Can Dual Deployment be done without ematches

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Willie

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I want to attempt a Dual Deployment flight using my Wildman Jr. I can easily come up with a dual deployment altimeter, and I believe I can acquire black powder at one of the area's sporting stores. But....

I don't have a clue how to ignite any charges! My impression was that the Q2G2 ignitors were the answer, but they seem to be out of production. I came across directions to make igniters, but I'm not sure that is legal.

So, can dual deployment be done without ematches, and if so, how?
 
Yes-it IS legal to 'roll your own. In a hurry but check out quick burst and rocketflight e-match kits. Skylighter has them also. You want 'low current' matches-not 'motor starters' (eck!)
 
The easiest way is to use ejection canister from Pratt Hobbies - link. No need to design AV-bay with ejection wells, replace e-matches, etc. Simply fill one disposable canister, connect it to altimeter, and it's ready to fly. Throw away after the flight, no clean-up necessary. They are low current and work with any battery. Pratt hand-tests every single one of them, so they work literally 100% of the time. Obviously they cost a bit more, but it's worth every penny!
 
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I want to attempt a Dual Deployment flight using my Wildman Jr. I can easily come up with a dual deployment altimeter, and I believe I can acquire black powder at one of the area's sporting stores. But....

I don't have a clue how to ignite any charges! My impression was that the Q2G2 ignitors were the answer, but they seem to be out of production. I came across directions to make igniters, but I'm not sure that is legal.

So, can dual deployment be done without ematches, and if so, how?

Get what you need - directly from the Wildman https://www.wildmanrocketry.com/ShowProducts.aspx?Class=846&Sub=848
 
back to the OP's question - ejection without ematches. This has been done before using model airplane glow plugs. Aerotech has a unit called the EFC, that includes a timer for ejection:
https://www.valuerockets.com/product_details.aspx?pid=14&itemid=62

There is another company making a different product that gets connected to your altimeter:
https://www.lvhq.net/NoMatch/

While these look like good products, I have not tried them. Ematches just work.

The nomatch looks like an interesting concept, do you know anyone who has used this before?
 
I just bought some of these - haven't used them yet but I see lots of compliments from flyers in that thread:

https://www.rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?60469-CJ-s-WaCkY-WeD-Doing-dual-deploy-ya-need-these

I got 75 of these. I should have gotten 150. I flew my Emerald Dragon on a J510W using them, and Quick and Dirty on a pair of I200W's. All 4 matches lit flawlessly.

There is no reason to look any further.

14041061451_7b508758a6.jpg
14064619443_d9fe3f9077.jpg


I've got video of testing them in the thread listed above.
 
The nomatch looks like an interesting concept, do you know anyone who has used this before?
Nope. I was quite interested at one point, but never could get over the cost, since JTEKs or others are < $1 a shot and can be used simply.
 
I thank all of you! My question came from not knowing how to acquire ematches.

With your help, I now have a choice from many sources. Dual Deployment needs to follow the KISS principle, so I'm moving forward with BP, Ematches, and an altimeter. I picked up the BP today. Now, all I need is an altimeter, and to order the matches.

Again, I thank all of you. This forum has been a tremendous resource as I slowly acclimate myself to this wonderful hobby.

~willie
 
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back to the OP's question - ejection without ematches. This has been done before using model airplane glow plugs. Aerotech has a unit called the EFC, that includes a timer for ejection:
https://www.valuerockets.com/product_details.aspx?pid=14&itemid=62

There is another company making a different product that gets connected to your altimeter:
https://www.lvhq.net/NoMatch/

While these look like good products, I have not tried them. Ematches just work.

The No Match device looks interesting but $150.00 additional for dual deploy? I'd consider Crazy Jim's offer. I've rolled my own from scratch but it
takes work. Kurt
 
I pulled together ematches, BP, and a perfectflite Stratologger dual deploy altimeter. Constructed the Av-bay for the wildman Jr. (maybe I should post some pics, there is not a lot of room in there).

Electrically tested with the software, and with christmas tree lights. Followed that testing with a shop vac and christmas tree lights. All tested well.

Finished up today with real bp charges in the rocket to ensure appropriate separation.

My conclusion is 1 grams is great for the drogue (sustainer separate), and 1.25 grams will work for the main in the payload section that has 3 shear pins.

Now all I need is a High Power Launch to validate this in real practice.

Thank You All for the help.
 
Interesting thing is that at our last meeting I noticed someone test the altimeter firing off an Estes starter. The 9 volt battery seemed to do fine lighting it up. (Well actually one for apogee and one for main.)


Kirk
 
Not that I have evidence or any actual direct experience, but I've been told that is a bad idea. Maybe someone will clue us onto why that is not a good approach.


Willie
 
Yes, it can be done without ematches, and you were presented with good options. I have never tried the Pratt canisters, but have considered them in the past (doesn't seem like they hold an awful lot, is why I didn't). A word on the Quest igniters: individual vendors may have them even if the big stores are out. I know I saw a bunch hanging in the AMW trailer...


Later!

--Coop
 
Cant believe no one has ever used flashbulbs Sylvania AG-1 work excellant. Getting kind of hard to find camera shops usually have them. Probably find them on ebay. I still have about 50 left. And my Robbies ejection cannister.
 
Interesting thing is that at our last meeting I noticed someone test the altimeter firing off an Estes starter. The 9 volt battery seemed to do fine lighting it up. (Well actually one for apogee and one for main.)

I've used Estes ignitors to test my altimeters on the ground, but actually use ematches in flight. The igniters take a while to heat up while ematches "pop." Honestly, I am not sure how that would really affect their use firing ejection charges. But, Estes igniters seem too fragile and it's too easy for the lead wires to short for me to consider using them to fire an ejection charge.

If an igniter fails to launch a rocket, it's usually not a big deal. You just replace the igniter and try again. If the igniter fails to set off an ejection charge, it probably is a big deal. And you can't just run out and replace the igniter. :)

-- Roger
 
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This is what I am going to use:

https://pratt-hobbies.com/proddetail.asp?prod=SEC-5B

They're pricey, but all I have to do is add the powder and plug them in. I haven't tested them yet. I'll let you know how they work.

I have been using Doug Pratt's cannisters exclusively since 2000, and they just work. Great product and great company to do business with.


Sent from my iPad using Rocketry Forum
 
back to the OP's question - ejection without ematches. This has been done before using model airplane glow plugs. Aerotech has a unit called the EFC, that includes a timer for ejection:
https://www.valuerockets.com/product_details.aspx?pid=14&itemid=62

There is another company making a different product that gets connected to your altimeter:
https://www.lvhq.net/NoMatch/



While these look like good products, I have not tried them. Ematches just work.

I have seen crashes with glow plugs and ematches. Whatever you decide to go with please ground test the system several times before flying it.
 
Cant believe no one has ever used flashbulbs Sylvania AG-1 work excellant. Getting kind of hard to find camera shops usually have them. Probably find them on ebay. I still have about 50 left. And my Robbies ejection cannister.
Ha! I'm old school too! I loved the look on one guy's face when I drug the bird back into camp and he saw the flash bulbs dangling at the end of the deploy wires! Priceless!
 
I have been using Doug Pratt's cannisters exclusively since 2000, and they just work. Great product and great company to do business with.


Sent from my iPad using Rocketry Forum

Agreed. I haven't used the canisters yet, but he was great to do business with.
 
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