Tweety Bird

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Wayco

Desert Rat Rocketeer
TRF Supporter
Joined
Mar 23, 2011
Messages
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Location
Goodyear, AZ
The seed for this build was planted around a campfire at a ROC launch back in 2014. We were talking about our last Wildman black Saturday purchase, which included four 1 grain 54mm CTI cases. Not that we needed the cases, but Wildman was including a free closure with each case ordered. I commented that I had no idea what we could use them for, and Jack G. (What's up Hobbies) got up and went over to an old container and dug out three plywood centering rings with five 54mm holes in them. They fit 7.5" LOC tubing.

We didn't do anything with them until October 2015, when they announced that LDRS 35 would be at Lucerne dry lake with ROC. that's when we decided to build a rocket and name it after Jack G's semi-truck "Tweety Bird".

We Ordered a bunch of parts and got a team together to build a "Large, Dangerous Rocket Ship". Long story shortened slightly, couldn't get it done in time for that launch. It sat until they announced that LDRS 37 would be held in Central California with TCC. Tripoli Central Calif. was Jack's "home" field, so what better place to debut this rocket. So we are back at it again, still having time challenges with the team, but making progress.

Yesterday morning Guy Smith showed up to help set up the rotisserie. We got the payload tube sleeved and epoxied with some old West Systems 105/205, the hardener had changed color, but it still set up OK:
086.jpg


While that was rolling along and setting up, we stuck the fins into the motor mount assembly. The fin can and motor mount had been built during our previous attempt, so it was fairly easy to assemble. We had a build day last month that got a small can mounted on top of the MM assembly to hold a PET-2 timer and LiPo battery for air starting the outboard motors. We cut out a small door above the top centering ring for access:
004.jpg


I ran two pair of wires down to two sets of terminal blocks mounted on the bottom of the lower centering ring:
097.jpg


Now we are putting it all together with Rocketpoxy on the fin roots and PML foam between all the motor mount tubes:
101.jpg


Fins are all stuck on and curing:
108.jpg


Payload tube is cured and epoxy is in the green stage, so we are pulling it off the rotisserie and trimming the ends off:
008.jpg


Ready for foam:
114.jpg


Kris is mixing and I'm pouring:
119.jpg

135.jpg


Sharon is bringing me alcohol soaked towels and Q-tips to clean up any foam that isn't in the right place:
133.jpg


Joyce is taking most of the pictures and cleaning up some epoxy that leaked into the payload tube:
110.jpg


Almost done with the foam:
151.jpg


Final fitting of the aft centering ring:
156.jpg


More rocketpoxy to hold it in place:
161.jpg


Finally, the last ring is in place:
177.jpg


Stand it up and let the epoxy flow down onto the bottom ring:
178.jpg


Yesterday was a very productive day, and I was inspired by all we got done. Most of the big stuff is complete, so I'm putting all the smaller stuff together now.

More to come!
 
I woke up this morning with all kinds of ideas on what should be done next. Since it was still dark outside, I started setting up the avbay:
023.jpg


Since I take my Wildman oath seriously, I started thinking about what I could fit into that center motor mount, and naturally, it had to be the biggest motor I had:
018.jpg


To get a Loki 54-4000 motor to fit, I had to modify the bulkplate for my drogue recovery anchor point:
017.jpg


Plenty of room now:
019.jpg


So I mixed up some more old West systems, added some colloidal silica to thicken it up and gooped it all up and stuck it in:

022.jpg


That's all I had time for today, but I've got the bit in my teeth now. More to come soon! :horse:
 
We have a few choices, and I think the first flight will be with an L640 dual thrust in the center and four I218 white thunder loads.
If we can keep the weight under 35 lbs. the L640 will get it off the rail at 62 fps. When we fly it on the Loki M1378, we might try some bigger loads in the outboard tubes. I do have four 54/1706 cases, but that would be a stretch for the PET-2 timer. First fire igniters want 3 amps each, and the PET is rated for 5 amps max. I would prefer to use CTI motors and their ematch igniters.
 

