready to fly this weekend so I did all 5 at once. I should have just done one but this was the last day I had any time before this weekend. I sprayed too much and it ran/sagged. Oh well. Live and learn.

I love the spray gun and will use it to spray my Createx as base coats.

Did I read somewhere that once you spray solvent based media you can never switch to water based?

Thanks

I sprayed both thru the same gun several times without problems just a very good cleaning in between. now I have a seperate sprayer for each so no worries

Thanks Styme!

I sprayed the reducer first to clear out any clear coat. Then I sprayed mineral spirits, as directed. Do I need to spray something through the gun before I spray the Createx?

Thanks

One source I found years ago recommended Rustoleum clear and advised against Krylon clear, from finished appearance quality standpoint. I use Rustoleum clear frequently and am very happy with the results. I haven't tried the Krylon clear to compare. Just my $0.02 worth.
-Jim

I've never had good results with Rustoleum clear. It doesn't seem to go on well and it leaves the surface kind of dull/rough.

Originally posted by m85476585
I've never had good results with Rustoleum clear. It doesn't seem to go on well and it leaves the surface kind of dull/rough.

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Hmm, that's interesting. Just the opposite of my results. My guess is that you're not getting it on wet enough, and it's drying out too fast and not leveling. This can be caused by 1) holding the can too far from the painted surface, 2) moving the can too fast, 3) combination of 1 & 2. You have to put it, or any other gloss coat for that matter, on as heavy and wet as you dare, with the risk that too much will create a run. In autobody work, you just sand out the runs, which is a lot easier than fixing the effect of not enough finish. Can do that (sand out) on rockets, too, if you want.
I'd rather have a small run or two on a nice glossy finish than have a dull finish from being too careful to avoid runs.
An alternative clear coat that I don't think has popped up in this thread is Future acrylic floor finish. Lots of info on using it on Google Groups rec.scale.models
-Jim

The can says to use light coats, especially with clear coats. I use Minwax Polycrylic (brush-on) now, and I haven't had a problem.

Originally posted by RimfireJim
Hmm, that's interesting. Just the opposite of my results. My guess is that you're not getting it on wet enough, and it's drying out too fast and not leveling. This can be caused by 1) holding the can too far from the painted surface, 2) moving the can too fast, 3) combination of 1 & 2. You have to put it, or any other gloss coat for that matter, on as heavy and wet as you dare, with the risk that too much will create a run. In autobody work, you just sand out the runs, which is a lot easier than fixing the effect of not enough finish. Can do that (sand out) on rockets, too, if you want.
I'd rather have a small run or two on a nice glossy finish than have a dull finish from being too careful to avoid runs.
An alternative clear coat that I don't think has popped up in this thread is Future acrylic floor finish. Lots of info on using it on Google Groups rec.scale.models
-Jim

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When you have the problem of not enough, can't you just go back over it later? Can you sand it smooth and recoat?

Thanks

krylon clear sux ,when compared to most good brands of spraypaint.
the level of shine or clarity is not good at all.

the colors are good but the clear aint up to par

Originally posted by m85476585
The can says to use light coats, especially with clear coats. I use Minwax Polycrylic (brush-on) now, and I haven't had a problem.

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That may be what it says on the can, but not how it works in practice. I think the clear IS a little more prone to running than the solids, so maybe that's the basis of the label.
To get a good gloss coat, the clear HAS to be put on heavy enough to level out while it's wet.
There's no substitute for doing some practice on scrap to develop a technique that works. Or, as you did, find an alternative!
-Jim

Originally posted by MaxPower
When you have the problem of not enough, can't you just go back over it later? Can you sand it smooth and recoat?

Thanks

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I'd say 'no' if by "just go back over it" you mean put a little more on.
I'd say 'yes' if you mean try a second time with the amount you should have used the first time.

Wet sanding it smooth before recoating will give better results. Remember, a dull reflection is caused by a rough surface, and the smoother it is before you put on that last coat, the easier it is to get a smooth surface (=gloss) on that last coat.
-Jim

Originally posted by RimfireJim
I'd say 'no' if by "just go back over it" you mean put a little more on.
I'd say 'yes' if you mean try a second time with the amount you should have used the first time.

Wet sanding it smooth before recoating will give better results. Remember, a dull reflection is caused by a rough surface, and the smoother it is before you put on that last coat, the easier it is to get a smooth surface (=gloss) on that last coat.
-Jim

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I want to go over a second time and add the amount I should have in the first place. Well... after I sound down the drips.

Thanks

I was doing a project (non-rocketry) that needed a clear coat, so I decided to try the Rustoleum one again (because I still had some; I was painting a flat, level surface; and I didn't mind messing it up). It wasn't bad, and I was able to put it on heavily (the paint reacted in one spot, but it isn't a problem), and it dried extremely clear. There are strips of aluminum foil and you can't tell that they are coated. It isn't perfectly glossy because the paint was a little rough.

I also used Krylon H2O primer on one part because it is styrofoam and when I tested regular paint it ate a hole through it. The primer didn't react at all and mostly protected the foam, but I had to put on a thick layer.

Originally posted by MaxPower
I want to go over a second time and add the amount I should have in the first place. Well... after I sound down the drips.

Thanks

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It won't work well unless you get the previous layer smooth. You don't have to sand it all off, but if it feels rough you will never be able to fix it with more clear. Adding more would only work if the last (rough) coat is wet.

I am building a rocket from scratch (https://www.rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=26355&perpage=20&pagenumber=1) and I am using kilz for the balsa body of it. I put two heavy coats and sanded until I can almost see the balsa wood, may need a third coat also.

I searched TRF for an answer to this question but could not find it. Here it is: Does Kilz add significant weight to the rocket?

This rocket is going to be on the heavy side: the body's weight was about 2.6 oz before priming. I have not checked it since primming and sanding. What has been your experience on this subject?

My experience is that each coat of paint adds approximately 0.001 oz/sq in. Rough estimate based on your dimensioned drawing is that you have about 300 sq in of surface area, so each coat of paint would add about 0.3 oz.

With primer, I often sand down to almost bare between coats. Those I treat as half a coat.

Comparing Kilz vs. Rustoleum sandable primer, the Kilz tends to go on thicker. Each coat of Kilz is heavier, but fewer coats are needed to achieve good coverage, so the result is about the same.

This thread seems to go on and on and on.....anyway, Kilz added .5oz to the Fat Boy we just finished. Two coats of Rustoleum Painters Touch enamel only added .2oz.

I like the fact that you only need to spray one coat of Kilz.