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Marc_G

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Hi folks,

Having followed MarkII's Mini-Brute Mania thread, which included a beautifully turned-out Screamer, I just couldn't wait any longer. I had to build "one." :grin:

The Screamer was my first ever rocket, so it has imprinted itself onto my psyche. I've now built a pair of them: one mostly stock, one stretched with an extra stage. They are in decal phase right now.

I also plan to upscale (several sizes) over the winter and decided to open this thread to document progress. I invite anyone with Screamer related experiences or builds to post here... any topics reasonably related to Screamers are welcome. Let's just avoid the three horsemen of the thread-apocalypse (religion, politics, China trade issues :no: )

I've got to run to work but will start posting stuff here tonight... do we have a scream icon? (like that famous painting, The Scream?) :scream: OK, I guess not!

Marc
 
Over the winter I will make a BT-20 and BT-50 set of upscales, both minimum diameter. Also considering a BT-60 version with interchangeable motor mounts.

The BT -50 version with an adapter for Quest D5-6 would probably be an awesome flight...


Two different sized upscales, I like that.

The BT-5 Screamer uses a BNC-5AX nose cone with a 4:1 ratio and semroc doesen't make a BNC-20AX or BNC-50AX.

Will you use the BNC-20G4 and the BNC-50G4 as replacements as they have a 4:1 ratio and are ogives?
 
Hi folks,

Having followed MarkII's Mini-Brute Mania thread, which included a beautifully turned-out Screamer, I just couldn't wait any longer. I had to build "one." :grin:

The Screamer was my first ever rocket, so it has imprinted itself onto my psyche. I've now built a pair of them: one mostly stock, one stretched with an extra stage. They are in decal phase right now.

I also plan to upscale (several sizes) over the winter and decided to open this thread to document progress. I invite anyone with Screamer related experiences or builds to post here... any topics reasonably related to Screamers are welcome. Let's just avoid the three horsemen of the thread-apocalypse (religion, politics, China trade issues :no: )

I've got to run to work but will start posting stuff here tonight... do we have a scream icon? (like that famous painting, The Scream?) :scream: OK, I guess not!

Marc

Marc:
The Classic BT-5 Screamer is a great looking and flying 'Mini-Brute". It's also a real Scream downScaled to T2+ flown with MMX-II motors. Out-a-Sight in a heart beat but recoverable with a teflon Yellow streamer on small fields.

MM 357p01d-sm_MM Screamer (TK-2) T2+_10-23-08.jpg

MM 357Lp01-sm_MM Screamer Wow HIGH 1st Flt_11-16-08.JPG
 
I bought an Estes Screamer kit when they were first released in the early 1970s. Flew it several times and still have it. :)

A few years ago, I built a clone using Semroc parts and Excelsior Rocketry decals.

Estes Screamer.jpg
 
Two different sized upscales, I like that.

The BT-5 Screamer uses a BNC-5AX nose cone with a 4:1 ratio and semroc doesen't make a BNC-20AX or BNC-50AX.

Will you use the BNC-20G4 and the BNC-50G4 as replacements as they have a 4:1 ratio and are ogives?

What'ch ya think?

bnc-5ax.jpg

bnc-20g4.jpg

bnc-50g4.jpg
 
What'ch ya think?

The Semroc BNC-XXG4 seem to be the perfect shape for Screamer models & upscales.

I was planning to place my next order with BMS, though, so I could get some of those really long body tube and coupler pieces.

So I went to BMS' website and looked over their cones:

In BT-20 size, it looks like the BNC-20N would do the trick. But for BT-50 and BT-60 upscales, it's not clear that BMS has a stock solution ready to go. I would want ogives of length 3.9" and 7.4" respectively (approximately). I don't see these on their site as stock parts, nor anything close of the right shape. Could I be missing something?

So it seems I shall likely be placing two orders, one with BMS for tubes/couplers and one with Semroc for cones. Of course, I shall not order anything else for speculative scratch builds :rolleyes:

More to come... :horse:
 
The Semroc BNC-XXG4 seem to be the perfect shape for Screamer models & upscales.

I was planning to place my next order with BMS, though, so I could get some of those really long body tube and coupler pieces.

