B 58 Hustler Model Rocket

I’m leaving on a jet plane, don't know if I'll be back again. Yes, Henry John Deutschendorf Sr. set the speed record in the B-58 as an elite Air Force pilot. Junior crashed his experimental Rutan Long-EZ, flying on a questionable pilot‘s certificate due to some other issues. So the question is will this rocket powered B- 58 fly like a Senior or Junior? After review by the top men at the club they may be putting me more in the junior category. But why?

This one doesn’t use girly man canted motors in the nose for virtual flame action to stabilize it like the Lancaster. No, this one is proper, with the motors on the bottom and me nose cones up top! I am trying to get the asymmetrical drag worked out with the landing gear, cute little drag inducers I call 'em. But as always there are a few other issues to work out with silly oddroc airplanes. On Six D12’s and at two pounds ten ounces I should be OK. Nose weight is all in the cones and the nose wheel, keeping it right above the thrust and keeping that centerline moving straight up. The D12 5 in the pod will poor boy dual deploy the chutes on the cone and body after the other D12 3s have gone, eliminating any nose wheel peril. Eight chutes in all will bring all the pieces down nice and soft. Another six motor park flyer for the kids. Mind sim and Hope sim have given me a lot of trouble on this one, maybe time for a new version or better operating system.

The pictures below show construction just about finished. Just more work on the cockpit, add the tail radar and a few more bits with the recovery system and then off to beauty school. The 1/72 B 52 decals should be coming in soon and lots of nasty silver painting await.

Hopefully I will get her done and the weather will be good up in South Park for a real Rocky Mountain High, if the Tripoli research boys are up for it.

You saw Winstons Thread did'nt you?

https://www.rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?69433-Convair-B-58-Hustler

This is one to watch for sure! Can't wait to see the video. I absolutely love your builds, Daddyisabar!

TopRamen said:

You saw Winstons Thread did'nt you?

https://www.rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?69433-Convair-B-58-Hustler

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Yep, they are talkin' about the real McCoy. This one is just about using left over parts from an estate, Hobby Lobby kits and stuff from the hardware store to make a silly oddroc.

g-train said:

This is one to watch for sure! Can't wait to see the video. I absolutely love your builds, Daddyisabar!

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Thanks. Hopefully there will be someone brave enough there to video. All six need to light and the drag and weight balanced enough to keep it going straight up.

It does look like a challenge, especially getting 6 motors to fire at once. I assume that the standard computer simulation codes are no help here. I think it was Daddy or someone else here on TRF that has made unusual airplanes fly before. I take it that the c.g. is inboard from the 5 D12's firing in the outer pods (one motor is firing in the aft end), so that the moment from those forces is countered by the air drag moment of the landing gear. Of course, once the motors stop thrusting and the coast phase is entered all the pods along with the landing gear are drag moments in the same direction. That would mean that the model will arc over to that side assuming that the model is basically stable. I do not have enough experience in these concepts to have confidence in my abilities, but I have seen these airplane model rockets work before on TRF. The proof is in the flying.

aerostadt said:

It does look like a challenge, especially getting 6 motors to fire at once. I assume that the standard computer simulation codes are no help here. I think it was Daddy or someone else here on TRF that has made unusual airplanes fly before. I take it that the c.g. is inboard from the 5 D12's firing in the outer pods (one motor is firing in the aft end), so that the moment from those forces is countered by the air drag moment of the landing gear. Of course, once the motors stop thrusting and the coast phase is entered all the pods along with the landing gear are drag moments in the same direction. That would mean that the model will arc over to that side assuming that the model is basically stable. I do not have enough experience in these concepts to have confidence in my abilities, but I have seen these airplane model rockets work before on TRF. The proof is in the flying.

