Build Thread - "OROC NXRS 2014 Research Test Vehicle" by Binder Design

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AlnessW

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Well, I must say I quite enjoy doing these build threads! So I thought I should do another one for my second off-season build project.

Background
At the end of last year, OregonRocketry was talking about selling a "Commemorative NXRS Kit" as a fundraiser for the club. We had seen Mike Fisher at Binder Design do various commemorative kits for Washington Aerospace's annual FITS launch in years past, so we asked him if he would be willing to sponsor a similar design for OROC:

NXRS Rocket-1_001.png

...and this is what he came up with! He even offered it in 2 different sizes - 3" and 4". (With 38mm and 54mm motor mounts, respectively.) I was originally thinking about ordering one of his new kits, but as soon as I saw this rocket, I instantly wanted to build one.

NXRS Contest
As part of the deal, Mike is also sponsoring the "Binder Design Max Q Challenge" at NXRS 2014 this year. The rules were very simple - fly a STOCK BUILT (no fiberglass/carbon fiber) NXRS commemorative rocket as high as you can using a commercial or research motor. The highest flyer with the 3" rocket wins a 3" Max Q Aerospace aluminum fin can, and the highest flyer with the 4" rocket wins a 4" fin can.

Purchase
Earlier this year, our publicity director started taking pre-orders for the kit. For club members, they were offered with a small discount. I was quick to order a 4" kit, with the dual deploy upgrade. As soon as they were ready, fellow forum member chuck5395 was kind enough to pick up the pre-ordered kits from Mike in Salem and delivered them to the OROC meeting this last Thursday night. Thanks Chuck!

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And here she is!

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A "Fisher series premium kit," no less!

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Avionics bay and dual deploy kit upgrade.

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Unpackaging everything. Feels like it's Christmas morning all over again! :wink:

This afternoon I looked through all the parts. This will be my 3rd Binder Design build and I'm really looking forward to it. (I have the Excel Plus and the Galaxy.) Mike Fisher makes some truly excellent kits.
 
An interesting challenge. It might be easier in the 3 inch version, which would likely survive a full J, but it is probably a balancing act of not shredding the 4 inch one on a longburning K motor.
 
An interesting challenge. It might be easier in the 3 inch version, which would likely survive a full J, but it is probably a balancing act of not shredding the 4 inch one on a longburning K motor.
An interesting challenge indeed! I'm really looking forward to seeing all the other entries. Personally, I'll be flying a commercial *mrmm-huh* longburn motor.

Let the game begin!
You bet! :)
 
An interesting challenge. It might be easier in the 3 inch version, which would likely survive a full J, but it is probably a balancing act of not shredding the 4 inch one on a longburning K motor.

3" will survive a J570, K250 is no problem in the 4". The 4" tubing goes up on K250's all the time. Either one of those motors is a serious contender for the prize barring someone who cooks up something special for it. The contest is open to research and commercial. Good luck to all.
 
3" will survive a J570, K250 is no problem in the 4". The 4" tubing goes up on K250's all the time. Either one of those motors is a serious contender for the prize barring someone who cooks up something special for it. The contest is open to research and commercial. Good luck to all.

Good stuff! Thanks Mike.
 
Well, now that I'm back home and unpacked from Brothers, time to continue building...

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54mm motor mount tube, 2 centering rings, and an aft thrust ring sanded and ready for glue.

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The aft centering ring and thrust ring are "sandwiched" together - clamps help this process.

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Fins nicely sanded and beveled using the orbital sander.

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Setting fins.

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Booster section ready for the next step.

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One really cool thing about Binder kits is that they come with "modular" fin can assembly. As shown here, after all 3 fins are tacked in place, the fin tabs at the end of the airframe are cut free using an exacto blade, and the entire fin can is removed. Now we can do internal fillets, glue the forward centering ring in place, attach the drogue harness, etc before putting it all back inside the rocket.
 
An interesting challenge. It might be easier in the 3 inch version, which would likely survive a full J, but it is probably a balancing act of not shredding the 4 inch one on a longburning K motor.

Why would a longburn shred its the kick butt motors you should be worried about. Nice looking build so far
 
Why would a longburn shred its the kick butt motors you should be worried about. Nice looking build so far

I meant that on a k300 there is still the possibility of a shred. Obviously you wouldn't use an L1030, for example.
 
Nice clean Binder build, doesn't get any better.
You've got that right! I really enjoy doing these builds, and like others have said, these things are light enough for an H, yet strong enough for a K moonburner.

Why would a longburn shred its the kick butt motors you should be worried about. Nice looking build so far
Thank you! Exactly - I'd worry about an K700W or an L935, not a longburn. I remember seeing a FITS Flyer turn to confetti on an L640 once.

