Klima Motors

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Space Oddity

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Has anyone tried using Klima motors and igniters? I'd be interested to know how they perform. They look good on paper.
Price wise they are roughly equivalent to Estes motors but with more thrust available.

I've had a couple of Estes igniter failures recently, one failed to ignite, the other partially. The Klima igniters (Quest) look quite robust compared with the Estes ones.

I've also been looking at how to use the Klima motors.
I recently made and launched a two stage rocket using an Estes D12-0 as a booster and a D12-7 main. The rocket design showed a maximum altitude of 2400 ft.
The rocket flew perfectly straight. The booster section returned dropping about 30 foot from the pad. The rest of the rocket was gone. The last I saw of it was the delay trail way above the clouds. From my judgement alone I'd say it easily exceeded 2000 feet. I've attached a photo which shows the last time I saw it.

I tried taking the original design and revising it to use an 18mm body tube instead of a 24mm one. In the OR design I put a Klima D9-0 and D9-7 in place of the Estes motor and came up with a theoretical altitude of 3400 feet.

I think I might try the Klima motor. Looks good. Any comments on how it actually performs?

SO.
 
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Never heard of them. Where are they from?

As Chuck said, they are made in Germany. I think that they were/are distributed by Quest in the US. Here in the UK they have only recently become available.
They are listed on the "Thrust Curve" site, also included within the OR database.

I think it's great for UK enthusiasts to see some European competition at last. Particularly, and with respect, to the dominance of US supply, which given the restrictions and shipping/tax costs have become way over priced compared with what you can buy them for in the US.
Whether they continue or not is I guess, dependant on how enthusiastic UK rocketry buyers are.

Thanks for the tip on the igniters.

SO.
 
I really wish they were more widely available here. Great motors and initiators.
 
Maybe I'm dense (a distinct possibility) but I'm not finding them on thrustcurve.org


Sent from my iPhone using Rocketry Forum
 
You're right. Seems "Thrust Curve" hasn't yet caught up with Klima.
I assumed it had after being advised in an earlier thread that OR's data base was based on Thrust Curve.

My apologies.

SO.
 
IMO Thrustcurve only includes certified motors. What am I missing?
 
Quest used to relabel Klima motors - these were the blue Quest motors with the plastic looking nozzles. They were great performers. The white labeled motors that Quest sells now are made in China - they are smokier and not as powerful.
 
Quest used to relabel Klima motors - these were the blue Quest motors with the plastic looking nozzles. They were great performers. The white labeled motors that Quest sells now are made in China - they are smokier and not as powerful.

The Klima motors have yet to be made available in the United States.

I asked Bill Stine about these motors at the NARAM-56 Manufacturer's Forum. He said there were production issues (can't make them fast enough) and much paperwork yet to be done in order to import the motors.

The original Quest motors were made on the MPC/AVI/FSI motor making machines.

Quest later built their own motor machines (I have seen them) but stopped using them after the fire years ago.

Quest then imported German Held/Wecco motors (I forget which). These motors were also relabled and sold by MRC in the early 1990s.

Then Quest went to China and had a company there produce motors.

I'd like to see the Klima motors made available here in America.
 
Quest used to relabel Klima motors - these were the blue Quest motors with the plastic looking nozzles.
No, Klima motors are much newer. Due to a change in importer, Estes motors became very scarce in Germany, so Robert Klima started producing a new range of BP motors and went through all the necessary procedures to get them certified by German and European authorities. They've only been in existence in the last couple of years! The Quest motors were rebranded Weco or Sachsen Feuerwerk motors.

You can get data files from Klima's website:
https://www.raketenmodellbau-klima.de/

Specifically:
General data: https://www.neu.raketenmodellbau-klima.de/Download_Dateien/Motorflyer_DINA4.pdf
.eng files: https://neu.raketenmodellbau-klima.de/Download_Dateien/Klima_ENG.zip
.rse files: https://neu.raketenmodellbau-klima.de/Download_Dateien/Klima_RSE.zip
 
I wonder if import rules are why quest has not tied to import more of the D's.
 
The Klima motors have yet to be made available in the United States.

I asked Bill Stine about these motors at the NARAM-56 Manufacturer's Forum. He said there were production issues (can't make them fast enough) and much paperwork yet to be done in order to import the motors.