So I went to BMS' website and looked over their cones:

In BT-20 size, it looks like the BNC-20N would do the trick. But for BT-50 and BT-60 upscales, it's not clear that BMS has a stock solution ready to go. I would want ogives of length 3.9" and 7.4" respectively (approximately). I don't see these on their site as stock parts, nor anything close of the right shape. Could I be missing something?

So it seems I shall likely be placing two orders, one with BMS for tubes/couplers and one with Semroc for cones. Of course, I shall not order anything else for speculative scratch builds :rolleyes:

More to come... :horse:


3.9" is a good number for a BT-50 nose cone.

How did you come up with 7.4" for a BT-60 nose cone? I came up with 6.5".
 
You could order it as a semi-custom nose cone. I've done that in the past have always been pleased with the results. Chect the BMS catalog for the form.
 
OK, now I've finally got a few minutes. Kids are in bed, and my wife hasn't gotten home from work yet. :cool:

As I mentioned in the thread opener, I've got a special bond with the Screamer, to the point that it's remarkable I haven't cloned one until now, about 18 months into my BAR life.

It all started in the mid to late 1970s. I had never heard of model rocketry. But at camp, as a ~10 year old, I saw an option called "Model Rocketry" present in our Choosing Time period (after lunch, we got to pick what to do for an hour or so). But alas, it was a "closed" session, as you had to sign up for it during the first week of camp. It was held every Thursday during Choosing time. One of my friends was in it, though, and told me about it. Sounded cool.

A year passed. Next summer, I begged and pleaded to my parents to get me to camp EXTRA EARLY so I could be among the lucky 10 kids to sign up for the class on that critical first Thursday. My wonderful Mom drove me to camp (skipping carpool) and got me there an hour early. I ran down the hall to the Choosing time signup board. I barely made it... I was number 9 out of 10! But close enough is CLOSE ENOUGH. I was in.

I could barely contain myself that morning and hardly ate any lunch. I then sprinted up to the shop where the class was held. The guy introduced the concept with a little lecture with props, and passed out kits. They were numbered, and we were assigned a random number, so there would be no arguing about which kit we got. He was cool enough but didn't suffer whiny kids (so, why work at a camp? :shock: ).

Anyway, I got the Screamer. I was at first disappointed, as it was the smallest kit, the BT-5 minimum diameter one in the batch. Of course, at the time I didn't know what BT-5 was, or minimum diameter... All the kids had simple 3/4FNC type rockets. I imagine there were Alphas and the like. Probably the biggest were BT-55 with 18mm mounts. I remember the leader showed us a Der Red Max ("COOL!") and one day he pulled out an Andromeda. Of course, there were a couple Big Berthas on the shelf.

Anyway, I got some ribbing. While other kids were assembling 18mm motor mounts I was just putting a little thrust ring into my dinky little thin body tube :sad:

Each Thursday after a short build session we would go out an launch a few of the ones he already had. It was a blast, literally. We all learned how to pack a chute or streamer, insert engines and those awful old ignitors, you know the drill.

Finally, my bright orange with mangled decals and fins not-quite-straight Screamer was ready. It was maiden launch day for the bunch of us who had built. We went to the field and --I'm not making this up!!-- kicked a pickup soccer game off our turf.

We all got engines that fit our rockets. I believe all of us got A engines. The details are a bit hazy, but I remember us launching, one after the other. A couple launches required a few ignitors to get going, but all were successful.

I was the last to go that day. Remember, most of the prior birds had launched on 18mm A engines, and one or two were 13mm non-minimum-diameter rockets. So imagine how all of us felt, when I put my dinky little Screamer on the pad, and sent it up on an A. The performance was incredible at the time. It just teleported off the pad in the a way none of the others did. The group of kids, all boys as I recall, just stood there. I got some pats on the back.

I never made fun of my little Screamer again. I got to launch it again once or twice at camp, then took it home.

It was my pride an joy, banged up though it was, until my dog, Tinker, chewed it to bits. :kill: I loved that dog, but oh he made me so mad that day.

By this time I was say 12 years old or so, and I was so upset my parents bought me a new rocket for my birthday, and a pack of engines. The rocket was a Condor, with the little attached glider. Not exactly a suitable second build, but I did manage to get it together with some help from dear old Dad.
HE built me a pad, and we used one of those big old batteries and some wire with aligator clips. Old-school!

Believe it or not, the thing flew well, and I was hooked... The rest is history. It all comes down to that Screamer, which in itself took me a year to come to, and another year to lose, before I took up rocketry as a hobby outside of camp.