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I will have the CG right behind the end of the crew compartment. Also trying to keep a weight balance between the main cones around the center line. That is why the canopy can not be made of heavy material. I just want it to go up under power. When the power eases off the inertia from the nose weight keep it going for another instant, but then at about 500 feet it can do what ever it wants to because ejection is soon to come with the D12-3s. It is the first 100 feet that worry me. Drag is a whole other problem. Most of the rocket is above the pods so that is why I put the landing gear down, to drag it in that direction instead of immediately flipping over to the top side. Ignition via a cluster box and trusty clip whip. NO STINKING STARTERS! No computer simulation, no swing test. Liberal Arts Major - oddroc model rocketry at its worst. But hey, it will look good.

Eight parachutes? Na - make it *glider* recovery [insert evil laugh]

sooner.boomer said:

Eight parachutes? Na - make it *glider* recovery [insert evil laugh]

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Making it glide would prove the builder used good technique, rocket science and knew what they were doing. I fall short on all accounts.

Daddyisabar said:

No computer simulation.

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I can't easily visualize how you could, even with Rocksim which allows pods. And even then, I doubt the simulation for such a truly odd(rock) configuration would be accurate. Still, your very conservative CG positioning always seems to result in good flights if the winds aren't too ridiculous.

But hey, it will look good.

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I'm sure it will.

This looks like a very cool rocket that should produce a thrilling and harrowing flight! Your club should just suck it up and invest in a bunker.

A little over stable never hurts on these types, especially on this one with the big nose wheel sticking out of the nose cone, That might be good for balancing weight and drag but what on Earth is that going to do to the CP?:y:

ThirstyBarbarian said:

This looks like a very cool rocket that should produce a thrilling and harrowing flight! Your club should just suck it up and invest in a bunker.

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That would be so awesome. Warm in the winter and cool in the summer, with lovely vision slits and big screens for visual tracking with high power cameras. A wet bar and hot tub to round out the amenities needed after a hard day’s launching. That’s how to spend the safety grant from NAR!

Daddyisabar said:

I will have the CG right behind the end of the crew compartment. Also trying to keep a weight balance between the main cones around the center line. That is why the canopy can not be made of heavy material. I just want it to go up under power. When the power eases off the inertia from the nose weight keep it going for another instant, but then at about 500 feet it can do what ever it wants to because ejection is soon to come with the D12-3s. It is the first 100 feet that worry me. Drag is a whole other problem. Most of the rocket is above the pods so that is why I put the landing gear down, to drag it in that direction instead of immediately flipping over to the top side. Ignition via a cluster box and trusty clip whip. NO STINKING STARTERS! No computer simulation, no swing test. Liberal Arts Major - oddroc model rocketry at its worst. But hey, it will look good.

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Daddyisabar:
Being one who just loves D12 Clustering. I thought I should mention the any D12 cluster beyond 5 motors is over the 125g propellant limit which will require your B-58 to be flown under an FAA waiver as a HPR Model.

Doing 6 motor is not really a problem with a relay system but you'll have to use a hi-amp Battery at the Pad not the contoller.
and I totally agree with you No "Starters" you absolutely need Pyrogen tipped Igniters for successful Cluster ignition.

As an avid PMC and Odd-Roc builder myself I have to say; you can and Darn well should do a two view(Top and Side) Cardboard cut-out of this beasty to get an average LCP to Check your static margin location of your proposed CG. Even this very odd shaped model is easily done with this method and while conservative in nature It more then compensates for the as you say "Liberal Arts at it's worst - Lets stick a motor in it and see if it flys mentality".
Love the Odd-rocs your producing...Hate the method your advancing & posting. There is absolutely NO reason to put people at risk and our hobby in a bad light just because you can't take the time to do the things to make it safe.
Safety First ALWAYS!

If it is going to fly it will be out where they launch the K sparkies and only in ideal conditions and on the thickest, longest rod I can find. The card board cut out is a good way to see where the surface areas equal out front and back, top and bottom and even just from the front, like the last photo. It was obvious from the get go the B 58 has some major issues with drag asymmetry, thus requiring the landing gear down and oversized fins on the main pod to try to compensate for the bigger airplane part on top. Getting it weighted right on the side view is the biggest problem; it is like gluing two different rockets together side by side and getting them to fly straight.

