Adapter and retainer

Hello Everybody,
i have a question!
My tube has a diameter of 5,7cm.

I stick in a 38mm Adapter to fly a 29mm motor. How can i attach the Adapter into my rocket?
After i attached the Adapter (if possible) i can stick in the motor, also a single use one and fix it with an retainer. Is that right? Can i do it like that, or do i need to attach a 54mm adapter and stick into it the 38mm adapter to fly a 29mm Motor Thanks for the help!

I would buy this ones:

https://www.apogeerockets.com/motor_mount_adapters.asp

I haven't done a 29mm adapter in a 38mm yet. But I have done a 38mm adapter in a 54mm motor mount. I made a retention plate out of 1/16" x 1" aluminum. Worked very well. I'll be doing the same thing when I use a 29mm adapter in a 38mm motor mount.

Those Apogee motor adapters seem very pricey to me. You can get a pre-built phenolic 29mm-38mm adapter from Red Arrow Hobbies for $9. You can get LOC Precision's motor adapter kits even cheaper from Hobbylinc.

Thank you for the answer!

My problem is i don't know how to fix a 38mm mount for a 29mm motor in my 54mm Tube... with the retainer i can fix the 29mm motor into the 38mm mount, that isn't a problem... or i'll do it as you said looks damn nice. I don't have a cage for the rocket as you have. I have the tube as a cage. Like this one: https://www.rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?t=24502 I don't know how to explain it better my english isn't that good i'm from switzerland

Ricci said:

Thank you for the answer!

My problem is i don't know how to fix a 38mm mount for a 29mm motor in my 54mm Tube... with the retainer i can fix the 29mm motor into the 38mm mount, that isn't a problem... or i'll do it as you said looks damn nice. I don't have a cage for the rocket as you have. I have the tube as a cage. Like this one: https://www.rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?t=24502 I don't know how to explain it better my english isn't that good i'm from switzerland

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Okay, so you want to put a 29mm motor in a rocket that has a 54mm motor mount? Is that correct? It might help if I knew which rocket you have. Can you post photos? Red Arrow and LOC both have 29mm to 54mm adapters.

No i want to build it, its a graduating work.

My tube has a dia. of 54mm its 48"long. I'ts my own design that's why i have some questons. I want to use a G-Motor on it, its a 29mm motor. So i would need a good mount for it. I wanted to attach a 38mm mount on my tube. And put in the 38mm mount a 29mm mount ( the little ring) to fix it. Does that work? Or do i need a 54mm mount. Stick in the 38mm mount and than again stick in the 29mm mount. Like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2hQYdozP4PQ&feature=player_embedded just one down more... Before i buy everything i would like to know this. I am in rocketry since like 2 years. But nothing big always small rockets. Now i would like to build a bigger one...
Was i clear enough?

Ricci said:

No i want to build it, its a graduating work.

My tube has a dia. of 54mm its 48"long. I'ts my own design that's why i have some questons. I want to use a G-Motor on it, its a 29mm motor. So i would need a good mount for it. I wanted to attach a 38mm mount on my tube. And put in the 38mm mount a 29mm mount ( the little ring) to fix it. Does that work? Or do i need a 54mm mount. Stick in the 38mm mount and than again stick in the 29mm mount. Like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2hQYdozP4PQ&feature=player_embedded just one down more... Before i buy everything i would like to know this. I am in rocketry since like 2 years. But nothing big always small rockets. Now i would like to build a bigger one...
Was i clear enough?

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I think I understand now. Basically you need to build a 38mm motor mount for a 54mm tube, then get a 29mm-38mm adapter for it. You would need the 38mm motor tube and centering rings to make the motor mount. Are you using all LOC Precision components?

So i don't need to buy any of those: https://www.apogeerockets.com/motor_mount_adapters.asp ?

No i don't use any of those components. My Tube is Blue tube, that's why it's heavier and i need a G motor. I just don't know how to do it because the adapter and retainer from the link above looks sick!

Basically you need to build a 38mm motor mount for a 54mm tube, then get a 29mm-38mm adapter for it. You would need the 38mm motor tube and centering rings to make the motor mount.

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Yes i would need to do it like this. So basically i would build it on my own.

