Chrome Finish?

stealth6 said:

These are really fantastic. Great job.
I'd really be interested in how it holds up long term.
My experience has been that I've found a few ways to get a good looking "metallic/chrome/silver/type" finish, but none of them hold up to ANY sort of use, handling, cleaning, polishing, clear-coating, etc. I've resigned myself to getting a great looking photo or two if I'm VERY careful, but then accepting that it's all downhill from there. Even handling with cotton gloves long after the paint has "cured" leaves marks and blemishes that get even worse if I try to fix/polish them. Ah well, I kinda like battle scars in my rockets anyway once they start flying.
Here's what mine look like (immediately after the paint dries).

View attachment 184809

s6

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Thanks for the compliment. Mine already has a few blemishes just from finishing up the rocket. I had to add the rail guides and add nose weigh, and just handling during those activities added some finger prints and other spots and smudges. My Silver Comet doesn't seem as prone to picking up finger prints and other blemishes, but it has sat in a hot garage for nearly a year since being painted, so maybe it is just more cured. Your rocket in the photo looks great! I love thee kinds of retro-future sci-fi rockets!

My wife thinks it's funny I spend so much time sanding and painting to make them look nice, then shoot them in the air with a 100% certainly they will come back at least banged up a bit and a good chance of having them totally destroyed eventually. It is kind of weird. But everyone needs an art form, even if it is not a permanent one.

YOU, My son, are searching for the Holly Grail of rocketry finishes ! And continue the search will. A chrome or liquid metal finish continues to elude us all, at least one that's affordable ! There are mirror paints but they have to be sprayed on glass--I tried spaying it and then clear coating---NOT--Any clear you lay over metalics will at best dull them and normally turn a shade of gray. The other problem is--you have to have a perfect surface---and you thought black showed everything !! The best I've been able to come up with is this-----it has the liquid metal finish but not that white hot chrome look. The ticket was rusto metalic silver and coated with future wax--it did not turn gray and that was a win !!A least the finger prints wipe off . After a couple flights she has some scratches that I think a coat of wax will take care off but I pranged the tip of the nose--requires what would normally be a quick repair---not so much here !!!! The best I can come up with is clip the 1/2 inch off the tip and put a new piece on and live with it. There ain't no repairs on silver--at least not easy ones. --H

Seems like there would be a market for chrome and gold pre colored nose cones like Metallizer and I think I have seen an Estes kit with a gold nose. Combined with monotone would look sharp

Go with the aluminum duct tape. Does not smudge and is easy to fix when it gets damaged.

Looks great! I assume that the nose is painted.

aerostadt said:

Looks great! I assume that the nose is painted.

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Not paint, aluminum duct tape. The nose is laid down with one inch wide strips.

My rocket got banged up, and I am going to have to repair one of the pods and hopefully find a new way of doing the pod bottoms so it doesn't happen again. In addition to that damage, the chrome paint is very susceptible to picking up fingerprints and other damage from even very light treatment. I put some masking tape on the rocket when I was trying to find the CG and adjust it forward, and when I removed the tape, it damaged the paint, which had cured for several days.

I'd like to paint on some other details, such as a canopy and maybe some accents like stripes or rings or lettering. Instead of trying to mask these shapes and paint them on over the metallic finish, risking damage to the metallic when I remove the tape, I'm thinking of painting the color in the areas I want, and then masking over that and repainting the metallic over the color. Then I'm going to let the rocket sit undisturbed until the next launch, and hopefully the paint will fully cure and be more resilient. I've used the paint before and that rocket sat for a long long time in my garage, and it does not seem to pick up every fingerprint the way this one does. Hopefully more curing time will help it.

The next flight will probably be an L1 cert attempt, and it would be nice to have it looking good. And then after that, I'm not going to worry about it! Its a rocket! It flies and gets damaged! It'll just start to look like a slightly used pre-owned spacecraft.

Micromeister said:

Avery, 3m, Oracal, and several other adhesive backed vinyl's have mirror chrome products, They to not work well on curved surfaces but like Chrome Trim Monokote do great on body tubes and fins. I did my Cine-Roc/Omaga clone with 3m chrome vinyl.

