Looking for some "to buy" suggestions..

86mustang408w said:

I've launched a lot of my LPR, but as far as the MPR I'm just getting into the building progress. I've been taking the tips on here and putting them to use for my future building. I learned a while ago to ask first rather than regret later. I'm having a rough time now with physical therapy, and am slowly starting to put things in motion.

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Good luck with the PT. It's difficult and painful but worth it. I hope you start feeling better and get a chance to complete some of the MPR builds and do some launches soon. I'm at a similar point in my rocketry experience in that I've done plenty of LPR but am interested in MPR with the restriction that the most convenient launch fields are not big enough for much altitude.

I'm completing my last LPR build right now. In fact it's flyable right now. I just want to paint it before I consider it done. It's an old Estes.kit called the Silver Comet, based on the Estes V-2, but with 1950's SciFi styling. I modified the mount so that it would accept 24x95 motors, so I could fly it on E's or F's, but I'd lose it for sure. At least I think I'd lose it. Hopefully I'll get a chance tomorrow to try it on C11 and D12 and see how it goes.

I'm sure I'll enjoy flying it, but the whole time I was building it I was wishing I was building something larger. And thats why i got a little chuckle out of reading your thread and watching you trade up to larger and more complex rockets without seeming to build the ones you've already got!

Once I'm done with the current build, I'd like something in the MPR range that I could fly safely on E, F or G motors in my local park. I've been following threads of members who are at about the same stage I am and have similar goals for the kinds of rockets they are looking to build. I'm looking forward to seeing how your builds go.

Best of luck with you health and your rocketry! Keep us posted.

Any updates?

Not yet, I feel like I should have. I planned on building about 2 weeks ago but had some serious problems with meds my dr had me on. Ended up in the ER from it. The stuff I'm on now seems to be working for me, anyways I'm gonna give it a go this weekend. I may be looking at another surgery soon,if that happens ill be down again. I'm still having trouble gripping/holding things, so I don't think ill be building a lot. Plus I have no heated space I can paint, that's kind of been holding me off too. I will post pictures as soon as I get the new builds done.

86mustang408w said:

Not yet, I feel like I should have. I planned on building about 2 weeks ago but had some serious problems with meds my dr had me on. Ended up in the ER from it. The stuff I'm on now seems to be working for me, anyways I'm gonna give it a go this weekend. I may be looking at another surgery soon,if that happens ill be down again. I'm still having trouble gripping/holding things, so I don't think ill be building a lot. Plus I have no heated space I can paint, that's kind of been holding me off too. I will post pictures as soon as I get the new builds done.

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Yikes... Get well soon.

I just ordered an Estes Executioner, which I am hoping will come soon. I think this kit is recently out of production, but I found a site that claims they can send me one. It's like a slightly taller Maxi Alpha 3 with a few slightly upgraded MPR type components. This will be my first step into the lower end of MPR, so I'm kind of excited!

86mustang408w said:

Not yet, I feel like I should have. I planned on building about 2 weeks ago but had some serious problems with meds my dr had me on. Ended up in the ER from it. The stuff I'm on now seems to be working for me, anyways I'm gonna give it a go this weekend. I may be looking at another surgery soon,if that happens ill be down again. I'm still having trouble gripping/holding things, so I don't think ill be building a lot. Plus I have no heated space I can paint, that's kind of been holding me off too. I will post pictures as soon as I get the new builds done.

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I'm sorry to hear about your medical problems. I pray that you'll feel better soon.

ThirstyBarbarian said:

I just ordered an Estes Executioner, which I am hoping will come soon. I think this kit is recently out of production, but I found a site that claims they can send me one. It's like a slightly taller Maxi Alpha 3 with a few slightly upgraded MPR type components. This will be my first step into the lower end of MPR, so I'm kind of excited!

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The Executioner is a great rocket! It's a good stepping stone from LPR to MPR.

qquake2k said:

The Executioner is a great rocket! It's a good stepping stone from LPR to MPR.

