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You know, that saying always bothered me. I can understand saying "Always assume a gun is loaded", but that above statement is just not true and it's like saying "All rockets CATO". Do they? No, but we should always assume there is a chance of it happening. My :2:

There...managed to get some rocketry stuff in on the gun conversation. ;)

I used to feel exactly the same way. My dad always said "all guns are loaded" as if it were fact and I would try to rationalize it the way you have. Logically and technically speaking you're correct, but I have since realized that his teaching that "all guns are loaded" created a sense of doubt of doubt in me that I will never forget. Now, even though I or someone else just dumped the magazine and emptied the chamber two minutes ago, I doubt myself. I have to check to see if it's unloaded, multiple time, almost like an OCD mannerism, but one that I hope will prevent the kind of complacency that kills gun owners far too often.


Steve Shannon
 
I used to feel exactly the same way. My dad always said "all guns are loaded" as if it were fact and I would try to rationalize it the way you have. Logically and technically speaking you're correct, but I have since realized that his teaching that "all guns are loaded" created a sense of doubt of doubt in me that I will never forget. Now, even though I or someone else just dumped the magazine and emptied the chamber two minutes ago, I doubt myself. I have to check to see if it's unloaded, multiple time, almost like an OCD mannerism, but one that I hope will prevent the kind of complacency that kills gun owners far too often.


Steve Shannon

Sounds like you've learned to assume that it's always loaded. :wink:

Kidding aside, safety is always paramount whenever working with anything that can cause serious harm or damage. :handshake:
 
After working for a gun dealer a number of years ago and witnessing 2 accidental discharges in the store, not only should every gun be treated as loaded, but pointed in a safe direction at all times.
 
I used to feel exactly the same way. My dad always said "all guns are loaded" as if it were fact and I would try to rationalize it the way you have. Logically and technically speaking you're correct, but I have since realized that his teaching that "all guns are loaded" created a sense of doubt of doubt in me that I will never forget. Now, even though I or someone else just dumped the magazine and emptied the chamber two minutes ago, I doubt myself. I have to check to see if it's unloaded, multiple time, almost like an OCD mannerism, but one that I hope will prevent the kind of complacency that kills gun owners far too often.


Steve Shannon

As one that has personally fired an unloaded firearm :facepalm:, I wholeheartedly support the "assume that all firearms are loaded" mindset. The incident was over 30 years ago while dry firing my brand new .22 lr Ruger Mark II, to learn proper trigger pull techniques. Several minutes into the exercise I lined up the sights on the old style round thermostat in the adjacent bedroom, about 15 yards away. Breathe, steady pressure and POW the unloaded pistol went off. :shock: The dead center hit destroyed the thermostat and deflected the bullet through the glass in a second floor window towards who knows what. No one was injured, thank the FSM, but I was damn lucky. It was a lesson I never forgot and I've already started teaching my girls proper weapons handling and muzzle discipline.
 
My hunting safety instructor used to sneak a blank shotgun shell into one of the shotguns the students brought and then pass it to one of the students and ask that student to "dry-fire" it, pointing safely of course.
He caught one student failing to check the chamber every course.
 
As one that has personally fired an unloaded firearm :facepalm:, I wholeheartedly support the "assume that all firearms are loaded" mindset. The incident was over 30 years ago while dry firing my brand new .22 lr Ruger Mark II, to learn proper trigger pull techniques. Several minutes into the exercise I lined up the sights on the old style round thermostat in the adjacent bedroom, about 15 yards away. Breathe, steady pressure and POW the unloaded pistol went off. :shock: The dead center hit destroyed the thermostat and deflected the bullet through the glass in a second floor window towards who knows what. No one was injured, thank the FSM, but I was damn lucky. It was a lesson I never forgot and I've already started teaching my girls proper weapons handling and muzzle discipline.

Layne,,
I'm really really sorry about this..
I truly take firearm safety more serious then you would believe..
So serious in fact that it can become fun restricting,,, a bit...

But jeez Layne,,

hahahahahahahahahahahaha
hahahahahabnahahahahahahahah

That so sounds like something that would've happened to my brother Steve and I....

I'm really sorry man..
I just hada get that out...lol...

Teddy
 
Layne,,
I'm really really sorry about this..
I truly take firearm safety more serious then you would believe..
So serious in fact that it can become fun restricting,,, a bit...