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Cineroc, Omega? :wink:

I like Rustoleum metallic flake paint. It has a tough finish, is easy to apply and with wet sanding and a clear coat produces a deep finish you could fall into.

https://www.rustoleum.com/DigitalEn...OleumUSA/consumer-brands/stops-rust/metallic/

terryg said:

I like Rustoleum metallic flake paint. It has a tough finish, is easy to apply and with wet sanding and a clear coat produces a deep finish you could fall into.

https://www.rustoleum.com/DigitalEn...OleumUSA/consumer-brands/stops-rust/metallic/

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I think I am going to try this one next --- the Stops Rust Metallic Silver with the silver flakes in it.

The rocket I showed earlier had a great color and nice shiny look, I thought, but that paint is very fragile and problematic with handling. It's worse than I had remembered based on my earlier experience. I got a lot of little scuffs on it after going to just one launch, and now it is picking up bad fingerprints that do not clean off, even after the paint has had a few weeks of curing. I want something more durable, even if it is not as authentically metal looking, and since I need to do some repainting after a repair anyway, I am going to give this paint a try and see if it is more durable.

I'll post pics and info after I try it.

Like ThirstyBarbarian I too have had a love hate relationship with Rustoleum Silver Chrome - bright coat. Even with all its faults it is the best cheap chrome out there. If your rocket has to be budget chrome and you have a lot of curing time, the patience of a Saint, good painting skills and you don't have to paint over it, then it might just work out. Must have an excellent base finish. I went over Rusto white primer nicely. Must give it fairly light even coats - but no more than three or four. You can get it too thick, it does like to run and any thickness is subject to finger prints and takes forever to cure. In the dry Colorado air I was OK with approx 5 min between costs, you still want it good and tacky before the next coat goes on. I would then not touch it for at least a week and that is in a dry climate. I would wear cotton gloves when handling. Decals on with water only, no solvent, oil or adhesive can touch it ever. That said it keeps its luster much longer, mine has lasted a whole month and is still nice where not damaged, where other stuff dulls quickly. All flight dings will become patina.

Daddyisabar said:

Like ThirstyBarbarian I too have had a love hate relationship with Rustoleum Silver Chrome - bright coat. Even with all its faults it is the best cheap chrome out there. If your rocket has to be budget chrome and you have a lot of curing time, the patience of a Saint, good painting skills and you don't have to paint over it, then it might just work out. Must have an excellent base finish. I went over Rusto white primer nicely. Must give it fairly light even coats - but no more than three or four. You can get it too thick, it does like to run and any thickness is subject to finger prints and takes forever to cure. In the dry Colorado air I was OK with approx 5 min between costs, you still want it good and tacky before the next coat goes on. I would then not touch it for at least a week and that is in a dry climate. I would wear cotton gloves when handling. Decals on with water only, no solvent, oil or adhesive can touch it ever. That said it keeps its luster much longer, mine has lasted a whole month and is still nice where not damaged, where other stuff dulls quickly. All flight dings will become patina.

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I think you forgot the part about holding your jaw just right while spraying

Daddyisabar said:

Like ThirstyBarbarian I too have had a love hate relationship with Rustoleum Silver Chrome - bright coat. Even with all its faults it is the best cheap chrome out there. If your rocket has to be budget chrome and you have a lot of curing time, the patience of a Saint, good painting skills and you don't have to paint over it, then it might just work out. Must have an excellent base finish. I went over Rusto white primer nicely. Must give it fairly light even coats - but no more than three or four. You can get it too thick, it does like to run and any thickness is subject to finger prints and takes forever to cure. In the dry Colorado air I was OK with approx 5 min between costs, you still want it good and tacky before the next coat goes on. I would then not touch it for at least a week and that is in a dry climate. I would wear cotton gloves when handling. Decals on with water only, no solvent, oil or adhesive can touch it ever. That said it keeps its luster much longer, mine has lasted a whole month and is still nice where not damaged, where other stuff dulls quickly. All flight dings will become patina.

