Estes Vector Force

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gdjsky01

gdjsky01

Kim's Rocketeer
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I don't have to tell most of you the 'firesale' Estes had in December. I like many others stocked up on all manner of kits I otherwise would not have given a second (or third) thought to for the normal (or even normal discount) price. But at the prices Estes was selling things for, things changed. The parts alone were often worth buying the kit for.

So the Vector Force was one of those kits that I bought several of. Looking back I see it sold for $4 ($6 . I figured I could build one, and the transitions and such would be useful on some other scratcher some day.

Picture one is the parts. I had already filled the wood on the nose and transitions with fill n finish or in the case of the largest transition, bondo spot putty. The large transition had gouges to fill and two sides were flat at the larger end, not round. As if the stock used was slightly too small. I could bitch, but it was $4 ($6 really).

The fin sheet was warped all to hell. But as you can see in the photos I wet both sides and put it between weights and when it dried, it was fine. I could bitch but it was $4 ($6 really).

Also you can see I started the motor mount. I got eager to get going and didn't have the camera with me. :)

2014-02-01-Vector-Force-0002.jpg 2014-02-01-Vector-Force-0001.jpg​
 
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Why the build uses through the wall fins? Who knows? But it does and I have no issue with it. After gluing the 2 piece fins together I gave them a sanding from 220 to 400 grit.

I left the rear ring off the motor mount and put all the fins in with some wood glue on the roots. Once it looked like the fins were touching the MMT and cleared the ring holding the engine clip, I glued in the rear ring, set the fin alignment, and let it all dry.

Then a small wood glue fillet on all fins. Here's a few pics. As you can see, you can move along pretty quick.

I might add the tubing seems nice. Very very small if any grooves.

The middle section will be used for an Estes Altimeter hence the small vent holes.


2014-02-01-Vector-Force-0003.jpg 2014-02-02-Vector-Force-0004.jpg 2014-02-02-Vector-Force-0005.jpg 2014-02-02-Vector-Force-0006.jpg​
 
Nice looking kit you have there. Got a question about your Loc style kevlar cord. Whats the smallest size tube you think that method is feasible? I am guessing BT 55. I used it on my Ventris and really liked it.

Thanks, Dave
 
I agree, smaller than that you need to be really careful (which you should be anyways) to smooth down the ends so nothing can get caught.

Thanks for looking!
 
So I have just about wrapped this one up. I like the look of the rocket. Just have to clear coat it.

2014-02-16-Vector-Force-0001.jpg

So take a close look... anything jump out at you... anything seem off?

Yeah...

So I am gonna rant for a minute. :rant:

Look, as I have said a few times now, I bought this at Estes' sale in December. Maybe I paid 5 or 6 bucks. I don't recall right now. But its was sweet deal... So I really should not complain. :wink: But Estes never said these were 'Seconds'. So ARE they? Estes?

Otherwise did ANYONE take one out of the container when they first came from China and BUILD one? They didn't notice there were only decals for ONE side of the fins? Or did they can say "F' it?" Or did the bean counters say too bad... it's too late? What about the Beta or Alpha builds where you build one BEFORE they make a million of them?

Again, I suppose I should be happy. I got it for $5 or $6. But man I'd not feel the same way had I paid retail or even 30% off. And I'd still like to know if Estes is selling seconds and if so, was that disclosed and I just missed it?

I know I can call Christine and being the best in the business like she is, she'd make it right. But I really wonder.
 
Oh and lest you think I am just 'Raggin' on Estes, trust me, I know how important they are to the Hobby. But I have given them enough dough over the years to be entitled to my rant.
 
Estes has been doing 'one sided' rockets since at least the early '70's...be thankfull you got decals most of the ps2 birds (1st 4) don't come with any.
Rex
 
I haven't combed through all the kits that I purchased during the December sale. I did pull out a Reflector kit and start to build it. I noticed that the fin sheet was warped, and that there wasn't enough decals to make the fins look like they do in the catalog.

If Estes got stuck with seconds, then I think Estes got ripped off by the Chinese government with which myriad American companies do business with. Wake up America.

For the pittance I paid for each kit, I say, so effing what... I don't care if some of these kits are seconds. Most of what I received is in fine shape.

I purchased a Vector Force kit too - for spare parts only. It's a cheap bag of good parts, esp. balsa parts, that I can use for other things. Nothing I received, including the Reflector kit that I am building, is even an inconvenience, a speed bump, or a challenge to my modeling skills.

-Wolf
 
First of all I think you did a fantastic job on the build. Very nice and what a great paint job! I can see where you are coming from with the decals and wanting a complete set, but afterall they were just decals that could easily be made. Now I could see if you were missing parts to the kit that didn't allow you to finish the construction process. Now that would be different and I would raise that to ESTES.
 
"I bought this at Estes' sale in December. Maybe I paid 5 or 6 bucks. I don't recall right now. But its was sweet deal... So I really should not complain. :wink: But Estes never said these were 'Seconds'. So ARE they? Estes?"
I doubt they are seconds, there was probably just one big first production run. I'm just guessing at that.

"Otherwise did ANYONE take one out of the container when they first came from China and BUILD one? They didn't notice there were only decals for ONE side of the fins? Or did they can say "F' it?" Or did the bean counters say too bad... it's too late? What about the Beta or Alpha builds where you build one BEFORE they make a million of them?"
Probably Yes to all

"I know I can call Christine and being the best in the business like she is, she'd make it right. But I really wonder."
Estes would make it right! But like you, for the price I'm not complaining - much.
They might send another kit with more decals, they probably wouldn't fit the other side of the fin.
These four decals are cut at an angle for the left side of the fin.

