Mini Eagle Claw mod for Dual Deploy - Build Thread

Next up... The new Wildman Mini Eagle Claw.

I like dual deploy so I have decided to modify her for Dual Deploy.

With the kit I ordered an extra length of body tube for the payload section (15") and a coupler tube (8"). Since I'm going to "design" the mods as I go, I ordered the parts longer than necessary, and will cut to needed length during the build. I also plan to shorten the sustainer tube if space allows.

I'm using a Slimline motor retainer (also shown).

Here are the parts (after a thorough bath):

1st issue: Motor retention...

In the Mini Eagle Claw Specs thread...

https://www.rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?45044-Min-Eagle-Claw-Specs

There is discussion of the motor retention options (friction, estes style, aeropack, slimline,...)

I have decided to go with Slimline. Extend the MMT out the back of the boat tail. No modifications to the parts... Simple / secure.

Here's the look (dry fit)

qquake2k said:

Is that the Slimline retainer from Giant Leap? Which altimeter will you use?

Click to expand...

Good Morning Jim!

Yes. Giant Leap Slimline Quicklock 29mm.

I'm going to use the Adept22. I'd prefer to use a smaller battery than a 9V,... but the price is right on the Adept22's... The battery is the compromise. My BH29DD ended up in a canal... I'm glad I had an Adept22 in that! Until I need more complex features... I'm sticking with the Adept22's.

Quaranta said:

Good Morning Jim!

Yes. Giant Leap Slimline Quicklock 29mm.

I'm going to use the Adept22. I'd prefer to use a smaller battery than a 9V,... but the price is right on the Adept22's... The battery is the compromise. My BH29DD ended up in a canal... I'm glad I had an Adept22 in that! Until I need more complex features... I'm sticking with the Adept22's.

Click to expand...

Good morning to you too, sir! I ordered a Slimline retainer for my Astrobee-D, but never used it. It fit really loose on the 29mm motor tube, and with a 29/180 case in it, it didn't catch very many threads. I was not impressed with it. I too am going with Adept22's for my dual deploy flights. I have one for my Milestone, and I also bought an Adept22 and a DDC22 for the X-Plane. The DDC22 will be for redundant backup.

https://www.rocketryforum.com/showt...atch-build-the-Astrobee-D&p=339355#post339355

qquake2k said:

Good morning to you too, sir! I ordered a Slimline retainer for my Astrobee-D, but never used it. It fit really loose on the 29mm motor tube, and with a 29/180 case in it, it didn't catch very many threads. I was not impressed with it. I too am going with Adept22's for my dual deploy flights. I have one for my Milestone, and I also bought an Adept22 and a DDC22 for the X-Plane. The DDC22 will be for redundant backup.

https://www.rocketryforum.com/showt...atch-build-the-Astrobee-D&p=339355#post339355

Click to expand...

Mine was loose on the BT as well. I added 2 wraps of kids construction paper covered with long set JB weld to fill the gap. Construction paper really soaks up the glue and equalizes the gap keeping the retainer centered on the MMT. The bond is still plenty strong for motor retention.

I didn't test a case in the retainer prior to install... I just assumed it would be fine. Guess what I'll be doing after the glue sets!! (the glue has tacked up at this point so might as well let it go at this point and hope for the best!)

I have CTI 29mm 6/3/2/1 Gr cases... (was your case AT/RT (Rouse)?)

Edit: followed your link. Interesting that it varied with the case... Based on your pics, I think I'll be OK with the CTI cases / closures.

Tested CTI 29mm cases in the GLR Slimline. Perfect fit. No issue at all.

Next up... CR's and Shock Cord bonded to MMT.

I notched the forward CR to accept the Kevlar. I swapped out the ~ 10' of Kevlar (shown in 1st pic) that came with the kit for 14' of slightly smaller (1/8" / 750#) Kevlar (shown in bonded pics. This was sourced from Fuddrucker a few weeks back).

MMT section now put aside to cure overnight.

Now to decide on airframe dimensions...

I don't want this rocket to be the space challenge that my BlackHawk-29 Dual Deploy (shortened from stock) is... so I'm leaving some margin in my sections. I'm building to accomodate a 29mm 6Gr case.

Dimensions will be as Follows:

Body tube will be shortened 3". Stock BT = 22". Total BT length = 19". (Note this is only the 38mm tube).

Av Bay Coupler is currently 8". I'm shortening this to 7". This will house an Adept22, Featherweight Magnetic Switch, and a 9V battery. There will be a 1" switch band on the Av Bay Section (thus 3" intrusion into both the sustainer and payload sections).

The Payload Section is currently 15". I'm cutting this to 12".

Net result... my version will be 10" longer than stock.

Just thinking ahead...

The CNC nose cone is beautiful... but it is heavy. 4.9 Oz.

The stock version may need the extra weight in the nose,... but I suspect my lengthened Dual Deploy version will not. I'll probably swap this out for a light weight nose cone. Final decision will be made on sim file once I get a little further along. Early sim results show that I'm good with the lightest NC I can find.

I would expect the nosecone was selected deliberately due to the forward fin area of the Eagle Claw/Talon design.

Quaranta said:

Just thinking ahead...

The CNC nose cone is beautiful... but it is heavy. 4.9 Oz.

The stock version may need the extra weight in the nose,... but I suspect my lengthened Dual Deploy version will not. I'll probably swap this out for a light weight nose cone. Final decision will be made on sim file once I get a little further along. Early sim results show that I'm good with the lightest NC I can find.

Click to expand...