The original Quest motors were made on the MPC/AVI/FSI motor making machines.

Quest later built their own motor machines (I have seen them) but stopped using them after the fire years ago.

Quest then imported German Held/Wecco motors (I forget which). These motors were also relabled and sold by MRC in the early 1990s.

Then Quest went to China and had a company there produce motors.

I'd like to see the Klima motors made available here in America.

You are correct - the motors I was refering to were made by Wecco - for a moment I got the two confused.
 
I never flew one, but thx. I never saw a good use for a d5-0
 
I never flew one, but thx. I never saw a good use for a d5-0
The motors marked as D5-0 were actually D5-P. No booster motors available. I still have about 30 D5's, an assortment of -P, -4 and -6. Need to fly some again :)
 
Tom,

I would like to see how you use them.

I guess they would be good for saucers and minimum diameter.
 
Tom,

I would like to see how you use them.

I guess they would be good for saucers and minimum diameter.
2 with masking tape 'adapters' work well in my 24mm Deuce.
This cluster contains 2 Gs and 5 D5s [YOUTUBE]8xCVgDkoMno[/YOUTUBE]
 
The biggest problem I've had with the D5 motors is how hot the casing gets - it is pretty thin. I tried shimming one with masking tape to use in a 24mm motor mount and the heat really messed with the adhesive on the tape - the rings of tape slid and skewed a lot in the mount. And the motors always looked like they were just moments away from burning through when I pulled them out of the model.
 
No, Klima motors are much newer. Due to a change in importer, Estes motors became very scarce in Germany, so Robert Klima started producing a new range of BP motors and went through all the necessary procedures to get them certified by German and European authorities. They've only been in existence in the last couple of years! The Quest motors were rebranded Weco or Sachsen Feuerwerk motors.

...

Klima started to develop the motors when it was clear that Weco was phasing out model rocket motor production.

Klima motors have been available since 2013.

Klima motors are composite not BP.
 
The biggest problem I've had with the D5 motors is how hot the casing gets - it is pretty thin. I tried shimming one with masking tape to use in a 24mm motor mount and the heat really messed with the adhesive on the tape - the rings of tape slid and skewed a lot in the mount. And the motors always looked like they were just moments away from burning through when I pulled them out of the model.

Yeah I've had that happen with the Quest C6 motors as well.... the white casing label got SO hot it turned brown and the casing was about like a rolled up sheet of paper it was SO soft by the time it got back... and it managed to soften the plastic lock ring on the bottom of the rocket so that basically it welded itself to the ring...

Not impressed at all with Quest motors... nearly every flight on them has had some sort of issue... weak ejection charges, casings nearly burned through, casings getting hot enough to carmelize, etc... I won't use Quest motors in anything that I care about... only "junk birds"... that's been MY experience...

Later! OL JR :)
 
I'm always interested in LPR options. I vaguely recall Quest mentioning they were going to add small composites, but I don't recall ever seeing one. Anyone have links to buy?


Later!

--Coop
 
I'm always interested in LPR options. I vaguely recall Quest mentioning they were going to add small composites, but I don't recall ever seeing one. Anyone have links to buy?


Later!

--Coop

Yeah, I seem to recall reading that Quest was supposedly going to be bringing the Klima motors into the US, but then again, Quest is FAMOUS for "vapor-ware" and making promises that never materialize...

Now that Quest is in bed with Aero-Tech, I wouldn't count on ever seeing Klima motors over here, at least not from Quest... not given their track record and the fact it'd likely compete with their new partner's wares...

Wish SOME company would bring them over though... perhaps FSI or some other group or company... More choices is always better...

Later! OL JR :)
 
Good point. I AM certainly, looking forward to seeing what FSI throws into the ring...


Later!

--Coop
 
The company selling Klima motors in the UK is ..... Modelrockets.co.uk or the "model rocket shop".

There may be others but it's the only one I can find. I'm not sure and doubt whether you can buy and import from the UK though.
Their site gives a bit of information and prices of course. You may be surprised at how much we have to pay for things here. Nevertheless I'm going to buy some. I won't be able to launch till at least November (probably December). Mainly because I haven't built a rocket for them yet. I'll build a single and a two stager using the Klima D9 motors.

If you're interested, I'll let you know how the progress goes.

SO.
 
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