AeroPac XPRS Sept. 2012

[ThePlmbr]

Thanks Chad. Too bad for Judy & Jackson.

[JLRockets]

Sorry, guys, I'm typing on a handheld. Not one of my strongest skills. I'll start a new thread and give full explanations when I get to a real keyboard. Until then, we are enjoying brunos country club here in gerlach. Aeropac is a great club to launch with, and we are glad we came.

[SS/EA 6BBL 71 Cuda]

Judy, Jackson......my condolences on the flight. For alot of us in "the know" back here in the midwest....we were all pulling for you both on this one.

Then its still on.....I'll be at Airfest on Sunday beta testing my new "Ravens Killers" for another undisclosed manufacturer.....Not an airframe test... strictly electronics this time.

After seeing some of the tail wagging going on in the crowd earlier this year on this board.....Someone WILL fly a Mongoose 98 on an N5800 C-Star....

I've got David Reese, another gentleman i was introduced to who did carbon work on "dark projects" and, just little ole me.....Got some work to do.

Talk to you soon at Airfest or Midwest Power.......

I'm in.

[crossfire]

Chad
Just trying to think what may have happened to J&J N flight. Do you think the fin can let go or did something let go above the fin can that started it to wiggle?
Its seems to me that if a fin let go first all hell would have happened right away. I hope they got some of it back so it can be checked out.
gp

[butalane]

Its hard to say what event spurred the failure and what damage was secondary and caused by the chaos that ensued.

I don't think the nosecone or fincan were up to the task, but saying which failed first ... hard to say.

The flight was close making it through the thrust phase, it literally came apart at the very end of the burn.

[chadrog]

Chad
Just trying to think what may have happened to J&J N flight. Do you think the fin can let go or did something let go above the fin can that started it to wiggle?
Its seems to me that if a fin let go first all hell would have happened right away. I hope they got some of it back so it can be checked out.
gp

I couldn't even wager a guess Gary, way beyond what I play with.

[mannyskid]

Judy, Jackson......my condolences on the flight. For alot of us in "the know" back here in the midwest....we were all pulling for you both on this one.

Then its still on.....I'll be at Airfest on Sunday beta testing my new "Ravens Killers" for another undisclosed manufacturer.....Not an airframe test... strictly electronics this time.

After seeing some of the tail wagging going on in the crowd earlier this year on this board.....Someone WILL fly a Mongoose 98 on an N5800 C-Star....

I've got David Reese, another gentleman i was introduced to who did carbon work on "dark projects" and, just little ole me.....Got some work to do.

Talk to you soon at Airfest or Midwest Power.......

I'm in.

Go Gus go!!! Show 'em what you're made of! After I get my Gizmo back, the rest of my AIRfest time will be dedicated to helping you prep, launch and recover your rocket.

[chadrog]

Go Gus go!!! Show 'em what you're made of! After I get my Gizmo back, the rest of my AIRfest time will be dedicated to helping you prep, launch and recover your rocket.

Put down the pom-poms and go build a rocket Manny.

[mannyskid]

Put down the pom-poms and go build a rocket Manny.

Oh, but I am.......I'm prepared to bring out the big guns at Midwest Power.

[Burner]

Its hard to say what event spurred the failure and what damage was secondary and caused by the chaos that ensued.

I don't think the nosecone or fincan were up to the task, but saying which failed first ... hard to say.

The flight was close making it through the thrust phase, it literally came apart at the very end of the burn.

Any details on this rocket? Nosecone? How was the fin can made?

[crossfire]

Judy and Jackson may write something up on the build but from what I saw the nose cone was the new style Performance Rocketry nose cone. They built a metal fin can that slid over the motor case with fins welded on. Also a carbon fiber body tube. At what temps does the expoy start to melt. I think this flight was to go 3.5 mach? Maybe the nose cone needs to to metal also. I really give them credit for this attempt. They will try again and make it next time.
Gary

[troj]

If its the new PR nose cone, the ones I've seen, it's easy for the tip to move side to side. At that kind of speed, a slight offset would be catastrophic.

At BALLS last year, someone I know tried a very aggressive flight, and that tip being slightly off center is the leading candidate for the source of his problems.