I do have four 54/1706 cases, but that would be a stretch for the PET-2 timer. First fire igniters want 3 amps each, and the PET is rated for 5 amps max. I would prefer to use CTI motors and their ematch igniters.

Light them same way Sharon & I did in the Jart Drag race........E-match & pixie dust pill[on a stick], up the pipe. Pet-2 can easily handle that.:wink:
 
Light em 2 at a time Wayne..
Severely cool,, and completely negates the concern of amperage draw on the ignition circuit...
I absolutely love contrast in the sky,, looks super cool..
I usually leave the pad with the most thrust I can get, so that's usually a Loki Blue or a high thrust loki white..
Then light Aerotech black FastJack's in the air...
Check out this flight at Mid West Power--

https://onebadhawk.com/midwest-power-10312015.html

That was a Loki K 960 super punch off the pad and 2-- Aerotech J 575 FJ's in the air..


This one is a J 420 Aerotech Red off the pad and 2-- Aerotech H 178 Dark matter's in the air on an overcast day...
Very cool...

https://onebadhawk.com/metra-812015.html

That Tweety is a super super cool build...
You're going to just love flying that thing for years to come...
The possibilities with those 2 sets of airstarts are endless...
Very cool build...

Teddy
 
Man, that looks like so much fun! What a nice family project. Over here in MD, it is cold, and I'm stuck in the basement. My kids are too little to help much, and my wife doesn't much care for rockets. I would enjoy a build session like that.
 
Very cool. Love the family/group project. No such thing here. That's just awesome.
 
Light em 2 at a time Wayne..
Severely cool,, and completely negates the concern of amperage draw on the ignition circuit...
I absolutely love contrast in the sky,, looks super cool..
I usually leave the pad with the most thrust I can get, so that's usually a Loki Blue or a high thrust loki white..
Then light Aerotech black FastJack's in the air...

That Tweety is a super super cool build...
You're going to just love flying that thing for years to come...
The possibilities with those 2 sets of airstarts are endless...
Very cool build...

Teddy

Great idea Teddy! I will give that a try after I get a couple of good airstarts under my belt. The PET-2 timer is a bit complicated to program, and I want to get things going off the rail as quickly as possible. With the L640 dual thrust, and four I218's, the L will have to lift the rocket and about 5 lbs of other motors, and it looks like the rocket will probably weigh in at around 40 lbs on the pad. With CTI availability issues, I might never be able to dupicate this configuration, but lighting four ematches is not a problem. When we start using AT loads, CJ's idea will take care of that issue. (Thanks CJ!) Lot's of options when I get a couple of successful launches completed.

Man, that looks like so much fun! What a nice family project. Over here in MD, it is cold, and I'm stuck in the basement. My kids are too little to help much, and my wife doesn't much care for rockets. I would enjoy a build session like that.

I didn't realize how much fun a group project could be before we restarted this project last month. Having the extra hands and ideas makes for a great building environment. The area we are building in is covered, but still outside. In Arizona, this is prime flying season, and we usually build in the summer when the outside temp. helps the epoxy dry. Not that I'm gonna complain about the current temps. here, but I still wait for it to warm up a bit before going outside and working...




Wow ! You have a L640 dual thrust !l

Kenny

Sent from my LG-LS997 using Rocketry Forum mobile app

Honestly Kenny, I'm surprised that you are surprised. You know how we are, and Robert and Gloria are coming to town next month! It will only get worse when CTI starts making the bigger reloads again. I was seriously depressed when Sharon flew our last L935...

Very cool. Love the family/group project. No such thing here. That's just awesome.

Thanks for your comments Mikey, I am truly blessed with good friends and a wife that share my passion.