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Thanks for the pics!

A good stepping stone from LPR to MPR is exactly what I am looking for in this rocket. I finished my Silver Comet two weeks ago and have flown it a few times in my small local park. I've flown it on C11's and I've also flown it on D12's with the addition of a payload section I have built to keep it low and slow. (As Captain Low and Slow, any advice you have along those lines is appreciated. My local park is small.)

In those two configurations the Silver Comet goes to about just under 200 feet and just over 300 feet. Those are altitudes I'm comfortable with in this park. The Silver Comet with the payload section is very similar in dimensions and weight to the Executioner, so I'm expecting the Executioner to fly similarly on D12's.

I'd also like to fly it on black powder E9's and E12's, and on single use composite D's and E's. These flights would be my first experience with E motors and with composite motors, so my first time dipping my toe into MPR. Any advice would be appreciated. (I should probably start my own thread instead of hijacking this one. Just got a little carried away in my post!)

ThirstyBarbarian said:

Thanks for the pics!

A good stepping stone from LPR to MPR is exactly what I am looking for in this rocket. I finished my Silver Comet two weeks ago and have flown it a few times in my small local park. I've flown it on C11's and I've also flown it on D12's with the addition of a payload section I have built to keep it low and slow. (As Captain Low and Slow, any advice you have along those lines is appreciated. My local park is small.)

In those two configurations the Silver Comet goes to about just under 200 feet and just over 300 feet. Those are altitudes I'm comfortable with in this park. The Silver Comet with the payload section is very similar in dimensions and weight to the Executioner, so I'm expecting the Executioner to fly similarly on D12's.

I'd also like to fly it on black powder E9's and E12's, and on single use composite D's and E's. These flights would be my first experience with E motors and with composite motors, so my first time dipping my toe into MPR. Any advice would be appreciated. (I should probably start my own thread instead of hijacking this one. Just got a little carried away in my post!)

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Keep in mind a composite E will more than double your altitude. If you have the room, though, go for it! I would recommend that if you are going to get into MPR, get a reload case and buy reload motors. It's a lot cheaper in the long run, and a lot more fun. I really wish I had started using reloads a lot sooner.

https://www.hobbylinc.com/cgi-bin/s8.cgi?cat_s=T&str_s=24/40

qquake2k said:

Keep in mind a composite E will more than double your altitude. If you have the room, though, go for it! I would recommend that if you are going to get into MPR, get a reload case and buy reload motors. It's a lot cheaper in the long run, and a lot more fun. I really wish I had started using reloads a lot sooner.

https://www.hobbylinc.com/cgi-bin/s8.cgi?cat_s=T&str_s=24/40

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I definitely will consider the reloads, but will probably work into them from what I already know. I can use this 24/40 case in this rocket with the standard Estes E motor mount without modificatios, correct? And the single-use Aerotech E's will work too? I seem to remember someone saying the Estes E retainer clip will not work with certain composit motors.

I just started my own thread about the Executioner so as not to hijack this thread:

https://www.rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?51351-Help-me-execute-my-Executioner-build

Your not hijacking anything, I think this threads covered about everything I could hope to learn. lol..

ThirstyBarbarian said:

I definitely will consider the reloads, but will probably work into them from what I already know. I can use this 24/40 case in this rocket with the standard Estes E motor mount without modificatios, correct? And the single-use Aerotech E's will work too? I seem to remember someone saying the Estes E retainer clip will not work with certain composit motors.

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I've used both Aerotech reloadable and single use motors in my Executioner. It has the motor clip. I might have some photos of a motor in it somewhere.

