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  1. #31
    Join Date
    31st October 2016
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    120
    Quote Originally Posted by Rktman View Post
    Thanks, definitely worth trying it this way before I invest in any more saws. I'd rather spend a little more time getting a nice evenly clean cut than risk a faster but splintered and uneven result. This is all new territory for me, and I've got more patience than $.
    You are welcome, but which way? Are you trying to make a long straight cut?

    I was just in my shop looking for a piece of 1/8" plywood scrap, so I could bother you with more pictures. I think I am trying to work myself up to posting a build thread <grin>. Got distracted by the half-finished rocket sitting on my bench before I found anything suitable in the scrap pile.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rktman View Post
    Took a look online and that particular one just happens to be one of three that I want to go down in person and check out. This larger one from home depot is another https://www.homedepot.com/p/Vaughan-...250D/100373697
    Yeah -- that link goes to the very blade hanging on the peg board in post #13 . Its pretty much the same saw as the Shark that Dan posted about in post #21 and that sooner.boomer described in post #15. It is a good saw to have, but its not a good choice for the application you describe. Actually, I don't know about the Irwin version but the Shark saw is -- as far as I could tell when I was shopping -- virtually identical to the Bear. Do beware: Dewalt and Stanley both sold the same Ryoba-style saw which was poorly reviewed. But even the good ones aren't good for what you want to do.

    Last edited by jlabrasca; 8th January 2018 at 12:15 AM. Reason: sooner.boomer looked at his Irwin while I was posting my bloviation
    NAR Level 1, Sheridan Oregon, 09/16/17 -- scratch built 7.6cm x 120cm rocket on an AT H182R.

  2. #32
    Join Date
    31st October 2016
    Posts
    120
    Quote Originally Posted by sooner.boomer View Post
    Looking at the specs on that saw, it has the same teeth on both sides (at least that's what the web page seems to imply)...
    Nope -- the specs are just badly translated on the printed-in-Japan packaging, which bad translation has been copied onto the HD site (and also on Amazon, now that I look there). I took mine down from the wall.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    The danger of having a computer in the shop is that you can hear the email chime and be pulled away from the fiddly and frustrating work of trying to glue a skin onto an airfoiled fin to the much more gratifying work of telling other people how to do stuff...

    Edit: Okay, looking at the picture I see that I have a 250RBD not a 250D. The picture of the 250D HERE looks pretty much like my saw, so I stand by my assertion that the 250D is also a rip/crosscut blade -- but I am prepared to be told that I am wrong.

    Now I am turning off the WiFi on this computer.

    Last edited by jlabrasca; 8th January 2018 at 12:49 AM. Reason: edit decided to compare the 250d to the 250RBD...
    NAR Level 1, Sheridan Oregon, 09/16/17 -- scratch built 7.6cm x 120cm rocket on an AT H182R.

  3. #33
    Join Date
    21st March 2011
    Location
    central America
    Posts
    1,975
    How wide are the pieces you need to cut? I'm wondering if a saw is the right way to go. If the pieces you need are less than 1/2" wide, somethingg like a balsa stripper might work better. Example: https://hobbyking.com/en_us/master-a...___store=en_us

  4. #34
    Join Date
    5th March 2017
    Location
    Pittsboro, NC
    Posts
    367
    Quote Originally Posted by dr wogz View Post
    Ahh, long straight cuts.

    Question, does it have to be ply? why not use 1/2" x 1/8" basswood or maple. sometimes some specialty stores will have strips already cut (I'm thinking of model boat builders)

    And, to take a trick from my mum, who was an avid quilter. you can get a rotary cutter, it;s like a pizza wheel / cutter, but has a round X-Acto type blade..

    https://www.walmart.ca/en/ip/fiskars.../6000052803667

    (I just tried it on a piece of 1/16" ply, and it only took 3 passes.. blade is dull & rusty.. mind you, only the corner of a piece of ply..)
    Ply turned out to be noticeably lighter than basswood and I've been unable to find spruce, ply, or any other hardwood sticks in hobby shops/crafting stores anywhere here (and there are only a handful anyway). As I'm just starting to get experience scratch building gliders, I'm beginning to see what works and what doesn't (e.g. a 1/8" balsa fuselage doesn't; it snapped in 2 places when the wings deployed). Two Apogee glider kits I built employ 1/8" ply and they're plenty strong, which is why I went with 1/8" ply (also they're available in sheet form at hobby shops here).