Yesterday I had to help Sharon up in the office for a while, but still managed to get some more work done on the avbay:
004_1.jpg


It took me quite a while to drill out the 1/2" holes for those switches, the cardboard "stiffy" tube inside the coupler is 1/2" thick, and wants to delaminate as you drill through it. I used a bunch of thin CA to toughen it up, and still had a hard time cleaning up the holes.
005_1.jpg


Sharon and I had a discussion about those Schurter rotary switches, and decided that this rocket probably won't get that many flights on it, (considering the cost of 54mm motors) so the "how many cycles" issue will probably not be an issue.
This morning I got up worried about the weight of the rocket and extra motors my primary (center) motor will have to lift, so I went outside and weighed everything as it is now.
The fincan still needs external fillets, and the drogue recovery, but as is, it's weighing in at 13 lbs. 9.2 oz. The newly finished payload tube is only 2 lbs. 9.6 oz. and the avbay with all it's goodies in is almost 5 lbs.!
:y:
I have two nosecones, one was donated by Kris, and it has some weight epoxied into the tip, which we might need to balance out the extra motors. The other N/C is much longer, but weighs 2 lbs. less.
002_1.jpg


I had to do a bunch of work on the shorter one, and it still needs more. The longer one we got in the last estate sale we bought into, and it will need some work to fit in the payload tube, but would be my choice if we can make it fit right.

First picture with all the components together:
003_1.jpg


Rough estimate with the weights I got this morning will put it at about 40 lbs. dry.... I haven't added everything into Open rocket yet, but Thrustcurve says it will come of the rail at 56 fps with the L640 maybe.....
 
Eric... Do you want to tell them, or should I?

I REALLY hate to be "that" guy, especially for this project, but...

LDRS is being held in the Republik of Kalifornia. No Loki. Pretty much stuck with CTI or AT.

Please don't shoot the messenger.
 
You are bringing this beast to LDRS 37? I can’t wait to see it fly!

Well YEAH! Jack G's home field? Of course we want to bring it there.


Eric... Do you want to tell them, or should I?

I REALLY hate to be "that" guy, especially for this project, but...

LDRS is being held in the Republik of Kalifornia. No Loki. Pretty much stuck with CTI or AT.

Please don't shoot the messenger.

This is not a problem. We fly at several other California venues and are well aware of the motor restrictions. We also fly at Airfest in Kansas, which has Loki as an onsite vendor.
First flight will probably be here in Arizona with TRA/PHX, and we have several other motors that can do the job.
 
Wayne,,
I didn't realize the California issue..
But lifting that is no probs at all.. Loki 54 / 2800 L 1400 LW...

https://www.thrustcurve.org/simfilesearch.jsp?id=1031

Get 4--- 38 mm Aeropac adapters...
I'm not kidding,,
This is going to be the coolest most fun rocket ever..
I bet you're going to fly this thing every chance you get for years and years to come...

Ohhh,,
Try a Marsa 54L..
Super reliable,, 4 channels,, super easy to program / navigate the menus...
I'm not great at all with software and I even learned the Marsa programming with ease...

All of my builds have a Eggtimer as secondary deployment ( I love their reliability )...
And I use a Marsa 54L as primary deployment and to do the airstarts...

Teddy
 
Hard to believe it's been over a month since my last post, but this is our busy time of year. Something going on every weekend, and Sharon's work has been pouring in.
I have been trying to get back to this project, with little steps here and there. I got the cover/door attached to the fincan for the timer bay. Made up a drogue pocket with a Skyangle 24" drogue, and pulled out the Skyangle Cert 3 XL chute we got from Jim Rossen's estate sale for the main. Put it together with one of Teddy's kevlar shock cords and a Wildman Nomex 24" chute protector and all the recovery is in. Today I drilled the static ports into the 7" diameter by 15" long avbay, and with the judicious use of thin CA got them cleaned up. We stacked everything together with the shorter weighted nosecone and put it on the scale.....
023.jpg


Weighed in at 32.5 lbs!
When you add in the weight of all four of the one grain motors for the airstarts, it's still well under the max weight of 40 lbs. for the center motor to lift. Still needs some paint, and we found the perfect pilot for this "Loony Tunes" rocket...
Hoping to get the first flight done at the next TRA/PHX launch in April, then it's on to the Large, Dangerous Rocket launch in central California!
 