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I'd say that is about right. The rocket that I painted a year or so ago and then left alone to sit in a hot garage during the epic 1,000-year drought we are going through right now has cured nicely and is not so easily damaged. It doesn't seem to pick up fingerprints. Unfortunately this current rocket needed some work on it to repair the pod damage and get it ready for an L1 cert attempt, so touching it was unavoidable and it looked like crap afterward. Now that I am sanding it, the dust itself does not seem like completely dry paint dust, and it actually seems slightly sticky. It sticks to your skin and clothes. I'm hoping it has cured enough to not affect the next coats of paint I am going to put on it.

K'Tesh said:

I think you forgot the part about holding your jaw just right while spraying

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Yes! It is not so much how good you are but how good you look doing it! For the old folk be sure to wear an old set of glasses or safety glasses over the top of your good glasses - that can be a real fashion statement. Painting this stuff is so stressful just a pinch between the cheek and gum may be required, so jaw holdin' is essential. One bad spit and it is all over!

terryg said:

I like Rustoleum metallic flake paint. It has a tough finish, is easy to apply and with wet sanding and a clear coat produces a deep finish you could fall into.

https://www.rustoleum.com/DigitalEn...OleumUSA/consumer-brands/stops-rust/metallic/

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Has anyone worked with this before and have any advice? The instructions are different from paint I am used to. It says it will be dry to the touch in 10 minutes and fully dry in 30! That is much MUCH faster than I am used to.

Usually if I am putting on a second coat of something like Painters Touch 2x, I put it on in less than an hour, when the first coat is tacky but not too dry. And if I am masking and adding a second color, I wait 2 days to be sure the first color is fully cured.

When should I recoat this Rusto Metallic with the metal flakes, and how long should I wait before masking and adding a second color?

ThirstyBarbarian said:

Has anyone worked with this before and have any advice? The instructions are different from paint I am used to. It says it will be dry to the touch in 10 minutes and fully dry in 30! That is much MUCH faster than I am used to.

Usually if I am putting on a second coat of something like Painters Touch 2x, I put it on in less than an hour, when the first coat is tacky but not too dry. And if I am masking and adding a second color, I wait 2 days to be sure the first color is fully cured.

When should I recoat this Rusto Metallic with the metal flakes, and how long should I wait before masking and adding a second color?

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I repainted my rocket with the Rustoluem Stops Rust Metallic Silver. It's the metal flake paint, so not a truly realistic metal looking paint, but it is pretty nice looking paint. It is WAY more durable than the Bright Coat metallics, and it can be clear coated with Rustoleum Crystal Clear Enamel. In fact, I think this paint basically is that same clear enamel with metal flakes mixed in, so adding the clear coat over it amounts to just another layer of the same, and you can add it at any time.

My first attempt was not that great, and I added several layers of clear afterward, trying to smooth out some mistakes, but it didn't work. I hadn't applied the metallic paint very evenly, so it looked splotchy, and I had a couple of spots where I sprayed too much, and it kind of pooled and made a visible spot where too much metal flake had settled.

The next day, all these problems were easily fixed. I sprayed on a light coat of clear to make a tacky surface, and then went over it with more light coats of the metallic flake. The key seems to be to keep the can at least a foot to foot and a half away from the rocket, and spray back and forth quickly. With other paints, I often am at 10 inches or even closer, and don't move as fast. This wants many many light coats. Also, the clear can go on immediately, if you want. Or wait and do it later. It doesn't seem to matter. You can keep layering flake and clear, and it adds depth, so the mistakes from the day before were really no problem at all.

This paint does dry super fast. It really is dry in about a half hour. I masked and repainted certain sections with other colors of the same family of metallic paint (red and black) within just an hour. I probably should have waited longer, but it worked pretty well. There is some minor tape damage, but it can probably be wet sanded out and then another coat of clear applied over it.

All things considered, I'm very pleased! I'll post some pictures later.

TB:
Just to be clear: We've now come full circle on this Issue "Rattle-Can Chrome Paint". Which is: There is NONE, other then the Alsa Corp Killer Chrome kit mentioned in Post #5.

Now after 47 posts to this thread, our collective conclusion is that our currently best bet for "Silver Rockets" is Rustoleum Metallic Silver #89137 which is a fine metal flake silver finish as suggested back in post 20.
I'm happy to see the horses can finally get a drink.