I have decided to add some additional “bulge fins” on the main and engine pods that will help some from the profile side, and the real one had slightly bulged pods so it should not hurt the looks too bad.

The front nose wheel doors are going on but don’t help much and will just act to bring the CP up, so they will be small.

The canopy will be as narrow and light weight as possible.

After consulting with the Pad Fuhrer and others the nose wheel is going to get redone for a bit more drag and definitely more weight, which is coming out of the canopy nose cone. Going to try to get to as close a 50-50 distribution off the centerline as possible, but now I am doubting how close I can get, or what I can get by with. The main pod cone is almost completely full and I would rather have more weight up front on the nose wheel, but we will see. A big heavy nose wheel sticking out there is a bit scary, but without it I see it just arching over into the ground from unequal weight distribution. I and my posse will have to "like it" before I stick motors in it and let it fly. That method has worked with the Arado, Lancaster and even the Val. And there is a growing possibility I might just conclude flying this version of B 58 is impossible, shelf queen it and go back to cozy canted motors on a D Va build.

This is going to be very, very good, or else very, very........

I admire you for even trying this one

she looks awesome!!!!! everyone of these birds you make are works of art!

Daddy....if you club does invest in a bunker...get one with a periscope...like the old pads had with Werner would be peering thru and all...

Daddyisabar said:

That would be so
awesome. Warm in the winter and cool in the summer, with lovely vision slits and big screens for visual tracking with high power cameras. A wet bar and hot tub to round out the amenities needed after a hard day’s launching. That’s how to spend the safety grant from NAR!

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In primer so if I get on the ball it might fly this weekend.

Daddy...how did she turn out? did you get to fly her?

Daddyisabar said:

In primer so if I get on the ball it might fly this weekend.

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The Rustoleum paint takes a long time to dry but very shiny. Hopefully decals tomorrow and fly it Saturday at the the Fall frenzy.

the dreaded silver paint job!! can't wait to see her!

Daddyisabar said:

The Rustoleum paint takes a long time to dry but very shiny. Hopefully decals tomorrow and fly it Saturday at the the Fall frenzy.

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Post Beauty School pictures. The paint takes forever to cure. Had to get ready for launch so I had trouble painting on the nose - wanted to orange peel. Wanted to fingerprint as well, nasty stuff you can't rush but I did anyway.

Pre-launch photos. Could not find any D12 3's at Hobby Lobby so had to borrow some from Dan's stash. The cluster box was not available but a system that could light an N motor could do six whimpy D12 kid's motors. Perfect weather and the half inch launch rod went on the high power pad. Sparkies were not starting fires so I was OK.

Daddyisabar said:

Post Beauty School pictures. The paint takes forever to cure. Had to get ready for launch so I had trouble painting on the nose - wanted to orange peel. Wanted to fingerprint as well, nasty stuff you can't rush but I did anyway.

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Wow! Very cool! Metallic paint is a real pain in the butt, isn't it?

That looks like it is going Mach sitting on the table.

Once again....you nailed it Daddy!

Sooooo.. Where's the launch report? WHAT HAPPENED?

WOW!!!!!!!
she is just beautiful!! awesome job!!!

Daddyisabar said:

Post Beauty School pictures. The paint takes forever to cure. Had to get ready for launch so I had trouble painting on the nose - wanted to orange peel. Wanted to fingerprint as well, nasty stuff you can't rush but I did anyway.

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is that your V-2?
beautiful rocklets there!!
can't wait to hear about the flight!!

Daddyisabar said:

Pre-launch photos. Could not find any D12 3's at Hobby Lobby so had to borrow some from Dan's stash. The cluster box was not available but a system that could light an N motor could do six whimpy D12 kid's motors. Perfect weather and the half inch launch rod went on the high power pad. Sparkies were not starting fires so I was OK.

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