Ah, fond memories!

Marc
 
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So,

About a year ago, I bought some Screamer decals from Excelsior. Six months later, I bought a pair of BNC-5AX nose cones from SEMROC, as well as a set of laser cut fins... they were so inexpensive to add to the order. They just sat around, until my resolve to build it was finally galvinized by seeing MarkII's beautiful model.

So I built two. One properly to scale, using the SEMROC fins, and another with a twice-as-long-as-normal body tube using some 3/32" basswood that I had prefinished a while back. While I was at it I made a booster stage using fins upscaled by 20%.

The three tubes used up an 18" length of BT-5. Not much to report on the build; each are just three fins and a thrust block. I did notch the thrust blocks and tie kevlar to them so I could avoid the trifold elastic thing...

Screamer 00002.jpg

Screamer 00003.jpg
 
For the proper-scale Screamer and the booster stage, which all had balsa fins, I used thin CA to seal the fins... then I sanded them down smooth. Next I used CA to seal the nosecones, and sanded them. Also CAed the body tube edges. Used a hole punch to make some vent-staging holes in the booster..

Eventually I sprayed some rustoleum auto filler primer on them, and then sanded down. No pics at this stage. Couple days later hit them with white Valspar spray primer. No pics again...

A few hours later (at about 60 F) I sprayed with Testors Fiery Orange one-coat lacquer. One nose cone got Rustoleum black lacquer. The other got a fad of the orange and Rustoleum Chinese Red lacquer.

Because of potentially troublesome humidity that could cause blush I was using a space heater to send warm low-RH air over the pieces; I also had warmed them up and warmed the cans in warm water.

It worked OK. Here's the result:

Screamer 00005.jpg

Screamer 00006.jpg

Screamer 00007.jpg

The standard sized one now has decals on it, and I'll get a pic once I clearcoat it when weather permits. It will also get a coat of Future/Simplegreen.

Not sure if I'll decal the other one.
 
You could order it as a semi-custom nose cone. I've done that in the past have always been pleased with the results. Chect the BMS catalog for the form.

Could do. I'm sure it would be fine. But I'm oh so lazy and it's just so easy to order from SEMROC. In fact, I need to be careful as my simple thought about ordering there could trigger a shipment notification...

I'll get the cones from SEMROC and some tubes from BMS. IT's the easy way out, as long as I can grab the boxes before my wife gets home. :bangpan:
 
Two different sized upscales, I like that.

Well... three actually.

BT-20: minimum diameter 18mm. Check.
BT-50: minimum diameter 24 mm plus Quest D5 20mm with adaptor. Check.
BT-60: build with interchangeable motor mount (1x18, 1x24, 3x18). Check.

Maybe I'll also build a 4x13 mount... might be kind of fun to make the equivalent of a C40-3 engine using 4x A10-3T... though the delay would be too short.
 
Well... three actually.

BT-20: minimum diameter 18mm. Check.
BT-50: minimum diameter 24 mm plus Quest D5 20mm with adaptor. Check.
BT-60: build with interchangeable motor mount (1x18, 1x24, 3x18). Check.

Maybe I'll also build a 4x13 mount... might be kind of fun to make the equivalent of a C40-3 engine using 4x A10-3T... though the delay would be too short.


Semroc does not have a BNC-60AX or a BNC-60G4.

There is, however, another option.
 
Semroc does not have a BNC-60AX or a BNC-60G4.

There is, however, another option.

I just doublechecked and Semroc lists a BNC-60G4. $9.15 each.


The BNC-60G4 in the BNC-60 nose cone list states that the G4 cone is 7.4 inches in length, so I didn't look at the picture.

When the BNC-60G4 picture is viewed by itself, the text says the G4 is 6.5 inches in length.
1.637" X 4 = 6.548 inches (4:1 ratio)

Guess the info on the G4 in the BNC-60 nose cone list is a misprint on its length.
Semroc needs to be made aware of this so they can correct the misprint.

There is another option still available that doesn't include a custom cone being made.
 
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Put BNC-5AX into the search box on Semroc's home page. Select 'GO'.

Right click mouse on the pictured nose cone on lefthand side of the page.