Micromeister said:

TB:
Just to be clear: We've now come full circle on this Issue "Rattle-Can Chrome Paint". Which is: There is NONE, other then the Alsa Corp Killer Chrome kit mentioned in Post #5.

Now after 47 posts to this thread, our collective conclusion is that our currently best bet for "Silver Rockets" is Rustoleum Metallic Silver #89137 which is a fine metal flake silver finish as suggested back in post 20.
I'm happy to see the horses can finally get a drink.

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Ha ha! Poor horses!

If I were making a "Shelf Queen" or making some other kind of model that would not be handled very much, I'd go with the Bright Coat that I used originally. It really does look truly like metal, not metal flake. But for a rocket that will be flown, it doesn't work well unless it has cured for a year, and even then, it's a bit fragile. For something that will get banged around and handled by dirty hands, this metal flake stuff is much better, even though it is a very different look.

It's really too bad, because rockets look great in metal! Especially sci-fi style rockets.

Micromeister said:

TB:
Just to be clear: We've now come full circle on this Issue "Rattle-Can Chrome Paint". Which is: There is NONE, other then the Alsa Corp Killer Chrome kit mentioned in Post #5.

Now after 47 posts to this thread, our collective conclusion is that our currently best bet for "Silver Rockets" is Rustoleum Metallic Silver #89137 which is a fine metal flake silver finish as suggested back in post 20.
I'm happy to see the horses can finally get a drink.

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I'm a stubborn old mule so I'm a gonna say that Rusto Bright coat is sure a hardenen up purdy like on the B 58. I have even wiped off some soot and grime and it stayed purdy shiny. It took a good three weeks in the dry climate but it did eventually cure. Like riding in the desert on a horse with no name.

ThirstyBarbarian said:

I repainted my rocket with the Rustoluem Stops Rust Metallic Silver. It's the metal flake paint, so not a truly realistic metal looking paint, but it is pretty nice looking paint. It is WAY more durable than the Bright Coat metallics, and it can be clear coated with Rustoleum Crystal Clear Enamel. In fact, I think this paint basically is that same clear enamel with metal flakes mixed in, so adding the clear coat over it amounts to just another layer of the same, and you can add it at any time.

My first attempt was not that great, and I added several layers of clear afterward, trying to smooth out some mistakes, but it didn't work. I hadn't applied the metallic paint very evenly, so it looked splotchy, and I had a couple of spots where I sprayed too much, and it kind of pooled and made a visible spot where too much metal flake had settled.

The next day, all these problems were easily fixed. I sprayed on a light coat of clear to make a tacky surface, and then went over it with more light coats of the metallic flake. The key seems to be to keep the can at least a foot to foot and a half away from the rocket, and spray back and forth quickly. With other paints, I often am at 10 inches or even closer, and don't move as fast. This wants many many light coats. Also, the clear can go on immediately, if you want. Or wait and do it later. It doesn't seem to matter. You can keep layering flake and clear, and it adds depth, so the mistakes from the day before were really no problem at all.

This paint does dry super fast. It really is dry in about a half hour. I masked and repainted certain sections with other colors of the same family of metallic paint (red and black) within just an hour. I probably should have waited longer, but it worked pretty well. There is some minor tape damage, but it can probably be wet sanded out and then another coat of clear applied over it.

All things considered, I'm very pleased! I'll post some pictures later.

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Basically, you'll find that ALL rattle can paints prefer to go on very fast in very light, thin coats... You'll get the best finish that way...

When I was in mechanic's school, the last few days in the shop working on diesel engines (we switched to a new class every three weeks) we had to repaint the valve covers and other engine parts that got any dings or scratches on them while we were working on them. I did the painting in my work group, and one guy asked me why I was "whipping the can past the part so fast"... "that's how you're supposed to do it", I told him...

When he saw how smoothly and evenly the paint went on with no hints of drips, runs, or sags, he was sold...

Later! OL JR

ThirstyBarbarian said:

It's really too bad, because rockets look great in metal! Especially sci-fi style rockets.