I'm mixed on reloads myself, I don't think I'm gonna be launching very much. The closest clubs I have found are a good 3 hour drive. I don't see myself going to very many launches, I would love to get my L1 though. I think I'm gonna suck it up and start building this weekend, pain or not. I went to the local welding shop and got a 60" x .250" rod for $3 or $4 dollars about a month ago. I ordered a Partizon from Hobblinc too, the bottom tube was pretty much ruined from them putting the nose cone in it for shipping, so I wrote to Estes and asked them if I could get a new one, and they sent me an entire new rocket free of charge!! I couldn't believe it! That's about all I have as far as updates. Oh I went to Wal-mart and got a bunch of painting/sanding supplies. I cant wait to get started on these rockets, I doubt I'll do a build thread but I'll post in here for sure once I get some of them done. I want to get on my scratch build in open rocket, but for some reason cannot get it on my computer, I thought about sending someone the specs to see if its gonna work out. Thanks again qquake2k for all the help, I was looking back through the thread and its funny how much I learned since I started the thread. I'll keep it updated on here, I didn't think this thread would go on for so long.

86mustang408w said:

I'm mixed on reloads myself, I don't think I'm gonna be launching very much. The closest clubs I have found are a good 3 hour drive. I don't see myself going to very many launches, I would love to get my L1 though. I think I'm gonna suck it up and start building this weekend, pain or not. I went to the local welding shop and got a 60" x .250" rod for $3 or $4 dollars about a month ago. I ordered a Partizon from Hobblinc too, the bottom tube was pretty much ruined from them putting the nose cone in it for shipping, so I wrote to Estes and asked them if I could get a new one, and they sent me an entire new rocket free of charge!! I couldn't believe it! That's about all I have as far as updates. Oh I went to Wal-mart and got a bunch of painting/sanding supplies. I cant wait to get started on these rockets, I doubt I'll do a build thread but I'll post in here for sure once I get some of them done. I want to get on my scratch build in open rocket, but for some reason cannot get it on my computer, I thought about sending someone the specs to see if its gonna work out. Thanks again qquake2k for all the help, I was looking back through the thread and its funny how much I learned since I started the thread. I'll keep it updated on here, I didn't think this thread would go on for so long.

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It looks like the price of single use E's has come down at Hobbylinc, or the reloads have gone up, or both. A reload is only about $0.50 less than an SU now, so you'd have to launch quite a bit to recover the cost of the case. But there are a lot more choices in reloads than SU.

Open Rocket should run on any computer as long as you have Java installed. OR isn't installed, you just download it to your computer and double click it to open it. I love Open Rocket, that's how I design all my scratch builds now. Post your specs here, and I'll see what I can do with them.

qquake2k said:

It looks like the price of single use E's has come down at Hobbylinc, or the reloads have gone up, or both. A reload is only about $0.50 less than an SU now, so you'd have to launch quite a bit to recover the cost of the case. But there are a lot more choices in reloads than SU.

Open Rocket should run on any computer as long as you have Java installed. OR isn't installed, you just download it to your computer and double click it to open it. I love Open Rocket, that's how I design all my scratch builds now. Post your specs here, and I'll see what I can do with them.

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I need Java on it. SU?(single unit??) I'm not sure of the weights, and still playing with the fin design. The body tubes are 45" all together. 3 sections, a coupler with a baffle in the top sections. I was planning on D or E engines(500-600 ft flights tops), the MMT will prob be 15" too with 3 CRs, one on each end and one in the middle of the lower BT(all BT-80). I got the nose cone from hobbylinc(I believe its 11.25" long? Also BT-80). The lower fins will be about the lenght of the lower BT. So approx 15" long in a triangle shape and was planning on 6" wide. I want another set of fins in the same shape centered over the last BT section where ill have the baffle. Those will be 7.5" in length, prob 3.5" wide, and also in a triangle shape. I'm still debating on 3 or 4 fins. At one point wanted 5 or 6 but I think that's not gonna happen. I have 2-24" chutes I planned on using, but I know it may be overkill but I have the 42" from the Gforce I'm prob gonna use. I'm not sure of how much if any weight ill need in the nose cone. Since I'm on D or E's just a normal MM with a hook I bought. If you need more info ill post...thank you again..

qquake2k said:

I've used both Aerotech reloadable and single use motors in my Executioner. It has the motor clip. I might have some photos of a motor in it somewhere.