Ricci said:

So i don't need to buy any of those: https://www.apogeerockets.com/motor_mount_adapters.asp ?

No i don't use any of those components. My Tube is Blue tube, that's why it's heavier and i need a G motor. I just don't know how to do it because the adapter and retainer from the link above looks sick!


Yes i would need to do it like this. So basically i would build it on my own.

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Well, I'm not quite sure why you would need any of the motor adapters from Appogee. You'll need the components to build your 38mm motor mount, then a 29mm-38mm motor adapter. Do you already have the blue tube? If not, where are you going to buy it from? And what will you use for retention? With a 38mm motor mount in a 54mm body tube, I don't think you'll have enough room to use tee nuts and clips like I did. You'll probably need an Aeropack style retainer.

i will buy it from Apogee.

Ya that is my problem... Can't i straight of build a 29mm mount? https://www.apogeerockets.com/blue_tubes.asp

i could buy 29mm Blue Tube and than with the centering rings it would fit. I don't know how to retain it, because i would use a single-use motor...

What should i do? What would you do the masses are: 650g. 150cm length (with nosle) and 54mm dia.. (that's what i wanna do).

I wanted to use the apogee ones, because they look good and it looks easy...

Ricci said:

i will buy it from Apogee.

Ya that is my problem... Can't i straight of build a 29mm mount? https://www.apogeerockets.com/blue_tubes.asp

i could buy 29mm Blue Tube and than with the centering rings it would fit. I don't know how to retain it, because i would use a single-use motor...

What should i do? What would you do the masses are: 650g. 150cm length (with nosle) and 54mm dia.. (that's what i wanna do).

I wanted to use the apogee ones, because they look good and it looks easy...

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I'm hoping someone else will chime in here, as I don't have any experience with Blue Tube or Aeropack retainers. If it were me, I would get 54mm and 38mm Blue Tubes, that will be your airframe and motor tube. Then you just need centering rings. An Aeropack retainer and 29mm-38mm adapter would probably be the best and easiest for retention.

Ok so i do it that way:

54mm Blue Tube for the Body Tube / airframe
38mm Blue Tube with centering rings for the motorcage
a 38mm Adapter and a 29mm adapter, so i can chose if i want to use 38mm motor or 29mm motor.
As i the video i could use a 38mm motor in a 54mm adapter...
so i assume i can also use a 29mm motor in a 38mm adapter with the correct adapter ofc. And than the 2 retainers for the 29mm and 38mm.

That makes sense doesn't it?

Ricci said:

Ok so i do it that way:

54mm Blue Tube for the Body Tube / airframe
38mm Blue Tube with centering rings for the motorcage
a 38mm Adapter and a 29mm adapter, so i can chose if i want to use 38mm motor or 29mm motor.
As i the video i could use a 38mm motor in a 54mm adapter...
so i assume i can also use a 29mm motor in a 38mm adapter with the correct adapter ofc. And than the 2 retainers for the 29mm and 38mm.

That makes sense doesn't it?

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As far as I can tell, you would need the 24063 Aeropack retainer, and the 24070 Aeropack adapter. That will allow you to use either a 38mm or 29mm motor.

Ok great thank you! I will buy everything and than post while i'm working on it https://imageshack.us/f/594/bildschirmfoto20110801ub.png/

i Run it through Openrocket. and everything would be "ok". I'll start building it as soon as i have everything Thanks alot!!!!

Ricci said:

Ok great thank you! I will buy everything and than post while i'm working on it https://imageshack.us/f/594/bildschirmfoto20110801ub.png/

i Run it through Openrocket. and everything would be "ok". I'll start building it as soon as i have everything Thanks alot!!!!

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You should probably wait until someone else responds before you order everything. Like I said, I don't have any experience with Aeropack retainers. There might be a different and/or better way to do it.

hmm ok i'll wait... but it makes sense to me... how do you find my OpenRocket modell? should be ok shouldn't it?