But jeez Layne,,

hahahahahahahahahahahaha
hahahahahabnahahahahahahahah

That so sounds like something that would've happened to my brother Steve and I....

I'm really sorry man..
I just hada get that out...lol...

Teddy

No problem.....
It is funny in hindsight.
 
No problem.....
It is funny in hindsight.

No,, No,,
Wait a minute,,
ya ready,,
I'm about 8 or 10 yrs old..
Let's say 10,,
because I was the youngest,, both older brothers went to boy scout camp,,
( my father was the scoutmaster for over 20 years ),,
I was too young to go to boy scout camp so I went to camp Integrity ( a local 3 affiliated camp,, my pop was a local 3 electrician ),,
At camp Integrity was the first time I was exposed to archery,, I loved it and kept my love for it my entire life..
After the summer my father bought me a red fiberglass recurve bow like the ones we used in camp
so I could shoot at out place in Pennsylvania,, he got me a hay target and all..
A year or 2 later,, the bow was at our home,, in the city,, I was in the basement..
I set up a target on one side of the basement,, I was all the way on the other side as far as I could get,,
probably about 30 ft,, close enough that it was an extremely easy shot for me.. I didn't miss,, no damage,, no one found out..
My brother David is 10 years older then me ( read,, he's 10 years taller then me )..
He see's this,, and wants to take a shot,, he's nowhere near as good with a bow as I was..
I spent the last 2 years shooting constantly,, he shot extremely rarely.. I begged him not to,, it wasn't a good idea..
He drew the bow,, released,, when he drew, neither of us noticed the top limb was behind a pipe that I couldn't reach..
When he released the top limb hit the pipe,, so only the bottom limb moved forward,, so the bow pointed up way too high...
The arrow went way too high over the target,, through the basement casement window and out into the backyard......

Teddy
 
No,, No,,
Wait a minute,,
ya ready,,
I'm about 8 or 10 yrs old..
Let's say 10,,
because I was the youngest,, both older brothers went to boy scout camp,,
( my father was the scoutmaster for over 20 years ),,
I was too young to go to boy scout camp so I went to camp Integrity ( a local 3 affiliated camp,, my pop was a local 3 electrician ),,
At camp Integrity was the first time I was exposed to archery,, I loved it and kept my love for it my entire life..
After the summer my father bought me a red fiberglass recurve bow like the ones we used in camp
so I could shoot at out place in Pennsylvania,, he got me a hay target and all..
A year or 2 later,, the bow was at our home,, in the city,, I was in the basement..
I set up a target on one side of the basement,, I was all the way on the other side as far as I could get,,
probably about 30 ft,, close enough that it was an extremely easy shot for me.. I didn't miss,, no damage,, no one found out..
My brother David is 10 years older then me ( read,, he's 10 years taller then me )..
He see's this,, and wants to take a shot,, he's nowhere near as good with a bow as I was..
I spent the last 2 years shooting constantly,, he shot extremely rarely.. I begged him not to,, it wasn't a good idea..
He drew the bow,, released,, when he drew, neither of us noticed the top limb was behind a pipe that I couldn't reach..
When he released the top limb hit the pipe,, so only the bottom limb moved forward,, so the bow pointed up way too high...
The arrow went way too high over the target,, through the basement casement window and out into the backyard......

Teddy


*thunk*
Message for you sir.....
 
I'd hate to beat the dead horse and drag on this friendly discussion :); however the "accidents" above could've been avoided as well by assuming all guns are loaded. The accidents actually happen when people assume it is unloaded and it isn't.

My issue is that "all guns are loaded" is just factually incorrect and therefore a lie. Trying to make that lie into a mantra does not make it "safer". I would argue that if it makes sense, why not say "all rockets have motors loaded". To me, telling people to believe in a lie just makes it less believable.

I'm likely the "safety-mindedest" person of all my friends and I always try to be safe with anything that can go wrong, but I don't see any difference between saying "assume all guns are loaded" and "all guns are loaded" other than the second one is not true.

Additionally, the last thing gun owners need are more untruths. :wink:
 
Last edited:
I picked up one of these little bad boys a few months back when there was a rebate. Shoots very well! :D

700VTR_Beauty-BipodDown.png
 
I'd hate to beat the dead horse and drag on this friendly discussion :); however the "accidents" above could've been avoided as well by assuming all guns are loaded. The accidents actually happen when people assume it is unloaded and it isn't.