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I don't have an SU (single use) motor, so I can't illustrate that. But you can see that the D to E spacer fits on top of the 24/40 case. Then it fits right in the motor mount. I wrap a piece of masking tape around it to make sure the case doesn't slip past the hook.

86mustang408w said:

I need Java on it. SU?(single unit??) I'm not sure of the weights, and still playing with the fin design. The body tubes are 45" all together. 3 sections, a coupler with a baffle in the top sections. I was planning on D or E engines(500-600 ft flights tops), the MMT will prob be 15" too with 3 CRs, one on each end and one in the middle of the lower BT(all BT-80). I got the nose cone from hobbylinc(I believe its 11.25" long? Also BT-80). The lower fins will be about the lenght of the lower BT. So approx 15" long in a triangle shape and was planning on 6" wide. I want another set of fins in the same shape centered over the last BT section where ill have the baffle. Those will be 7.5" in length, prob 3.5" wide, and also in a triangle shape. I'm still debating on 3 or 4 fins. At one point wanted 5 or 6 but I think that's not gonna happen. I have 2-24" chutes I planned on using, but I know it may be overkill but I have the 42" from the Gforce I'm prob gonna use. I'm not sure of how much if any weight ill need in the nose cone. Since I'm on D or E's just a normal MM with a hook I bought. If you need more info ill post...thank you again..

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Without having put it into Open Rocket, it seems to me you might have too much fin. Two sets of fins that big, going that far up the body, might make it unstable.

qquake2k said:

Without having put it into Open Rocket, it seems to me you might have too much fin. Two sets of fins that big, going that far up the body, might make it unstable.

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I was kind of thinking that too. I can make them smaller. Just need to know how big I can...

I orig planned on 2 BT-80's at 15", and the nose cone. But added the last tube when I placed my last Hobblinc order. I don't wanna waste your time trying to figure it out for me, I just need to get Java on my computer I'm just horrbile with using them. I had wanted to make a Super Big Bertha clone but I ended up just buying one still in the shrink wrap. Do you have any suggestions for the scratch build I was hoping for(if you have time)?...

Something like this?

View attachment 86 Mustang.pdf

Here is the Open Rocket file in case you get OR working on your computer.

View attachment 86 Mustang.ork

qquake2k said:

It looks like the price of single use E's has come down at Hobbylinc, or the reloads have gone up, or both. A reload is only about $0.50 less than an SU now, so you'd have to launch quite a bit to recover the cost of the case. But there are a lot more choices in reloads than SU.

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I was thinking the same thing --- it saves some money, but not much. The real advantage would be the flexibility to dial in exactly what kind of engine you want. But another drawback is that it seems like it would require a lot more rigamarole between flights. I think I would rather buy single use motors and be able to take a handful of them out to the park for back-to-back flights. Anyway, single-use will be a way for me to dip my toe into composite motors without too much commitment.

qquake2k said:

Open Rocket should run on any computer as long as you have Java installed. OR isn't installed, you just download it to your computer and double click it to open it. I love Open Rocket, that's how I design all my scratch builds now.

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It worked on mine exactly like you described. I downloaded it and just put the file in a folder where I am keeping other rocketry stuff. Click on the file, and the program opens. I was afraid that because I am on a Mac, I might not be able to use this awesome program everyone was talking about, so I was really happy to see it in Java and cross-platform. It is great!

qquake2k said:

I don't have an SU (single use) motor, so I can't illustrate that. But you can see that the D to E spacer fits on top of the 24/40 case. Then it fits right in the motor mount. I wrap a piece of masking tape around it to make sure the case doesn't slip past the hook.

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Thanks for posting this. I'm happy to hear I will be able to experiment with composite motors without any modifications to this rocket.