Read text on new page.

www.semroc.com

:confused: :confused:

Did that, and got part BC-15066, which is a "series 150" based cone with inner / outer diameter of 1.500"/1.590" ... not quite BT 60 which would have dimensions 1.595" / 1.637"

I suppose I could get some series 150 tubes... but would rather stick with standard BT-60, particularly considering the triple 18mm mount I'm planning takes every bit of space inside the tube.

The BNC-60G4 is either perfect or close to it, so good enough by me. Yea!

Looking forward to some fun, simple builds that will let me work on my craft and attention to detail..

Marc
 
Put BNC-5AX into the search box on Semroc's home page. Select 'GO'.

Right click mouse on the pictured nose cone on lefthand side of the page.

Read text on new page.

www.semroc.com

:confused: :confused:

Did that, and got part BC-15066, which is a "series 150" based cone with inner / outer diameter of 1.500"/1.590" ... not quite BT 60 which would have dimensions 1.595" / 1.637"

I suppose I could get some series 150 tubes... but would rather stick with standard BT-60, particularly considering the triple 18mm mount I'm planning takes every bit of space inside the tube.

The BNC-60G4 is either perfect or close to it, so good enough by me. Yea!

Looking forward to some fun, simple builds that will let me work on my craft and attention to detail..

Marc


I wanted you to find & read the part of the text that said "BNC-5AX Upscale" by yourself.

I'm wondering why the 'AX' isn't available in more diameters.
 
I wanted you to find & read the part of the text that said "BNC-5AX Upscale" by yourself.

I'm wondering why the 'AX' isn't available in more diameters.

It's a good question, but with the G4 cones available in several BT sizes, it's close enough for me. They may or may not be an exact upscale of the BNC-5AX, but any difference is negligible to me.

Meanwhile I'm hoping to clearcoat my BT-5 screamers tomorrow if it gets warm/dry enough!

Marc
 
Uncle Mikes has the PNC-50B a 4 inch long ogive plastic nosecone.

The PML 2.6 inch cone has an exposed length of 11.25 inches, pretty close.
 
So my first two are done, except for streamers and balancing...

Screamer 00010.jpg

Screamer 00009.jpg

Screamer 00008.jpg

The stretch one I decided to use a piece of trim monokote for on a fin on the booster and again the sustainer.

The paint job was rushed in my attempt to beat weather, so the metallic came out a bit blotchy. Mea culpa. I'll eventually do another BT-5 one in a different orange. The Testors Firey Orange I used is a nice shade but not really what I had in mind for these. But it's what I had and I decided to use my one chance at painting with it.

I goofed a bit on the proper scale Screamer... I put the launch lug in a place that conflicted with the strip of black that wraps around. Oops.

For my next trick I'm upscaling a bit... tonight I put fins on a BT-20 version. Will order BNC-20G4 from SEMROC for the cone.

Marc
 
The performance was incredible at the time. It just teleported off the pad in the a way none of the others did. The group of kids, all boys as I recall, just stood there. I got some pats on the back.

I never made fun of my little Screamer again. I got to launch it again once or twice at camp, then took it home.

Marc

Great story.
I had a Screamer way back when...even with the little motors it was a performer...and the real challenge was finding it after launching it.

I still have the one I first launched over 30 years ago...it has a replacement balsa nose cone...think I got the NC from BMS.
 
Great looking rockets Marc. Are these bt-5 or bt-20 bodied rockets?
 
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Marc,

So many people have inspired me by the things that they have done in this hobby. I am so glad that I finally got a chance to pass on the favor.

Your Screamers look awesome. Wow - a two-stager! :cool::cool::cool::cool::cool:
 
Great looking rockets Marc. Are these bt-5 or bt-20 bodied rockets?

So far these are BT-5. Next one on the mat is BT-20 (fins on last night) and then a BT-50 version (when my BMS order gets here). All minimum diameter. I might stretch the BT-50 version to ensure stability on an E engine, though I can't imagine having a field big enough to "E power" it. Will probably fly on fat Cs most of the time. After that, a BT-60 version!

Marc,

So many people have inspired me by the things that they have done in this hobby. I am so glad that I finally got a chance to pass on the favor.

Your Screamers look awesome. Wow - a two-stager! :cool::cool::cool::cool::cool:

Thanks Mark! I'm inspired by the craft I see here by you and others that take the time to detail their builds and pass it along. :D

Scream on!
 
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