-Kevin

[crossfire]

Kevin
I didn't even know untill last weekend that PR is making the metal tip different. The 4" one I have has a stepped section that fits down in cut off part of the nosecone. The new ones are just cut off flat. I do know that J&J didn't use the stock metal tip.
gp

[troj]

I didn't even know untill last weekend that PR is making the metal tip different. The 4" one I have has a stepped section that fits down in cut off part of the nosecone. The new ones are just cut off flat. I do know that J&J didn't use the stock metal tip.

Interesting! Having that step would definitely help, assuming the tip is cut off square.

I like the idea of the step, though I'm sure it adds to the cost, as it means one more step in turning the tip.

-Kevin

[crossfire]

Kevin
Maybe with a project like this one should use a all metal coupler and nose cone.
gp

[troj]

Maybe with a project like this one should use a all metal coupler and nose cone.

Unless you want to put something like a GPS in the nose, in which case you need the radio-opaque material.

-Kevin

[butalane]

If its the new PR nose cone, the ones I've seen, it's easy for the tip to move side to side. At that kind of speed, a slight offset would be catastrophic.

At BALLS last year, someone I know tried a very aggressive flight, and that tip being slightly off center is the leading candidate for the source of his problems.

-Kevin

I think the bare FG NC had more to do with the failure of the NC than the tip. The manufacturing method of the FWFG nosecones leave a lot of fiber ends on the surface; without any sort of protection against aeroheating the fiber ends become exposed.

[troj]

I think the bare FG NC had more to do with the failure of the NC than the tip. The manufacturing method of the FWFG nosecones leave a lot of fiber ends on the surface; without any sort of protection against aeroheating the fiber ends become exposed.

Good point. I think they're made by wrapping a mandrel, then grinding it down to the right surface. That would indeed mean a lot of loose ends.

If friction erodes the epoxy away, exactly what you describe....

-Kevin

[edwinshap1]

IIRC there was a tour of PR where they showed the blanks for FWFG. They were much larger, and then put on a mandrel. It's well polished, but aeroheating can be a problem. However the time the nosecone is under high heat flux and friction is low, and if the aluminum tip is properly aligned much/most of the cone is in mach shadow.

[crossfire]

Chad
Do you know if J&J got their rocket back. I would love to see it. We can all learn a lot from their flight. I am sure they will get a perfect flight next time.
GP

[chadrog]

Chad
Do you know if J&J got their rocket back. I would love to see it. We can all learn a lot from their flight. I am sure they will get a perfect flight next time.
GP

I haven't heard, I was kinda hoping to see it on the 18th - Are you coming out? Thanks for the box-o-goodies by the way, it came today.

[crossfire]

For sure I will be there on the 18th. I have my Wildman Jart ready to fly. Not sure about flying it for the first time on a H reload. I may need to get a spacer and fly a G reload in it. Have you heard what reload they are useing for the Mini Magg drag race?
See Ya
Gary

[chadrog]

Just out of curiosity, what size chute did you put in your Jart? I'm going to try to get all four of our Jart's flown Saturday, for a possible family drag race on Sunday. Thinking F50's for first flights. Why do you need a spacer? I forgot all about the MM Drag Race, I'll have to bring mine just in case.

[crossfire]

I purchased the motor special from Tim along with the Jart. And am thinking i would need a motor space to use a smaller reload in the case I got. The chute I haven't pick out yet. Tim would use a 12" but I can't see anthing smaller than 18" or a 24" for lower flights.
gp

[chadrog]

Just noticed on the TWA forum that Vern is going to bring his GIANT Saturn 1b out for display on the 18th, that is too cool!

[chadrog]

I purchased the motor special from Tim along with the Jart. And am thinking i would need a motor space to use a smaller reload in the case I got. The chute I haven't pick out yet. Tim would use a 12" but I can't see anthing smaller than 18" or a 24" for lower flights.
gp

Oh, those spacers. I lost the case from my starter set on a three grain load, so I bought another set - I have extra spacers if you need them.

[butalane]

Chad
Do you know if J&J got their rocket back. I would love to see it. We can all learn a lot from their flight. I am sure they will get a perfect flight next time.
GP

The pieces

[crossfire]

So does it look like the nose cone came apart and rocket kept going up after nose cone was gone for a short while and all hell broke after that?
GP

[butalane]

Its hard to say what event spurred the failure and what damage was secondary and caused by the chaos that ensued.

I don't think the nosecone or fincan were up to the task, but saying which failed first ... hard to say.

The flight was close making it through the thrust phase, it literally came apart at the very end of the burn.

Read Above

[CarVac]

Is there any video?