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  1. #1
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    29 Reload Hardware

    I'm considering purchasing 29 motor hardware.

    Looking for the best bag for buck when considering options for the reloads to the hardware. I am not in an area where a local shop carries reloads so everything would have to be internet based shopping and if I could avoid hazmat fees on the "larger" 29 reload, that'd be awesome.

    Thanks
    Nathan


  2. #2
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    apogee's website shows that a fair number of Aero techs F reloads require a hazmat fee while their Es and Gs do not.
    Rex

    L2-competitor 3, AT J350W, 8/27/2016, Bong, 2557'
    my youtube channel http://www.youtube.com/channel/UC0gB...?feature=watch

  3. #3
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    All CTI 29mm motors require hazmat due to their starter pellets, which just leaves AT options. Do you have a vendor at local launches, if so they moderate the hit for hazmat fees, if you do have a local launch vendor support them and whatever they sell.
    Rich

    NAR# 99154

    L3-4x upscale Estes Cherokee-D- AT M1297W 5/28/2016 http://www.rocketryforum.com/showthr...r-rharshberger

    TriCities Rocketeers NAR section# 736 http://www.tricitiesrocketeers.org/

  4. #4
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    http://urrg.us/smf/index.php?topic=146.0


    short version? The Aerotech 29/360 motors (I200W, and H268R) are non hazmat

    The majority of Loki 38mm motors for L1 are also non hazmat. zoom zoom
    David McCann
    Dave's Rockets | My Flights
    URRG |URRF 4| Level 2 | TRA# 14210

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rex R View Post
    apogee's website shows that a fair number of Aero techs F reloads require a hazmat fee while their Es and Gs do not.
    Rex
    has to do with individual grain size. A single grain F is over the shippable limit. a two grain G is not.
    David McCann
    Dave's Rockets | My Flights
    URRG |URRF 4| Level 2 | TRA# 14210

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavidMcCann View Post
    http://urrg.us/smf/index.php?topic=146.0


    short version? The Aerotech 29/360 motors (I200W, and H268R) are non hazmat

    The majority of Loki 38mm motors for L1 are also non hazmat. zoom zoom
    Yup.

  7. #7
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    Just realized we're in MPR, and by "larger" you don't mean largest.

    Many AT 29mm G reloads are non hazmat. The 29/40-120 case is a great starting point with many loads available
    David McCann
    Dave's Rockets | My Flights
    URRG |URRF 4| Level 2 | TRA# 14210

  8. #8
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    Another option is to pick up a 29/120 complete case and fly the snot out of it. When you want to fly bigger, just add the larger tube because you already have the closures.


    Sent from my iPad using Rocketry Forum
    Jarrett Dorough

    Most people are average

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by grouch View Post
    Another option is to pick up a 29/120 complete case and fly the snot out of it. When you want to fly bigger, just add the larger tube because you already have the closures.


    Sent from my iPad using Rocketry Forum
    probably the best advice given in rocketry. I wish I did this. But I'm addicted to greens.
    David McCann
    Dave's Rockets | My Flights
    URRG |URRF 4| Level 2 | TRA# 14210

  10. #10
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    these will help:
    http://www.aerotech-rocketry.com/upl...x%20Sheet1.pdf
    http://www.aerotech-rocketry.com/upl...nd%20White.pdf

    40-120 case & closures is probably your best bet.
    the 180 case with the spacer system will cover everything else.. I have both - the 40-120 & the 180 (and the 360 case, which I never use) so I can have two motors prepped ready to go

    Hazmat applies to the whole order, not each & every motor on the order. So, buy in bulk if you can (make a $200 order, not a $30 order..) Combine the order with a friend or other club-mates to spread the HAZMAT fee over a much larger order..
    -paul

    NAR# 101258 - L1
    www.CRMRC.org
    I don't know the same things you don't know..

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavidMcCann View Post
    http://urrg.us/smf/index.php?topic=146.0


    short version? The Aerotech 29/360 motors (I200W, and H268R) are non hazmat

    The majority of Loki 38mm motors for L1 are also non hazmat. zoom zoom

    Thanks all for the input. I've noticed that, from to the online vendors I've seen, there seems to be a shortage of reloads...
    Is hardware interchangeable now between manufacturers? I have some old Dr. Rocket 38mm hardware forAT reloads; are there 3rd party hardware manufacturers?

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Normzilla View Post
    Thanks all for the input. I've noticed that, from to the online vendors I've seen, there seems to be a shortage of reloads...
    Is hardware interchangeable now between manufacturers? I have some old Dr. Rocket 38mm hardware forAT reloads; are there 3rd party hardware manufacturers?

    Dr.Rocket, and Rousetech made AT hardware, Nowadays AT does it all in house.

    Simple answer on Loki is only loki makes the hardware.

    CTI is only made by CTI.

    In larger sizes there is some cross over ability between AT and CTI. Loki loads can be made to work with AMW or gorilla cases.


    I wouldn't say theres a shortage....where are you looking?
    David McCann
    Dave's Rockets | My Flights
    URRG |URRF 4| Level 2 | TRA# 14210

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by dr wogz View Post

    Hazmat applies to the whole order, not each & every motor on the order. So, buy in bulk if you can (make a $200 order, not a $30 order..) Combine the order with a friend or other club-mates to spread the HAZMAT fee over a much larger order..
    No HAZ on motors for those cases. At least in the US, not sure about Canada. This was the big driver to getting my first AT case.