From Rich DeAngelis' review of the Vector Force on RocketReviews.com:
"Another small issue is the cool yellow/gray stripes for the fins. As there are 4 fins with two sides each, I expected to find 8 stripes - but there were only 4 of them!"
That review was from August of 2011, long before the big December sale.

My Reflector (also from the December sale) only had four out of the eight fin decals needed to match the face card illustration.
It looks okay, but would look better with decals on both sides of the fin.
I wanted it to look like the older Centuri catalog model decal treatments.

Reflector 40A.JPG

My Quest Stiletto was missing some USAF and Star and Bar decals.
How many of us were disappointed looking for the decals in your first The Launch Pad kits?
I'm lucky that I can draw and print decals that are "okay" for use. They're not great and they are not white.

Kits should include all decals to match the face card (computer touched up) picture.

I agree, Jeff!
Sell what you advertise, advertise what you sell!
 
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AfterBurners said:
First of all I think you did a fantastic job on the build. Very nice and what a great paint job! I can see where you are coming from with the decals and wanting a complete set, but afterall they were just decals that could easily be made. Now I could see if you were missing parts to the kit that didn't allow you to finish the construction process. Now that would be different and I would raise that to ESTES.
Click to expand...

Agreed! But the missing decals were white. Most builders don't have the Alps printer to make white decals.
 
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hcmbanjo said:
Agreed! But the missing decals were white. Most builders don't have the Alps printer to make white decals.
Click to expand...

I didn't realize that, but I understand. IDK - I see your point but for me I would be more concerned with the quality of the parts than with decals. I know if I really wanted them I would just give Mark a call @ Stickershock, Probably charge a few extra bucks, but you get a quality set.
 
I went back and looked and the fins as you mentioned only have decals for one side, so I don't think that you actually got short changed. I remember when I bought my Big Daddy and it was at the regular price I had decals that were only for one side of each fin so that's just the way the kit comes. I would have just applied the decals according. I don't understand your rant? That's just the way the rocket kit comes from the manufacturer, not sure why, but it is what it is.
 
I kind of think a rocket would look weird with decals for both fins like that. You can see two at any one time ... Do you need to see the decal twice ?


Sent from my iPhone using Rocketry Forum
 
I thought the OP was missing decals if so I would probably say something if it was really that important. Great price on the kit for $5.99. They have a few nice kits that anyone would be tempted to buy.
 
As Chris said:

Because of the angle on the fins you need 8 to be symmetrical. Four a mirror of the other four, or two and two You can not just put two of what they gave you on one fin. Even tho it seems maybe some did.
Look at the parts photo above. Despite appearances to the contrary I am not a complete idiot! :) :lol:

The decals are all cut for one side. Had I been able to use two on one fin, even if the face card shows different, I'd have done that.

Also I am not ragging on China or trade policy. That's a different thread.

My point was in IMO it was miss by Estes. Or maybe they already have disclaimers that say it won't look like the face card. And I know the PS-II don't have decals. And I know TLP Kits don't... I guess alls I was saying is it seemed disappointing to me that there are four fin decals and they match one side of all four fins. I'll figure something else out for the other sides.

Oh and to the one guy that compliment me on the model, :lol:, thanks! :)

Like I said, for 6 bucks I get to say my piece, but I can't whine TOO much. :)
 
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Think of it this way. My 10 year old son sees the Der Red Max package with a skull parachute and says, "WAY COOL" and buys it. Then you get a blank parachute when you open the package and a note about Chinese lead paint. Big let down for a stoked child. Sorry but this was known by the company and still sold by the company as a misrepresentation.

If you show it on the package, include it in the package or put a notice on the package that states otherwise.
 
Just to be clear, it looks goofy to me to have one stripe decal on one fin and a blank non-mirrored on the other. It would have been fine to at least mirror and put one the other side of that fin. I went ahead and put them on figuring I'll do some small vinyl on the other side. There is no way I think a yellow self made decal will be opaque enough on a black background. (Unless I use Chris's white/clear decal trick)

And to be clear:
Like I said, for 6 bucks I get to say my piece, but I can't whine TOO much.
 
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With the Estes stuff from China you never know. I had two Interceptor E kits bought maybe a year apart. The quality difference between the two was very noticeable. From low to just plain horrible. It is real dern hard to be a complete Estes Homer anymore. I tell the fellers to remember to good ole days when Estes was the only game in town, when you would have to genuflect when you opened the '74 catalog to the page with Vern's photo and his Klingon beard. Where is the Love guys? They just keep on Bashin'. Estes. TLP, Quest all get their wrath. But in the end I give up and just join in with the bashin' and rantin' cause it is so much dern fun. Now where did I put that rubber shock cord?
 
Glad to see this thread. I got a Vector Force from the sale as well and liked reading this build thread. Good job on it.

Mike
 
Please explain the LOC shock cord attachment.

Thank you.


So many rockets, so little time, and money.
 
Lowpuller said:
Please explain the LOC shock cord attachment.
Click to expand...

Thread Highjack Alert! Go find another thread! Or use the search feature.

Jeff - I hear you. I don't think you're an idiot. And you built something nice despite low expectations. The fin stripes are so easily added without resorting to an ALPS printer to make water slide decals. You could even paint them on by hand or use a paint stick.

-Wolf
 
Thread Highjack Alert!
How many more of us have a two car garage and no way can we get a car in it?
 

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