Russian Deputy Prime Minister Warns U.S. Could “Use Trampoline” to Access ISS

With more U.S. sanctions imposed on*Russia for its actions in Ukraine, Russia’s deputy...

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We should take the money we are sending to Ukraine(In Aid to help them against Russia), and spend it on our own Space Program instead.
We have no Business in Ukraine.

Bring on the Dragon capsule and to heck with Russia. It could be fast tracked through if needed.

TopRamen said:

We should take the money we are sending to Ukraine, and spend it on our own Space Program instead.
We have no Business in Ukrain.

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We don't spend money in Ukraine for space (perhaps some of it ends up there, but not much if any) but we DO spend $72 million a shot for our astronauts to launch to ISS aboard Russian Soyuz spacecraft and rockets... and return from ISS aboard Soyuz... Most if not all that money goes directly into the coffers of Roscosmos, the consortium that runs the Russian space program, which is basically to say their prime contractor. The Russian space program isn't organized like ours... it's basically inseparable from the Russian military rocket and missile program.

The entire ISS program has been a gigantic money funneling machine to Russia since it morphed into ISS from "Space Station Freedom" in the early 90's... Back then we took Russia into the ISS after their then-recent collapse to prevent Russian space and rocket scientists from going to North Korea, Iran, and other such "rogue states" to work on missile programs... since the Russian space program was collapsing and "couldn't afford to pay them". Strange how the Russians have continued to develop advanced generation five ICBM's though, despite their "bankrupt" status. Basically we "bought" the services of the Russians, paying them to complete the Mir II core and service module (Zarya and Zvezda) and add them to ISS, saving NASA from having to develop a multi-billion dollar service module for ISS. The Russian service module also provides reboost capabilities for the station necessary to keep it in orbit, and is refueled by the Russian Progress freighter/tankers which they originally developed to service their Salyut series and Mir space stations... relieving NASA from the task of having to develop an in-space refueling capability as well, and providing logistical resupply support, especially after the decision to retire the shuttles in the wake of the Columbia disaster in 2003. Progress, along with ATV by the Europeans, and HTV by the Japanese, and the COTS commercial resupply providers in the US (SpaceX's Dragon and OSC's Cygnus) will provide the logistical support originally envisioned as being shuttle-provided.

Eventually, Commercial Crew is supposed to replace the need for US astronauts to launch aboard Russian Soyuz vehicles, at a cost of $72 million per seat... What's sad is that Congress has HABITUALLY REFUSED to fund commercial crew at anything like the recommended levels, because it's not primarily aimed at funding well-established "space state" big traditional aerospace contractors (shuttle contractors primarily) and instead continue to strip NASA of funding in other areas to devote the lion's share of NASA funding into ISS program costs, and SLS/Orion development, both of which are FAR too expensive and YEARS (perhaps a decade) from actually being ready for service, and FAR FAR too expensive for ISS crew transfer or resupply missions... (Far too expensive for exploration missions too basically, which is why it's only going to launch at most every 2-3 years at MOST).

SO, while the US space program steadily erodes after the retirement of the shuttle program and the implosion of the Constellation program, with no manned spaceflight launch capabilities whatsoever, while space program contractor workers get pink slips by the tens of thousands, we spend $72 million bucks for every US astronaut that flies to ISS-- IN RUSSIA... essentially we send them over there with their bags packed and a $72 million dollar check in their pocket "payable to Russia".

There was quite the stir after whole new neighborhoods of multi-million dollar mansions sprung up outside Star City (the Russian equivalent of the Johnson Space Center in Houston-- hub of their mission control and manned spaceflight astronaut training programs) for space program pooh-bahs and generals... while cost and schedule overruns were rife in the ISS program we were funding by paying the Russians to finish Zarya and Zvezda and their other contributions to the ISS program... and these mansions supposedly paid for by folks earning "civil servant" salaries in Russia (which were a fraction of equivalent civil servant government employee middle-manager salaries in the US... Of course this was an "inconvenient truth" that was subsequently glossed over and basically ignored as the US leadership continued to make the Russian space program a cornerstone contribution to the US led (and largely US paid) ISS program... and put Russia on the critical path to ISS construction and sustainment...