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I agree there! :grin: Heres a pic of a painted one [Kylon Original Chrome] beside a 15 year old heavily weather beaten/hanger rash aluminum leaf/gilding metal job. Believe me much better work can be done with the leaf than this but stand off it looks good. Its the only one I have left ATM. This one is coated with clear which has fogged a little probiblely from abrasion. The leaf metal can be left uncoated and it will oxide to a grayish aluminum look.


Richard

Miss-label jpg Original Chrome not Chome Classic

TheTellurian said:

I agree there! :grin: Heres a pic of a painted one [Kylon Original Chrome] beside a 15 year old heavily weather beaten/hanger rash aluminum leaf/gilding metal job. Believe me much better work can be done with the leaf than this but stand off it looks good. Its the only one I have left ATM. This one is coated with clear which has fogged a little probiblely from abrasion. The leaf metal can be left uncoated and it will oxide to a grayish aluminum look.


Richard

Miss-label jpg Original Chrome not Chome Classic

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Those are some nice looking rockets! I've never heard or aluminum leaf. Is that ultra thin aluminum, like gold leaf? Do you apply it with an adhesive?

I really like the retro style.

ThirstyBarbarian said:

Those are some nice looking rockets! I've never heard or aluminum leaf. Is that ultra thin aluminum, like gold leaf? Do you apply it with an adhesive?

I really like the retro style.

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Yes it's applied with a "size" varnish just like gold leaf. the size has to set up until it's tacky (about 1 to 3 hours before the leaf can be applied. gold, silver leaf come in 25 leaf books about 3-1/2" square, Aluminum leaf in about 5.5" squares sometimes in larger books 25 to 100leaf. regardless of material none are really Cheap to use, even seasoned sign men screw up loads applying them, it's a technique with a learning curve.

Yes its the same as gold leaf which often is a composite of copper not real gold. [gold is available though] The technique is as Micromeister says and it is very delicate material to handle. One 25 sheet book is about 5 square feet but there is a lot of waste in overlaps. In my area its going for about $15 a book so not that bad a cost after you learn how to handle it. On 3FNCs its much easier than on models like the one on the right with compound curves. It can be burnished down to a mirror like surface removing the many wrinkles with agate tipped tools but I was too lazy/cheap to do that. I haven't checked lately but I would think Utube would be a short cut on the learning curve. Lots of videos on how to do it.

I may do another rocket in aluminum and I'll post it here if I do.


Richard

Micromeister said:

Yes it's applied with a "size" varnish just like gold leaf. the size has to set up until it's tacky (about 1 to 3 hours before the leaf can be applied. gold, silver leaf come in 25 leaf books about 3-1/2" square, Aluminum leaf in about 5.5" squares sometimes in larger books 25 to 100leaf. regardless of material none are really Cheap to use, even seasoned sign men screw up loads applying them, it's a technique with a learning curve.

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TheTellurian said:

Yes its the same as gold leaf which often is a composite of copper not real gold. [gold is available though] The technique is as Micromeister says and it is very delicate material to handle. One 25 sheet book is about 10 square feet but there is a lot of waste in overlaps. In my area its going for about $15 a book so not that bad a cost after you learn how to handle it. On 3FNCs its much easier than on models like the one on the right with compound curves. It can be burnished down to a mirror like surface removing the many wrinkles with agate tipped tools but I was too lazy/cheap to do that. I haven't checked lately but I would think Utube would be a short cut on the learning curve. Lots of videos on how to do it.

I may do another rocket soon in aluminum soon and I'll post it here if I do.


Richard

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Thanks guys. That's a really interesting technique, and the finish is nice. It would be great to see a thread if you do it again.

ThirstyBarbarian said:

Thanks guys. That's a really interesting technique, and the finish is nice. It would be great to see a thread if you do it again.

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TB:
This morning I was looking on line for another item but ran across what I consider some pretty cheap aluminum Leaf on amazon.com 100Sheet pack for 5.99 plus 4.99 shipping. about 11 cents per leaf is right down there. last time I bought the stuff in 25sheet packs it was as Richard mentioned 15 bucks.