    The rotary cutter may work to get the initial cut started so it's easier for another tool to align its blade and finish the cut, but I'm wondering how long and how much effort it would take on 1/8" ply. (I initially tried cutting my ply with an Xacto knife but gave up after 15 minutes when it didn't seem I was making much headway). Thanks for the feedback though. Guess I'd consider a Makerspace studio with a laser cutter if I built several gliders a week but otherwise I couldn't justify the dues. (Dues would probably pay for the right tool that I'd own outright after a few visits).
    NAR# 103899

    "As I hurtled through space, one thought kept crossing my mind—every part of this rocket was supplied by the lowest bidder".
    — John Glenn, Jr.

  5. #35
    Join Date
    5th March 2017
    Location
    Pittsboro, NC
    Posts
    367
    Quote Originally Posted by jlabrasca View Post
    You are welcome, but which way? Are you trying to make a long straight cut?

    I was just in my shop looking for a piece of 1/8" plywood scrap, so I could bother you with more pictures. I think I am trying to work myself up to posting a build thread <grin>. Got distracted by the half-finished rocket sitting on my bench before I found anything suitable in the scrap pile.



    Yeah -- that link goes to the very blade hanging on the peg board in post #13 . Its pretty much the same saw as the Shark that Dan posted about in post #21 and that sooner.boomer described in post #15. It is a good saw to have, but its not a good choice for the application you describe. Actually, I don't know about the Irwin version but the Shark saw is -- as far as I could tell when I was shopping -- virtually identical to the Bear. Do beware: Dewalt and Stanley both sold the same Ryoba-style saw which was poorly reviewed. But even the good ones aren't good for what you want to do.
    Yes, trying to make make long straight cuts with the grain for glider fuselages. And if you do decide to do a build thread re: these saws, techniques and how they can be used to cut what, please let me know so I can subscribe. I'm sure I'm not the only newbie out there that could really benefit from it.
    NAR# 103899

    "As I hurtled through space, one thought kept crossing my mind—every part of this rocket was supplied by the lowest bidder".
    — John Glenn, Jr.

  6. #36
    Join Date
    5th March 2017
    Location
    Pittsboro, NC
    Posts
    367
    Quote Originally Posted by sooner.boomer View Post
    How wide are the pieces you need to cut? I'm wondering if a saw is the right way to go. If the pieces you need are less than 1/2" wide, somethingg like a balsa stripper might work better. Example: https://hobbyking.com/en_us/master-a...___store=en_us
    Just need strips 1/2" x 1/8" thick. But is a balsa stripper sharp and sturdy enough to but 1/8" ply sheets? After just needing scissors to cut 1/64" and 1/32" ply, I was caught off guard at how hard and tough 1/8" birch ply really is.
    NAR# 103899

    "As I hurtled through space, one thought kept crossing my mind—every part of this rocket was supplied by the lowest bidder".
    — John Glenn, Jr.