That AV BAY sled cracks me up !

Too much acreage .. needs a title search before flight !

Kenny
 
I have been slowly tying up loose ends this week. Got the longer, lighter nosecone cleaned up and fitted to the payload tube. Added a 1/2" thick plywood bulkplate with a 4" hole in the center to the step inside and two u-bolts for the anchor point. The 4" hole will have a bulkplate of it's own to seal the upper part of this N/C, and have a sled with the GPS tracker on it. All the recovery is installed and attached, so today I did my ejection charge tests.
Started with the drogue/fincan end, and a 3 gram charge:


[video=youtube;jGXdVSE2NV0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGXdVSE2NV0&feature=youtu.be[/video],

It took two tries for the main chute to come out satisfactorily, The first 3 gram charge was a bit whimpy, so we doubled it and got a good deployment with 6 grams. Click on the link, and don't ask me why it didn't come up like the first one:

[video]https://youtu.be/OYNiN0y3NkI[/video]

This weekend looks good for painting, and the weather forecast for the launch later this month is also looking good. We will try to get a video of the first flight and post it up here later this month. I'm planning to stagger the airstarts, two I218 white thunder motors first and then two I120 Imax loads. The center motor is an L640. Still need to get them all loaded into Open Rocket and see how it goes...
 
Two years later, I reviewed this thread and found that I hadn't updated it to include the results of it's first flights.
The plan was to fly it first at our local TRA/PHX launch, but we didn't get a high power waiver, so we took it to Tripoli Central California for LDRS untested. Wednesday, May 16th, 2018 was it's first flight, well before the crowds showed up. It took quite a while to prep, what with building five motors, then getting out to the pad and finding out that I forgotten a few tools to install the ignitors with, but finally Tweety bird flew on the L640 dual thrust, two I218's and two I120's. Great boost, but it was hard to tell when the outboard motors fired, all of them were white!

Tweety%20bird%20off%20the%20rail.jpeg


Apogee at 5187 ft. and I discovered that I had forgotten to attach the quick link to the Nosecone. :eek: Fortunately, it landed in a soft field with minimal damage. After scrounging around for some epoxy and fiberglass tape, I repaired the skirt on the nosecone and sanded it down until I was happy with the fit. We did an ejection charge test Saturday morning before the second flight and got good results with 6 grams of black powder. It still took quite a while to install all the ignitors out on the pad, with two other big rockets beeping away nearby. When we got back to the flight line, they were already announcing our flight, so Sharon went running up to the LCO yelling to stop the flight. David Reese (Wildman West) stopped and gave us time to get our tracker running and watch the flight:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eaOG_3UjTM

Big thanks to Nathan Montalvo for filming the entire flight.
Powered by our last L640, two more I218's and two I140 skidmarks, this flight made it to 4787 ft. and everything came down together. If you watch closely, you can see the skidmarks fire at 27 seconds on the video.

The third flight was supposed to be at LDRS 38 with the Kloudbusters in Kansas. I had purchased the M1378 reload to fly in my LOKI 54/4000 casing, and planned to build the motor at the launch. We got together with Scott and built the motor, but I wimped out and brought the rocket home to fly with TRA/PHX for our "Aguila Skies" fall launch.
Before taking it to Kansas, I had modified the N/C to hold a two pound weight at the top with a 3/8" piece of allthread 2 ft. long. This allowed me to fly the M1378 with four 2 grain motors in the outboard tubes, then remove the weight and fly it on an L935 Imax with smaller outboards.
Pad weight was up to just over 50 lbs. for the Aguila skies flight on 10-19-2019. The M1378 was getting it off the pad, with two J430 White thunder motors firing as soon as the PET-2 detected launch, and two J250 Skidmarks firing two seconds later.
This was a most impressive flight, unfortunately, the video camera set up to capture this flight was too close to the massive blast as it left the pad, knocking it over in the dust with no good coverage.
Apogee was at 8818 ft. and the rocket was recovered with no damage.
 
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