I meant that on a k300 there is still the possibility of a shred. Obviously you wouldn't use an L1030, for example.
Right.
 
How do you think it would do with a K1100T?
Would do just fine! I asked Mike this a while ago and he said that stock kits fly on the K1100T all the time. I've got a K805G to burn, too... :wink:
 
Crapola... missed out on ordering the kit due to a few family hickups (like both vehicles needing $$$$$$). I hear that the kits are still available, and I have a K300LB around here somewhere.

Looking forward to seeing your build!
 
Crapola... missed out on ordering the kit due to a few family hickups (like both vehicles needing $$$$$$). I hear that the kits are still available, and I have a K300LB around here somewhere.

Looking forward to seeing your build!

Thank you Rob! Yes, the kits are still available, just not released to the "general public" yet. As I understand, they should be available for purchase on the Binder Design website in the near future. A K300 would be fun!
 
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Doing the first set of internal fillets using Bob Smith hobby epoxy. No need to make them pretty since it'll all be inside the rocket.

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Forward centering ring and eyebolt in place - where I'll attach the drogue harness.
 
I meant that on a k300 there is still the possibility of a shred. Obviously you wouldn't use an L1030, for example.

Hope that wont shred on a K-300 something wrong if it does. I would put at least a L1030 in it maybe even KBA L-2300 or K-1750
 
I remember seeing a FITS Flyer turn to confetti on an L640 once.

I've heard reports that the rocket in question was not built per instructions. It was missing the front centering ring so the motor tube was assembled canted which put asymmetric thrust on the airframe. I've seen our stock tubing fly on L's, but I don't endorse any motor above K. K250 long burn is no problem. K550, K1100 are pretty common, or even K700 if built properly. Even our Galaxy which has swept delta fins full of holes has survived the K1100, much to my surprise. If someone mixes up a long burn L, in the L400 to L500 range, that would get some serious altitude.

I just added this kit to the web site. https://binderdesign.com/store/page2.html I'll add a link to the MAX Q Aerospace fin can contest rules soon.
 
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I guess I'd better get mine out of the packaging and get busy....
Indeed!! I'm counting 4 weeks until Spring Thunder and 10 weeks until NXRS... Which 4" rockets were you planning to have ready this year? The X-Plane and the NXRS rocket? I recall you had a few other Binder kits on hand that you were going to put on the shelf for later building.

I've heard reports that the rocket in question was not built per instructions. It was missing the front centering ring so the motor tube was assembled canted which put asymmetric thrust on the airframe. I've seen our stock tubing fly on L's, but I don't endorse any motor above K. K250 long burn is no problem. K550, K1100 are pretty common, or even K700 if built properly. Even our Galaxy which has swept delta fins full of holes has survived the K1100, much to my surprise. If someone mixes up a long burn L, in the L400 to L500 range, that would get some serious altitude.

I just added this kit to the web site. https://binderdesign.com/store/page2.html I'll add a link to the MAX Q Aerospace fin can contest rules soon.

Yikes...no wonder the airframe was quick to give way! I remember that shred from one of the summer launches at Brothers last year. Do you recall who's rocket that was?
My Excel has flown the K270W to about 9K and I'd feel MUCH more comfortable flying the K250W in it than the K700W. (But maybe someday... ;) ) No way I'd ever put an L in a stock kit, although I have seen fully-glassed birds handle them just fine.

Mind if I notify the OROC email list that the kit is now available on your website? (Thanks for doing that, by the way!)
 
Finally back in the rocket shop - been heads-down at school and at work this past week.

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Fillet on the forward centering ring - completing the fin can assembly.

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The fin can is then epoxied into the airframe. This takes a little planning ahead to make sure you get a good amount of epoxy on both the forward and aft centering rings. As the instructions suggest, a piece of string tied around the aft end helps ensure a snug fit while the glue sets up.

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Here we have the 12" octagon drogue chute that comes with the dual deploy upgrade. Some say that the Binder Design drogues are TOO small, but hey, it's a drogue, dammit - I WANT the rocket to descend quickly! I must say, that gold should sparkle very nicely in the sky.

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Assembled drogue harness. Attached to the kwik-link on the far right will be the av-bay.
 
Some say that the Binder Design drogues are TOO small, but hey, it's a drogue, dammit - I WANT the rocket to descend quickly! I must say, that gold should sparkle very nicely in the sky.