  7. #37
    Join Date
    21st March 2011
    Location
    central America
    Posts
    1,975
    Quote Originally Posted by Rktman View Post
    Just need strips 1/2" x 1/8" thick. But is a balsa stripper sharp and sturdy enough to but 1/8" ply sheets? After just needing scissors to cut 1/64" and 1/32" ply, I was caught off guard at how hard and tough 1/8" birch ply really is.
    Most of them use X-acto-style blades. The advantage is that they are fenced/guided cutters. You can go over the same line *exactly*, over and over, cutting a little deeper each time. You can also flip the sheet of ply over and make the same exact cut (same spacing from edge). You can't cut it in one pass, but I don't think I'd try to cut 1/8" balsa in one pass, either. A larger, more expensive version of a balsa stripper is a cutting gauge.
    http://www.marples.co.uk/images/rose...ge3-larger.jpg
    The brass wedge is holding a blade that does the cutting. There are also marking/mortising gauges that use pins. Harbor Freight sell one for less than $10. You could get one of them, remove the pins, and add a holder for an X-acto blade.

  8. #38
    Join Date
    23rd July 2011
    Location
    Butte, MT
    Posts
    2,279
    Plywood is not particularly strong in long narrow strips like that. Lumber yards sell spruce furring strips that they might even rip to size for a small cut charge.
    https://m.lowes.com/pd/Spruce-Pine-F...-ft/1000016911
    Steve Shannon
    L3CC, TAP, Director, Tripoli Rocketry Association

  9. #39
    Join Date
    5th February 2009
    Location
    Montreal, Qweebec
    Posts
    3,409
    Lastly, with all that's been said, and the time taken, and apparent costs involved for 'the right tool'/ Why not talk to a laser cutter / plans cutter to do them for you? Thinking of someone like laser lizard or even if Madcow would do you some laser cut pieces..

    http://laserlizard.com/
    -paul

    NAR# 101258 - L1
    www.CRMRC.org
    I don't know the same things you don't know..

  10. #40
    Join Date
    5th March 2017
    Location
    Pittsboro, NC
    Posts
    367
    Quote Originally Posted by sooner.boomer View Post
    Most of them use X-acto-style blades. The advantage is that they are fenced/guided cutters. You can go over the same line *exactly*, over and over, cutting a little deeper each time. You can also flip the sheet of ply over and make the same exact cut (same spacing from edge). You can't cut it in one pass, but I don't think I'd try to cut 1/8" balsa in one pass, either. A larger, more expensive version of a balsa stripper is a cutting gauge.
    http://www.marples.co.uk/images/rose...ge3-larger.jpg
    The brass wedge is holding a blade that does the cutting. There are also marking/mortising gauges that use pins. Harbor Freight sell one for less than $10. You could get one of them, remove the pins, and add a holder for an X-acto blade.
    Thanks buddy. Something else for me to consider.
    NAR# 103899

    "As I hurtled through space, one thought kept crossing my mind—every part of this rocket was supplied by the lowest bidder".
    — John Glenn, Jr.

  11. #41
    Join Date
    5th March 2017
    Location
    Pittsboro, NC
    Posts
    367
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Shannon View Post
    Plywood is not particularly strong in long narrow strips like that. Lumber yards sell spruce furring strips that they might even rip to size for a small cut charge.
    https://m.lowes.com/pd/Spruce-Pine-F...-ft/1000016911

    Thanks Steve. I'll give Lowes and any local lumber yards I can find a call to see if they can accommodate small narrow cuts like that. Would be great if they could.
    NAR# 103899

    "As I hurtled through space, one thought kept crossing my mind—every part of this rocket was supplied by the lowest bidder".
    — John Glenn, Jr.

  12. #42
    Join Date
    5th March 2017
    Location
    Pittsboro, NC
    Posts
    367
    Quote Originally Posted by dr wogz View Post
    Lastly, with all that's been said, and the time taken, and apparent costs involved for 'the right tool'/ Why not talk to a laser cutter / plans cutter to do them for you? Thinking of someone like laser lizard or even if Madcow would do you some laser cut pieces..

    http://laserlizard.com/
    I forgot about that. Worth looking into, especially if it's less expensive than a Maker studio membership. Thanks for the suggestion.
    NAR# 103899

    "As I hurtled through space, one thought kept crossing my mind—every part of this rocket was supplied by the lowest bidder".
    — John Glenn, Jr.