I agree entirely... Congress SHOULD have made Commercial Crew the first priority of the US space program after Ares I was canceled with the implosion of the Constellation program. Heck they should have fast tracked a Commercial crew option as soon as it became clear that Ares I/Orion was not going to be safe, simple, or soon, and would be too late and too expensive for use on ISS...

Instead, they've contented themselves to spend billions and decades developing a mega-rocket out of old shuttle parts that will only fly every couple years or so at most, and sending our astronauts over to Russia with a $72 million dollar check for their Russian ride to orbit...

Actually, if the Russians "cut us off" that might be the best thing that could happen... it would light a fire under the idiots in Washington to actually figure out whether or not they want to have a space program and what kind of program it should be... and figure out how to actually fund the d@mn thing...

LateR! OL JR

You missed my Point Luke. I never said that we are spending that Money in Ukraine for getting to Space.
We are supposedly sending 1 Billion Dollars in Aid, and other Millions in support to them to help them in their futile attempt to dissuade Russia from doing whatever it feels like doing in their Country.
It is not our Fight, and we have no business getting involved in MY OPINION.
We should tell Russia to do as it pleases, since it is their Backyard, not ours, and the "Aid" should be put toward getting us off of our Dependancy on their Space Program.

TR is right. The Ukraine is Russia's backyard and their freedom to get to do what they want there is far greater then ours.

TopRamen said:

You missed my Point Luke. I never said that we are spending that Money in Ukraine for getting to Space.
We are supposedly sending 1 Billion Dollars in Aid, and other Millions in support to them to help them in their futile attempt to dissuade Russia from doing whatever it feels like doing in their Country.
It is not our Fight, and we have no business getting involved in MY OPINION.
We should tell Russia to do as it pleases, since it is their Backyard, not ours, and the "Aid" should be put toward getting us off of our Dependancy on their Space Program.

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Oh, ok... you might have phrased it a little better... you didn't mention foreign aid at all, and sorta implied that we were spending money over there on space since that was what the discussion was about....

At any rate, I couldn't agree more... Personally I would end ALL foreign aid, except in case of dire emergencies in countries who are are avowed and steadfast friends... IE not any country supporting terrorism or who've been at war with us in the last 50 years...

I also agree that we should invest that money we're blowing over there to fix the problems with our own space program... and that it's their mess, and the Russian's backyard, and it's their business and not ours...

Later! OL JR

aerostadt said:

TR is right. The Ukraine is Russia's backyard and their freedom to get to do what they want there is far greater then ours.

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It may not be tomorrow, or maybe not next year, or even in 5 or maybe even 10 years... but sooner or later, we'll have to clean up our backyard, IE MEXICO, like in eventually having to take it away from the cartels taking it over... and when we do, we don't need the Russian's making a stink in our backyard... And we don't need to make a mess in their backyard...

Later! OL JR

Sorry, I went back and fixed my Post to reflect my actual intent. I was not very clear at first about what I was implying the Money was going to the Ukraine for.
Good Point about Mexico Luke! That is "Spot on"!

Flood the market with cheap natural gas and starve russia into submission.

cwbullet said:

Flood the market with cheap natural gas and starve russia into submission.

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Cheap natural gas... that I'd love to see...

And where do you propose to get that??

Later! OL JR

The Ukraine is situation where the cards are stacked against us. As others have said it is not in our backyard. The situation is not exactly the same as the Cuban Missile Crisis, but the backyard hypothesis is very similar. At some point the Kennedy's, John and Bobby, realized that the US had the upper hand and played the situation to our advantage. The Caribbean Sea was often referred to as "Mare Nostrum" or "our sea". We even have the Guantanamo Naval Base in the midst of Cuba. Castro has invited us to leave Cuba since 1959, but it has never happened. BTW the Russians have a naval base in Crimea. Does that sound familiar?