Gilding is an art form nearly lost these days with adhesive backed vinyl's with real gold leaf laminated. As I mentioned earlier it has a learning curve. If you get Standard
"XX Deep Loose Leaf" aluminum leaf, a Gilders Tip (wide very thin camel hair brush) is use to pick up the leaves with static from our hair or cloths. There are also "Glass leaf", and "Surface or Patent leaf" materials ie Gold, Silver and Variegated golds, In all the years I've been a sign painter I can't recall seeing surface aluminum leaf. Patent gold leaf is adhered to individual tissue backing sheets eliminating the need for a gilder tip to transfer the leaf to the application surface which is a much easier and faster method of application.

Most of us "Old timers" use Slow Size which take much longer to tack up but give considerably more time for the actual application of the gold leaf...or whatever leaf
It's also possible to create designs in the underlying size with the pointed end of your size brush making swirls, and other patterns in the tacky size just before applying the leaf.

To get the best coverage and ensure no missed areas it is best to overlap leaves at least 1/4" or so, these overlaps will later be burnished off (wiped) with a soft cotton cloth or wad of cotton balls. Leaving a smooth single surface that can be further burnished to a near mirror brightness.

Just the same as with any Mirror finish the sub-surface to which the leaf is being applied MUST be as nearly blemish free as humanly possible as each leaf will show every tiny bumps, recess, or hair.

Anyone wanting to experiment with this type application should NOT try leafing on the actual model first, do a couple runs on a scrap tube, nosecone or two to get the feel of how the material handles.
I've only done a couple Rocket applications with real gold leaf. mainly on the decent stage of PMC LEM's. which are NOT Mirrored but intentionally modeled and wrinkled.
Burnishing to a high mirror takes some time and elbow grease

Micromeister said:

TB:
This morning I was looking on line for another item but ran across what I consider some pretty cheap aluminum Leaf on amazon.com 100Sheet pack for 5.99 plus 4.99 shipping. about 11 cents per leaf is right down there. last time I bought the stuff in 25sheet packs it was as Richard mentioned 15 bucks.

Gilding is an art form nearly lost these days with adhesive backed vinyl's with real gold leaf laminated. As I mentioned earlier it has a learning curve. If you get loose aluminum leaf, a Gilders Tip (wide very thin camel hair brush) is use to pick up the leaves with static from our hair or cloths. their are also Glass leaf, and Surface leaf materials ie Gold, Silver and variegated golds, In all the years I've been a sign painter plus I can't recall seeing surface aluminum leaf. Surface gold leaf is adhered to individual tissue backing sheets removing the need for a gilder tip to transfer the leaf to the application surface.

Most of us "Old timers" use Slow Size which take much longer to tack up but give considerably more time for the actual application of the gold leaf...or whatever leaf
It's also possible to create designs in the underlying size with the pointed end of your size brush making swirls, and other patterns in the tacky size just before applying the leaf.

To get the best coverage and ensure no missed areas it is best to overlap leaves at least 1/4" or so these overlaps will later be burnished off (wiped) with a soft cotton cloth or wad of cotton balls.

Just the same as with any Mirror finish the sub-surface to which the leaf is being applied MUST be as nearly blemish free as humanly possible as each leaf will show every tiny bumps, recess, or hair.

Anyone wanting to experiment with this type application should NOT try leafing on the actual model first, do a couple runs on a scrap tube, nosecone or two to get the feel of how the material handles.
I've only done a couple Rocket applications with real gold leaf. mainly on the decent stage of PMC LEM's. which are NOT Mirrored but intentionally modeled and wrinkled.
Burnishing to a high mirror takes some time and elbow grease

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The results are very nice. Thanks for the info. This is probably not something I am going to dive into right away, but I might consider it down the road when I do more sci-fi style rockets.

ThirstyBarbarian said:

Thanks guys. That's a really interesting technique, and the finish is nice. It would be great to see a thread if you do it again.

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Winter project then.

deleted post :eyeroll:


Richard

TheTellurian said:

Winter project then.

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I have several models in the pipeline that I'm considering either leafing or use of the Alsa Corp. Killer Chrome kit purchased a couple months ago. It's just going to take some time to build the models and determine which finishing method I want to employ.