Cmon guys,he is a newbie. You dont need retainers. motors and adapters can be friction fitted with a few layers of masking tape,including the adapters. Why make it so complicated. Like he said,this is a gradual project. let him learn like the rest of us did. OK,I had my say,flame on!!!

jimzcatz said:

Cmon guys,he is a newbie. You dont need retainers. motors and adapters can be friction fitted with a few layers of masking tape,including the adapters. Why make it so complicated. Like he said,this is a gradual project. let him learn like the rest of us did. OK,I had my say,flame on!!!

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I was just going by what he said he wanted. I showed him the cheaper simpler adapters like I use, but he kept coming back to the Aeropack retainer and adapter. I figure if he's got the money to spend, Aeropack would probably be the way to go. My whole thing is I was hoping someone with Blue Tube and Aeropack experience would chime in.

Ok i got it, sry I'll do it only with the retainer... The adapter i'll do on my own. Yes i am a newbie like you were once! Got my lesseon ^^

It seems to me that what you want to do is to build a rocket with a 54mm Airframe and fly it on 29mm motors? Is that right?

If that's the case simply build it with a 29mm motor mount. No adapter needed.

Your parts list would be something like this (since you already mentioned Apogee the links go there):
54mm Blue Tube Airframe tube,
29mm Motor Mount Tube,
2 Centering Rings 29-54,
nose cone,
fin stock,
shock cord,
etc.

Don't forget the etc.!

If you want a motor retainer you can also get a 29mm motor retainer.

Good luck with your project and let us know how you're doing!

dostergaard said:

It seems to me that what you want to do is to build a rocket with a 54mm Airframe and fly it on 29mm motors? Is that right?

If that's the case simply build it with a 29mm motor mount. No adapter needed.

Your parts list would be something like this (since you already mentioned Apogee the links go there):
54mm Blue Tube Airframe tube,
29mm Motor Mount Tube,
2 Centering Rings 29-54,
nose cone,
fin stock,
shock cord,
etc.

Don't forget the etc.!

If you want a motor retainer you can also get a 29mm motor retainer.

Good luck with your project and let us know how you're doing!

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Why would you even suggest that? He would be limited to 29mm motors when he clearly wants the option for 38.

I had the same quandary a few years ago in my two SportScale scratch builds .

Was told by a local vendor , Whats Up Andy "You can adapt down, but you can't go up "

Ended up with some inexpensive 38mm MMT and matching AeroPack . Also got two 29mm adapters , inexpensive LOC and the AeroPack .

Lots of motor choices, if a lower total impulse 38mm is unavailable , can look for a higher total impulse 29mm .

For my sons rocket, I didn't utilize the AeroPack system - but we still went with 38MM - taped the motor into the LOC MMA-2 motor adapter and taped the adapter into the motor mount tube - to me seemed easier then friction fitting a 29mm into a 29mm MMT and had no hook or thrust ring to worry about .

Here is a pic of the pieces : base on rocket, retainer closure, adapter and the adapter spacer on the lower right of pic. AeroPack did it right too, the adapter spacer fits one way for the RMS like the two longer cases, and you flip it around if doing Hobbyline 29 40/120 (the smallest case pictured) for a precision fit without tape . The motors closure is the 'engine stop' and the Hobbyline is not closure is not quite as long . It is also slotted for a hook , but " We Don't Need NO Sticking Hooks ! " (Sierra Madre voice)

Kenny

Good luck with your project and let us know how you're doing!

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sure will do bro! When i will have purchased everything i'll start building and i'll do a thread about that!

Why would you even suggest that? He would be limited to 29mm motors when he clearly wants the option for 38.

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i thought it would be good to also would able to use a 38mm but i don't know why i should because i don't have license 1 and a 29mm G80 is more than enough. If you know a 38mm engine that i can also use let me know pls!

I had the same quandary a few years ago in my two SportScale scratch builds .

Was told by a local vendor , Whats Up Andy "You can adapt down, but you can't go up "

Ended up with some inexpensive 38mm MMT and matching AeroPack . Also got two 29mm adapters , inexpensive LOC and the AeroPack .

Lots of motor choices, if a lower total impulse 38mm is unavailable , can look for a higher total impulse 29mm .

For my sons rocket, I didn't utilize the AeroPack system - but we still went with 38MM - taped the motor into the LOC MMA-2 motor adapter and taped the adapter into the motor mount tube - to me seemed easier then friction fitting a 29mm into a 29mm MMT and had no hook or thrust ring to worry about .