  13. #43
    Join Date
    19th January 2009
    Location
    Tucson, Az
    Posts
    2,350
    I use my scroll saw for cutting plywood fins and centering rings. Well worth the investment if you are going to do a lot of scratch building.
    more rockets then cents

  14. #44
    Join Date
    31st October 2016
    Posts
    120
    Quote Originally Posted by Rktman View Post
    Yes, trying to make make long straight cuts with the grain for glider fuselages. And if you do decide to do a build thread re: these saws, techniques and how they can be used to cut what, please let me know so I can subscribe. I'm sure I'm not the only newbie out there that could really benefit from it.
    I like to pretend I am handy in the shop, but I am pretty much a noob w.r.t. rocket building. I also suspect that I misuse most my my hand tools. ^_^

    Quote Originally Posted by Rktman View Post
    Ply turned out to be noticeably lighter than basswood and I've been unable to find spruce, ply, or any other hardwood sticks in hobby shops/crafting stores anywhere here (and there are only a handful anyway). As I'm just starting to get experience scratch building gliders, I'm beginning to see what works and what doesn't (e.g. a 1/8" balsa fuselage doesn't; it snapped in 2 places when the wings deployed). Two Apogee glider kits I built employ 1/8" ply and they're plenty strong, which is why I went with 1/8" ply (also they're available in sheet form at hobby shops here).
    There're lots of ways to get where you want to go. Making up your own glue-lam from 1/32" balsa or basswood. Or laminating something tough between thin pieces of something rigid but brittle. A friend in our club brought an Estes Tercel to a low power launch. The fuselage stick is two pieces of balsa with a piece of Tyvek laminated between them. Seems to work pretty well.

    Sticking to the problem at hand -- how to cut a 1/2" x 14" strip from 1/8' plywood; if you have a long-enough straight edge your razor saw will do the job. Scoring it on both faces with a utility knife before you saw might save you some sanding -- maybe -- but I don't think you need to invest in a $12-$30 back saw/pull saw for this job.

    As for shopping it out to a laser cutter, if its just a rectangle, and its just one piece, seems like a lot of trouble and a lot of waiting and a lot of shipping for two cuts.
    NAR Level 1, Sheridan Oregon, 09/16/17 -- scratch built 7.6cm x 120cm rocket on an AT H182R.

  15. #45
    Join Date
    5th March 2017
    Location
    Pittsboro, NC
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    367
    Quote Originally Posted by jlabrasca View Post
    I like to pretend I am handy in the shop, but I am pretty much a noob w.r.t. rocket building. I also suspect that I misuse most my my hand tools. ^_^



    There're lots of ways to get where you want to go. Making up your own glue-lam from 1/32" balsa or basswood. Or laminating something tough between thin pieces of something rigid but brittle. A friend in our club brought an Estes Tercel to a low power launch. The fuselage stick is two pieces of balsa with a piece of Tyvek laminated between them. Seems to work pretty well.

    Sticking to the problem at hand -- how to cut a 1/2" x 14" strip from 1/8' plywood; if you have a long-enough straight edge your razor saw will do the job. Scoring it on both faces with a utility knife before you saw might save you some sanding -- maybe -- but I don't think you need to invest in a $12-$30 back saw/pull saw for this job.

    As for shopping it out to a laser cutter, if its just a rectangle, and its just one piece, seems like a lot of trouble and a lot of waiting and a lot of shipping for two cuts.
    The tyvek or a 'glass and balsa "sandwich" sounds promising and lighter than using basswood. It might also resist warping better, a persistent problem I've had even with ply strips. Maybe this bad weather worked in my favor since I haven't had the chance to check out any tools firsthand yet.

    NAR# 103899

    "As I hurtled through space, one thought kept crossing my mind—every part of this rocket was supplied by the lowest bidder".
    — John Glenn, Jr.

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