My issue is that "all guns are loaded" is just factually incorrect and therefore a lie. Trying to make that lie into a mantra does not make it "safer". I would argue that if it makes sense, why not say "all rockets have motors loaded". To me, telling people to believe in a lie just makes it less believable.

I'm likely the "safety-mindedest" person of all my friends and I always try to be safe with anything that can go wrong, but I don't see any difference between saying "assume all guns are loaded" and "all guns are loaded" other than the second one is not true.

Additionally, the last thing gun owners need are more untruths. :wink:
In that particular case, you want the word "pretend"; since you know good and well they're usually empty, "assume" is less correct.

Me, I'm good with whatever words you choose as long as you keep it pointed safely and your booger hook off the bang stick.
 
Don't know how I haven't seen this thread before now!

Two of my three main hobbies! Guns and rockets! I think that many on here are in the same boat I am: My wife dreads it whenever a I come home from the local gun store or get new rocket parts in the mail!

For me, when it comes to firearms, my main area of interest is Eastern Bloc firearms. I have a small but growing collection that consists of 2 Mosin Nagant M91/30s from the 1920's (One Tula and one Izhevsk, both hex receivers), a Tula SKS from 1954, a Yugo M59/66A1 SKS, and a Bulgarian Makarov, with another Soviet Mak on the way. Add to those the Romanian and Yugo AK parts kits that I have stashed away.

Anyone else have an interest in Eastern Bloc weaponry?


Me :) I don't have one, yet, but there's a Mosin Nagant in my future. I had even went as far as to get a laser bullet for the future purchase. I'm a hotrodder, I got plans for it when it happens, it won't be stock for long. Like them so much I know how to differentiate a standard from a sniper. But , yeah, the plan is to leave almost nothing untouched, Just want the full length barrel for sure, no carbine for me. One I was looking at was a pre-WW1 Tula. like 1912 if I remember...I hated to let that one go :p
 
As one that has personally fired an unloaded firearm :facepalm:, I wholeheartedly support the "assume that all firearms are loaded" mindset. The incident was over 30 years ago while dry firing my brand new .22 lr Ruger Mark II, to learn proper trigger pull techniques. Several minutes into the exercise I lined up the sights on the old style round thermostat in the adjacent bedroom, about 15 yards away. Breathe, steady pressure and POW the unloaded pistol went off. :shock: The dead center hit destroyed the thermostat and deflected the bullet through the glass in a second floor window towards who knows what. No one was injured, thank the FSM, but I was damn lucky. It was a lesson I never forgot and I've already started teaching my girls proper weapons handling and muzzle discipline.


Buddy of mine found out the hard way that a Ruger Security 6 cylinder turns backwards to a Colt...and his wife's piano paid the price BANG!! .357 right in the B flat....
 
A public service announcement:

Ruger just issued a recall notice for ALL Ruger Mark IV .22 pistols.

Apparently an unspecfied series of activties can lead to an unexpected discharge. Ruger recommends returning such pistols immediately due to the danger of an truly accidental discharge.

Contact Ruger for details.
 
A public service announcement:

Ruger just issued a recall notice for ALL Ruger Mark IV .22 pistols.

Apparently an unspecfied series of activties can lead to an unexpected discharge. Ruger recommends returning such pistols immediately due to the danger of an truly accidental discharge.

Contact Ruger for details.

Wow, thanks for that! I've been a Ruger fan for years and have a number of Mks, but all are IIs and IIIs. Past winter I was considering the MkIV, but got some rifles instead.
 
The New .38 Special Colt Cobra – Full Review
Mixed feelings in the forum reply's below the review.

A Gunfighter’s Dream: The Ed Brown Special Forces .45 ACP – Full Review
KA-CHING $$$$
You are aware the Gunsamerica blog is the marketing arm of their website that sells guns and works with dealers, right? Their 'reviews' are really marketing pieces and not honest reviews. Not saying that they aren't necessarily always inaccurate but they always have to be taken with a handful of salt. While Ed Brown 1911's are fine handguns, the 'review' is clearly a marketing piece to convince us that EB's are worth their price. Are they 2x better than a Colt, Kimber, Sig, Springfield, or other $1,000 1911? Eye of the beholder.