Here is a pic of the pieces : base on rocket, retainer closure, adapter and the adapter spacer on the lower right of pic. AeroPack did it right too, the adapter spacer fits one way for the RMS like the two longer cases, and you flip it around if doing Hobbyline 29 40/120 (the smallest case pictured) for a precision fit without tape . The motors closure is the 'engine stop' and the Hobbyline is not closure is not quite as long . It is also slotted for a hook , but " We Don't Need NO Sticking Hooks ! " (Sierra Madre voice)

Kenny

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thanks alot for your reply. @ all at this point.

If i find a 38mm engine that i can also use i would build in a 54adapter and than stick in the 38mm retainer and scrap on the 54mm retainer. that works! The other possibility is to use a 29mm Blue tube, put 3 centering rings on it and than buy the 29mm retainer. That would be easier and cheaper! what do you guys suggest me

greeting from switzerland

Oh quick update that i totally forgot: My tube has a diameter of 2.56", i want to do a similar as this one: https://rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?t=24502
so i thought about buying a 29mm bluetube and 2.56" centering rings. So it would be easy and cheap. i don't know if i really need as a newb the capability of using a 38mm motor.
I would use a G80 motor 137Ns One time useable. What you guys think?

jimzcatz said:

Why would you even suggest that? He would be limited to 29mm motors when he clearly wants the option for 38.

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Clearly? Really? I didn't see a single mention of wanting to fly 38mm motors in any of his posts prior to my reply.

Here was my reasoning:

• This forum area is aimed at beginners
• Rici seemed to be having trouble understanding adapters and retainers
• and I wasn't sure if it was a language problem or a concept problem

I thought that possibly he was simply looking for a way to build a rocket that would fly on 29mm motors.

I even qualified my reply with my premise and asked if I was right. I didn't assume I was right.

You and everyone else assumed he wanted to fly 38mm motors though he never said so.

Tell me. Is it your job to discourage participation in the forums? I only ask because you seem to be so good at it.

actually my plans would be to fly a 29mm motor on a 2.56" Tube. And as you said i will use a smaller 29mm Blue Tube to make the motor mount with 3 centering rings. I will use adapters to hold my engine into my tube. It is the easiest way for me.

Actually i just started a couple of month ago with rocketry, i saw the discovery take off and that kind of inspired me to build my own little rocket as an graduation work.

I do all the maths to look how high it possibly could fly and do a summary about all the pieces of a rocket. Like Main tube, Nosecone fins, parachute ect.

And at first i was confused how to attach the motor to the rocket but than it was quite easy with your methode Thanks well yes i guess i am a noob Like you once have been.

Sorry about my bad english :-/ i'm from Switzerland

Greetings

dostergaard said:

Clearly? Really? I didn't see a single mention of wanting to fly 38mm motors in any of his posts prior to my reply.

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Actually, he mentioned 38mm in his very first post. Twice.

yes as an adapter but not as an motor. Because i had no clue and you tried to help me

Ricci,

Ihr Englisch ist viel besser als mein Deutsch. Ich weiß gar nicht sprechen Französisch oder Italienisch. Ich hatte mehrere Geschäftsreisen nach Zürich vor ein paar Jahren. Schöne Stadt! Viel Glück mit Ihrem Projekt, was du zu bauen entscheiden. Adapter machen Ihnen mehr Flexibilität.

Haha Freut mich. I speak french and italian fluently... so whatever you want Ya i'll use a 29mm Tube for the motor "container" and an 29mm adapter. So i can switch easily and it looks sexy. Ya really? I live near Zurich like 30minutes Ya nice place..

Dean,

You are officially appointed to international relations comity of the Maine Missile Math & Science Club.:handshake:

I have used the Aeropack retainers and they work great! Just follow the instructions but also read the size descriptions as they make ones for blue tube and phenolic tube and there is a wall thickness difference.

I understand friction fit and tapeing a motor in but really don't understand doing it, Motor hardware is expensive and the Aeropack provides a thrust ring and retention all in one.:2:

Scott Costigan
NAR 91379 L-1
[email protected]