Available 'motor starters'?

The Rocketry Forum

Help Support The Rocketry Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

davel

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 17, 2009
Messages
635
Reaction score
71
What igniters are currently available as a higher quality and reliability replacement for Estes solar igniters for use with BP clusters? In particular, anything that is reliable when wired in series? I've been inactive for a while now and haven't kept up.

Dave
 
What igniters are currently available as a higher quality and reliability replacement for Estes solar igniters for use with BP clusters? In particular, anything that is reliable when wired in series? I've been inactive for a while now and haven't kept up.

Dave
Go check out the Loki with Estes sonic. You will find sources to build HPR APCP igniters cheaper in a bunch of sizes. MJG firewires also work and aren't ATF regulated. These were reliable if you had the current required.
 
Why do you need to wire them in series? I just use old-style Estes igniters wired in parallel- I've done 3 on a car battery system with no relay, no problem, and you can probably do more. If you don't have those, the MJG BP starters are probably the best- I haven't used them though.

How many motors are you trying to cluster?

Boris Katan is really the person to ask- delta22 on the forum I believe. He's made several massive mixed-propellant clusters using Rocketflite ematches IIRC.
 
Get a little fabric glue and dip your Estes igniters in BP. Increases reliability by a large margin.
 
Go check out the Loki with Estes sonic. You will find sources to build HPR APCP igniters cheaper in a bunch of sizes. MJG firewires also work and aren't ATF regulated. These were reliable if you had the current required.

The Estes Sonic igniters are not low current. I wouldn't try to light a cluster with them.
 
Get a little fabric glue and dip your Estes igniters in BP. Increases reliability by a large margin.
+1! That works very well! Just watch out not to put too much glue on, that can effect how well it burns.



Thanks,
 
Best I've done with the old style Estes igniters in a cluster of 6 D11-Ps and 1 D12-7 using a standard 12v relay / battery close to pad system. I wouldn't try that many using any type of launch system that had a remote battery. You lose too much current over long distances with the gauge wire used by most systems that are set up like that.
 
Investigate flash pans if you are doing a big cluster of black powder motors.
 
The Estes Sonic igniters are not low current. I wouldn't try to light a cluster with them.
I've used Estes Sonic igniters for BP clusters, and they work great with 12V. A good substitute for Q2G2s, and longer leads too.
 
+1! That works very well! Just watch out not to put too much glue on, that can effect how well it burns.



Thanks,


+2, I've been doing this, and it's a big improvement. Your glue comment is spot-on.
 
MJG now offers BP and AP motor ignitors as well as Firewires for deployment.
Rich, thanks for pointing that out. I've used their FireWires, but the BP starters look great! I fly a number of cluster rockets up to 7 motors, and am running out of Q2G2s.
 
Get a little fabric glue and dip your Estes igniters in BP. Increases reliability by a large margin.

Why specifically fabric glue? Would other adhesives not work as well?

I've got a stash of Q2-MMX igniters (bridgewire only) and I want to add some "help" so I can use them with BP motors...
 
Last edited:
I would think any flammable cement of a similar viscosity would work. I've heard of using PVC pipe cement. Why is fabric glue better?
 
I would think any flammable cement of a similar viscosity would work. I've heard of using PVC pipe cement. Why is fabric glue better?
I certainly would be guessing if I suggested flexibility, just trying to remember what the article recommended as nearly as possible.
 
I wrote the article for Sport Rocketry magazine.

The fabric glue is Beacon Fabri-Tac. I use it because it contains acetone, very flammable.
The Fabri-Tac glue reminds me of the old tube type plastic model cement. When you draw the bottle
away there is a long string of adhesive from the model to the bottle tip.

Pout a small amount of the black powder into the BP bottle cap.
Apply a little Fabri-Tac to both sides of the starter igniter.
Roll the glued tip in the black powder.
Form the glued BP into a pointed shape with your fingertips, small enough to fit into the nozzle. Done!

NOTE: I have not used these in a cluster yet. You would still have to test the treated igniter tips with a 12 volt system.
These are not meant to replace the Quest Q2G2 igniters for clusters.
These work very well with the Estes style, 6 volt controllers with single engine ignition.

For me it's easier than adding liquid acetone all the time to a hard, dried up dip kit igniter mix.
You can make them up anytime quickly and easily.

The Fabri-Tac glue is also very good for gluing plastic adapters or boat tails - plastic to kraft body tubes or
nose cone shoulders into nose cones. I wouldn't recommend it for a Mercury Redstone tower, liquid cement
is still the best for that.

I can't upload a picture - the second picture in this blog post shows the glue -
https://modelrocketbuilding.blogspot.com/2016/07/estes-interceptor-build-1250-part-24.html
 
And I'm here to say that Chris's method works. I'm sure it's not the only method; I'm sure there are other glues that work. But my suggestion was based on experience, not intended as an exhaustive report.

BTW, thanks, Chris. My kids get a way higher ignition ratio using your method. :handshake:
 
you can make them a lot more reliable by dipping them in clear fingernail polish or nitrate dope then 4f black powder.
 
Back
Top