Tubes cut. Ends sanded square.

Main BT now = 19".
Payload Section = 12".
Av Bay Coupler = 7"
Switch Band = 1"

dixontj93060 said:

I would expect the nosecone was selected deliberately due to the forward fin area of the Eagle Claw/Talon design.

Click to expand...

That's my assumption as well... Especially with the larger 29mm motors.

Well that's it for today. Tomorrow I'll sand the fins and get the BT bonded. I'm deviating from the instructions a touch here... in that I'm going to bond the BT before doing any fin work. My hope is I'll still have great fin alignment,... but I'll have an easier time hiding the seam between the body and the boat tail.

Check your fin slots when installing the tailcone. Either my BT slots or tailcone slots were off a smidge. If I had just laid out one slot line then one fin would have been pretty far out. I laid out all three slot lines and then was able to cheat each one and split the difference so its hardly noticeable. This may have just been my kit but I figured I'd let you know so you can check it out before you epoxy.

maxvelocity said:

Check your fin slots when installing the tailcone. Either my BT slots or tailcone slots were off a smidge. If I had just laid out one slot line then one fin would have been pretty far out. I laid out all three slot lines and then was able to cheat each one and split the difference so its hardly noticeable. This may have just been my kit but I figured I'd let you know so you can check it out before you epoxy.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the heads up. I was planning on drawing alignment lines for each of the 3 fins, and rotating the BT to obtain the best fit (3 choices). I'll pay close attention. Thanks again.

maxvelocity said:

Check your fin slots when installing the tailcone. Either my BT slots or tailcone slots were off a smidge. If I had just laid out one slot line then one fin would have been pretty far out. I laid out all three slot lines and then was able to cheat each one and split the difference so its hardly noticeable. This may have just been my kit but I figured I'd let you know so you can check it out before you epoxy.

Click to expand...

Quaranta said:

Thanks for the heads up. I was planning on drawing alignment lines for each of the 3 fins, and rotating the BT to obtain the best fit (3 choices). I'll pay close attention. Thanks again.

Click to expand...

In the end I had the same experience. 1 slot was minimally off by perhaps 1mm. Careful positioning made it imperceptible. Having 3 alignment lines is key.

Here's the progress...

BT attached to MMT/Boat tail assembly. Current weight (with MMT and Kevlar) = 10.6 oz.

Switch band attached to Av Bay. Current weight = 2.8 oz.

Payload tube. Current weight = 3.4 oz.

Nose Cone. Current weight = 4.9 oz. At this point I've decided to swap nosecones for a light weight version.

Fins have been sanded.

I haven't scuffed root surfaces for bonding yet (will do this after dry fit). Tail fins are asymmetric,... leading edges are marked to ensure correct installation.

Beautiful weather in South FL today...

Bonding the fins...

Quaranta said:

Beautiful weather in South FL today...

Click to expand...

So that's your excuse for not building?!!? :tongue: don't blame ya'

dixontj93060 said:

So that's your excuse for not building?!!? :tongue: don't blame ya'

Click to expand...

:grin:

Come on down. Lunch is on me!

What motors do you plan to fly this on?

MasonH said:

What motors do you plan to fly this on?

Click to expand...

I'm going to fly it at my local field (MPR ltd) on big G's, and at my HPR field on H's. No tracking,... so that'll be the limiting factor.

Quaranta said:

I'm going to fly it at my local field (MPR ltd) on big G's, and at my HPR field on H's. No tracking,... so that'll be the limiting factor.

Click to expand...

For this size rocket I'd rather have tracking than dual deploy.

Quaranta said:

Next up... The new Wildman Mini Eagle Claw.

I like dual deploy so I have decided to modify her for Dual Deploy.

Click to expand...

I had the same idea -- ordered a 4" coupler and 12" length of aiframe with mine. Afterwards I realized that the 38mm airframe on the MEC and the Wild Child have a thinner wall than the regular airframe. The nose cones that come with these kits fit fine, but I don't like the way the joint between the payload bay (purchased separately from the kit) and the nose cone looks. If you use a different cone, that won't be an issue for you, but you will still have a mismatch between the airfram and the e-bay.
I haven't decided what to do about it yet. I likely will try to get a piece of the thinner airframe from WildMan.

NikeMikey

Just buy another of the mini Wildman kits and you will have extra parts. You can buy another kit for almost the price of a tube and another nose cone.
gp

dixontj93060 said:

For this size rocket I'd rather have tracking than dual deploy.

Click to expand...

I hear you. For MPR field, tracking isn't an issue. For my HPR field... it is.

But, the main reason I built this rocket was to have 2 DD rockets that I can fly at my MPR field. (My Black Hawk 29 is the other). Tool for the job I suppose.

NikeMikey said:

I had the same idea -- ordered a 4" coupler and 12" length of aiframe with mine. Afterwards I realized that the 38mm airframe on the MEC and the Wild Child have a thinner wall than the regular airframe. The nose cones that come with these kits fit fine, but I don't like the way the joint between the payload bay (purchased separately from the kit) and the nose cone looks. If you use a different cone, that won't be an issue for you, but you will still have a mismatch between the airfram and the e-bay.
I haven't decided what to do about it yet. I likely will try to get a piece of the thinner airframe from WildMan.

NikeMikey

Click to expand...

Interesting, mine are the same and fit perfectly. I must have gotten the same tubing as Payload section.

(I have pics but site won't allow uploads currently. I'll upload later.)

Current pics...

Next task... Av Bay construction.

Adept 22
9 V Battery
Featherweight mag switch.