Tony
 
You are aware the Gunsamerica blog is the marketing arm of their website that sells guns and works with dealers, right? Their 'reviews' are really marketing pieces and not honest reviews. Not saying that they aren't necessarily always inaccurate but they always have to be taken with a handful of salt. While Ed Brown 1911's are fine handguns, the 'review' is clearly a marketing piece to convince us that EB's are worth their price. Are they 2x better than a Colt, Kimber, Sig, Springfield, or other $1,000 1911? Eye of the beholder.

That is very true... I have lost all respect for that site after one of their writers posted an honest review of the Remington RP9, and then two months later, the main editor wrote a glowing review of it, and mentioned that Remington pretty much asked them to do it.

Here is the original review:
https://www.gunsamerica.com/blog/clay-takes-9mm-remington-rp9-full-review/

and here is the "correct" review:
https://www.gunsamerica.com/blog/remington-rp9-not-piece-****-full-review-rebuttal/
 
Need your sight to stand out with a bit of florescent green? So many ways to use RocketPoxy!

1500807716837.jpg
 
What happened?

OK, so life got in the way. It happens. But dang!!!

In the 1980's, I damn near lived at a firing range. I'd press a couple boxes of rounds in the evening, load up my gear the next morning, and when I'd get off work, straight to the range. Finish there, go home and eat dinner, then go out and press more rounds for tomorrow. I probably averaged around 3000 rounds a month in various rifle and handgun calibers. Learned absolutely tons, and had one hell of a lot of fun doing it.

Then we had the kid. So much for having a life. Buy a house, commute, deal with life in general, the rifles and handguns stayed in the safe.

When the daughter was 12, had opportunity to take her to a range. It was a bit of a drive, but taught her firearms safety, and how to shoot. Kid has good instincts and better eyes. And surprisingly enough, we found something where she will actually LISTEN to Dad. She did very well. The forth time she ever handled a rifle, she brought home a 3rd place trophy, having out-shot 9 adults in a formal competition, that had been shooting longer than she had been breathing. Unfortunately, the distance and other factors didn't allow us to continue that, and the contents of the safe went back into hibernation.

Now that I'm disabled and retired, I need something to do. Maybe get back to shooting. I just had a look... What the hell happened?

First, they've obsoleted one of my favorite cartridges. The 7mmRemBR. (Let me re-phrase that. They've obsoleted the cartridge for which one of my favorite pistols is chambered.) No more brass. Period. I can make it if I want to spend $300+ on dies, and go to the trouble of trimming, turning, and fire-forming it. Gee, thanks Remington. Now I have an XP100 for which I can't get ammunition. OK, so it wasn't the most accurate round ever designed... I'm still left with ~$1400 of handgun I soon won't be able to shoot. (Bought a box of 100 empty brass when I bought the pistol. They've all been fired 3x. They won't last forever.)

That's not the worst of it. Sure could use some powder. Open up the web browser, and let's have a look... Holy cow! A one pound can of 3031... $36. The last can I bought still has the sticker on the top... $7.99. And ammo... I used to complain about paying $7 a box for the really good competition 22LR rounds. Now, they're $25 a box. For fifty 22LR rounds. I'm sorry, but that's insane. Someone created an ammo shortage, people demonstrated their willingness to pay $25 a box, so now that there's no more shortage, it's still $25 a box. Thank goodness I still have a good supply of cheap, well-stored bulk 22 to shoot. $3 a brick for CCI Mini-Mags. (That's called being in the right place at the right time. The drive home was uphill all the way.) But it's cheap ammo and shoots like cheap ammo.

It's getting to where a guy can't even enjoy an afternoon of shooting. With range fees and ammo... $100+ for an afternoon. Just seems a bit high to me.

Anyone wanna buy a whole bunch of safe-queens? May as well take 'em to a dealer and sell 'em on consignment. Can't afford to shoot 'em any more...

Don't blink guys...
 
Someone created an ammo shortage, people demonstrated their willingness to pay $25 a box, so now that there's no more shortage, it's still $25 a box.

Ammo prices were driven sky high by consumer speculation and panic buying. At the same time, retailers and private sellers were also gouging. In my neck of the woods, prices for .22 LR are no where near what they were in the 90's, but then again, think about cars. A "nice" car in the 90's didn't cost 50K like today! :)

[video=youtube;PYMiC0GeLq4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYMiC0GeLq4[/video]
 

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