86mustang408w said:

I orig planned on 2 BT-80's at 15", and the nose cone. But added the last tube when I placed my last Hobblinc order. I don't wanna waste your time trying to figure it out for me, I just need to get Java on my computer I'm just horrbile with using them. I had wanted to make a Super Big Bertha clone but I ended up just buying one still in the shrink wrap. Do you have any suggestions for the scratch build I was hoping for(if you have time)?...

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It should be pretty easy to get Java on your computer. In fact, I would be surprised if it didn't have it already.

One thing I notice about the build you are describing is that if the motor mount takes up the bottom 15-inch BT-80, and you have two more 15-inch BT-80's on top of that, it will mean 30 inches of BT-80 to pressurize with the ejection. I'm no expert on this, but I think that might be a lot. Maybe consider turning one of the sections into a payload with a bulkhead to cut down the volume that the ejection has to fill.

qquake2k said:

Something like this?

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Yeah that pretty close, except the fins I was thinking of are different. I can't post on what I'm thinking of.. you got half, I'm thinking like a half diamond shape? Its what you have, but take the short leg and but them back to back. With one point torwards the nose cone and one point to the tail. You know what I mean? Ill try to find or post a picture I'm not sure I can from my phone..

ThirstyBarbarian said:

It should be pretty easy to get Java on your computer. In fact, I would be surprised if it didn't have it already.

One thing I notice about the build you are describing is that if the motor mount takes up the bottom 15-inch BT-80, and you have two more 15-inch BT-80's on top of that, it will mean 30 inches of BT-80 to pressurize with the ejection. I'm no expert on this, but I think that might be a lot. Maybe consider turning one of the sections into a payload with a bulkhead to cut down the volume that the ejection has to fill.

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Yeah it may be a lot, I prob will have the top tube/nose cone be the ejected pcs. I'm still working on it. I was gonna make it a Super Big Bertha clone, but I got one so I changed the build. I may even cut the top tube in half too. Still working on it. It should be fun I haven't seen one like it yet...

86mustang408w said:

Yeah that pretty close, except the fins I was thinking of are different. I can't post on what I'm thinking of.. you got half, I'm thinking like a half diamond shape? Its what you have, but take the short leg and but them back to back. With one point torwards the nose cone and one point to the tail. You know what I mean? Ill try to find or post a picture I'm not sure I can from my phone..

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More like this? This design is stable, by the way. It has three of each fin. I don't know if it would be stable with four of each fin, you might have to add a bit of nose weight. If you look at the PDF, it'll tell you the expected altitude for each motor. The motors are all single use. I incorporated 1/8" plywood for the fins, it would be lighter with balsa or basswood, but not as strong.

View attachment 86 Mustang2.ork

View attachment 86 Mustang2.pdf

ThirstyBarbarian said:

One thing I notice about the build you are describing is that if the motor mount takes up the bottom 15-inch BT-80, and you have two more 15-inch BT-80's on top of that, it will mean 30 inches of BT-80 to pressurize with the ejection. I'm no expert on this, but I think that might be a lot. Maybe consider turning one of the sections into a payload with a bulkhead to cut down the volume that the ejection has to fill.

Click to expand...

86mustang408w said:

Yeah it may be a lot, I prob will have the top tube/nose cone be the ejected pcs. I'm still working on it. I was gonna make it a Super Big Bertha clone, but I got one so I changed the build. I may even cut the top tube in half too. Still working on it. It should be fun I haven't seen one like it yet...

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That's easy. Just put a bulkhead in the top coupler, and turn that section into a payload section. It would separate at the coupler, not at the nose cone. The design I just posted has a bulkhead in the coupler. Or you could use a balsa nose block instead of a coupler. Balsa Machining has them.

I need to get it your right, for some reason java isn't working. Ill figure it out. After that ill mess around with the design. I can still build the others, I'm gonna start asap! Thanks for the help once again..