If I had my way there wouldn't even be a drogue because you really don't need one with these kits. The drogue just helps control the parts and keep them from going stable, it does not have to be very large. I prefer drogue-less. Just separate the parts at apogee and let them fall is my usual MOA.
Assembled drogue harness. Attached to the kwik-link on the far right will be the av-bay.
View attachment 170046
I know you already know this, but your drogue is attached in the wrong place. It should be just a foot or two from where the av bay attaches (per instructions). Chute is always attached closer to the part being ejected to ensure it gets pulled out of the tube crisply.
 
Indeed!! I'm counting 4 weeks until Spring Thunder and 10 weeks until NXRS... Which 4" rockets were you planning to have ready this year? The X-Plane and the NXRS rocket? I recall you had a few other Binder kits on hand that you were going to put on the shelf for later building.

Ready to fly 4"?
Binder Thug (I really want to get a drag race going with these)
Madcow SuperBatray
Madcow Frenzy
Binder Sentinal
Clone LOC IV(I am changing this over to a night flyer with a NightBow in the nose.

Almost ready 4"
X-Plane SST

New in bag 4"
Binder NXRS Test Vehicle
Binder Lightning Bolt
Binder Raptor

I like my 4" kits!
 
If I had my way there wouldn't even be a drogue because you really don't need one with these kits. The drogue just helps control the parts and keep them from going stable, it does not have to be very large. I prefer drogue-less. Just separate the parts at apogee and let them fall is my usual MOA.
Interesting to know! You're right, I've found that a chute this size does essentially make the design drogueless.

I know you already know this, but your drogue is attached in the wrong place. It should be just a foot or two from where the av bay attaches (per instructions). Chute is always attached closer to the part being ejected to ensure it gets pulled out of the tube crisply.
That is true - I usually put the drogue somewhere on the "upper" 1/3 of the shockcord, but re-thought placement a bit for this rocket. The main reason being that the upper (main) section of the rocket is longer than the fin section. If I were to put the drogue close to the av-bay, I would worry about the 2 sections of the rocket banging into each other on decent and/or blowing the upper tube into the lower tube on main deployment. It's the exact same design I'm using in my Comp 4. I may have to tweak a few things when I assemble the main harness and see what it will all look like when fully deployed.

Save the rubber bands that come on your produce for this purpose. String works ok but the wide rubber band is the ticket. :)
Good idea! :) By the way, I also just used your dowel trick to peel away an inside layer of the 54mm motor tube - worked REALLY well!! I test-fitted my 54/1706 case and it slides right in effortlessly now. Then I went and used that trick on my 2 existing Binder Design rockets!

Ready to fly 4"?
Binder Thug (I really want to get a drag race going with these)
Madcow SuperBatray
Madcow Frenzy
Binder Sentinal
Clone LOC IV(I am changing this over to a night flyer with a NightBow in the nose.

Almost ready 4"
X-Plane SST

New in bag 4"
Binder NXRS Test Vehicle
Binder Lightning Bolt
Binder Raptor

I like my 4" kits!
Yep, 4" is fun! Very versatile and being able to reach down into the airframe is also a big help. ;) I understand the WAZZU and the Eagles rocket have both been retired?

While we're at it, let's take a look at my 4" fleet...

Existing vehicles:
Excel Plus
Galaxy

"Almost ready" new fleet additions:
NXRS rocket
Competitor 4
 
By the way, I also just used your dowel trick to peel away an inside layer of the 54mm motor tube - worked REALLY well!! I test-fitted my 54/1706 case and it slides right in effortlessly now. Then I went and used that trick on my 2 existing Binder Design rockets!

Simple unless you've already sealed the ends of the tube with CA. :facepalm:

Since I've already mentioned wood glue, here's another hint for those entering the Max Q challenge to win a fin can......If you are using a high impulse motor and are worried about shredding.....remember no glassing allowed.....You could seal the whole insides of all of the tubes to harden them up. Now unless you have a big pocketbook and a respirator I do not recommend CA, although that would make them very hard and strong. Personally, I would use lacquer sanding sealer and a brush. If you do this you'll have to sand the mating surfaces smooth again until you are happy with the fit.

That is all I've got for now.
 
Simple unless you've already sealed the ends of the tube with CA. :facepalm:

Since I've already mentioned wood glue, here's another hint for those entering the Max Q challenge to win a fin can......If you are using a high impulse motor and are worried about shredding.....remember no glassing allowed.....You could seal the whole insides of all of the tubes to harden them up. Now unless you have a big pocketbook and a respirator I do not recommend CA, although that would make them very hard and strong. Personally, I would use lacquer sanding sealer and a brush. If you do this you'll have to sand the mating surfaces smooth again until you are happy with the fit.

That is all I've got for now.

Fortunately no CA-sealing on those.

Good advice on the airframe reinforcement, however I am not using a high-impulse motor for my attempt. Curious to know what Chuck has planned, though... :wink:
 
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