    I lost a LOC Onyx with a 2 grain CTI case a while back and needed to fill the hole left by the 2 grain case. It didn't make sense to get another CTI case because I had a 3 grain with spacers but I really missed that size motor for small field flying. I only had the 2 grain case to begin with because it fit the Onyx and gave me enough room to stuff my chute in there without having to carefully wrap it around the protruding 3 grain case. Missing Onyx meant I really did not need the 2 grain case at all, just wanted one.

    I decided to try something completely different in AT never expecting to like it or turn into the mainstay of the motors I fly. I was a little intimidated by the line because their catalogue seemed confusion with a lot of overlap and different motor designations. Anyway, I put a G79W in a small light rocket and was very impressed with it's performance and visual appeal. Honestly, CTI doesn't have anything approaching AT's whites. Anyway, that's my long winded way of saying $64 for the complete motor case and less than $16 for the motors is well worth it and a bargain in rocketry. So there is a little sentimental reasoning why I like the 29/120 case. I could have easily said the 29/180 but then you wouldn't be in the mid range and I figured that's where you wanted to start. BTW, the 120, 180, 240 and 360 are all worth getting.
    Jarrett Dorough

    Most people are average

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by grouch View Post
    No HAZ on motors for those cases. At least in the US, not sure about Canada. This was the big driver to getting my first AT case.

    I lost a LOC Onyx with a 2 grain CTI case a while back and needed to fill the hole left by the 2 grain case. It didn't make sense to get another CTI case because I had a 3 grain with spacers but I really missed that size motor for small field flying. I only had the 2 grain case to begin with because it fit the Onyx and gave me enough room to stuff my chute in there without having to carefully wrap it around the protruding 3 grain case. Missing Onyx meant I really did not need the 2 grain case at all, just wanted one.

    I decided to try something completely different in AT never expecting to like it or turn into the mainstay of the motors I fly. I was a little intimidated by the line because their catalogue seemed confusion with a lot of overlap and different motor designations. Anyway, I put a G79W in a small light rocket and was very impressed with it's performance and visual appeal. Honestly, CTI doesn't have anything approaching AT's whites. Anyway, that's my long winded way of saying $64 for the complete motor case and less than $16 for the motors is well worth it and a bargain in rocketry. So there is a little sentimental reasoning why I like the 29/120 case. I could have easily said the 29/180 but then you wouldn't be in the mid range and I figured that's where you wanted to start. BTW, the 120, 180, 240 and 360 are all worth getting.
    Which cases would that be?
    The G75J in AT 29/180 requires HAZMAT
    As does all the F's and the G138T in the 28/40-120
    And IIRC, pretty much all the 29mm BlackJack loads require HAZMAT, except for the G53J in the 29/40-120. My avatar is my Wildman Sport riding a G53.
    But the rest are HAZMAT free.

    I have the 29/40-120 (flown a few times) and the 180 and 240 cases, which I have never flown. The 180 is still in bubble wrap. I fly more 38mm than anything else and been working on my level 2 since last Christmas but I will shortly be going back to 29mm to try to get my V2 flying right. Still fun to be had there to be sure.
    Last edited by MikeyDSlagle; 26th October 2017 at 02:17 AM.
    Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool.
    TRA #16513
    Level 1: Danger Close ---AT H123W to 1240'--- 29 OCT 2016
    Level 2: Binder Design Tyrannosaur ---AT J315R to 2148'--- 30 SEP 2017

  15. #15
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    I really really like the aerotech 29mm line.

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeyDSlagle View Post
    Which cases would that be?
    29/40-120 case-
    E16W, E23T, F22J, F40W, F52T,G53FJ, G64W, G76G, and G138T (W is White, J and FJ are smokey, G for Green, T is Blue. Be aware the smaller AT blues aren't very blue. The G138T is very blue, also it and the F loads require hazmat, the others do not) Reloads in the case can be had CHEAP from hobbylinc and most other vendors. G76G's go for $10-11.
    The 60 has the F37W and F62T.
    The 100 has the G54W, and G104T,
    The 120 has the G77R, G79W, G25W. (G25 is haz, other 2 are not)
    The 180 case has a G75J (hazmat) load thats a full G.
    The 180 case has High power loads for H128W, H165R, and H238T no haz $19
    The 240 case has High power loads for H180W, H210R, H220T, H250G, and H97J (H97 is haz, rest non haz) $22
    The 360 case has High power loads for H268R, and I200W non hazmat. $30


    The left is a hobbyline 29 40-120 case, the right an RMS 29/120



    a 29/120 case with a pair of G79W loads



    29/120's and a set of 29 40-120



    A full dual set of 29mm RMS. I've since sold the 29/60's and 100's. never flew them



    I've flown a bunch of these motors between my Optima and Quick N Dirty. My goal is to one day fly every reload in a day or two. It would be from F52T up, and likely omit the G25W (wouldn't fly the Optima very well). Would come out to about 18 motors I think, and be tons of fun to compare flights. (I'm even sitting on a G71R I could toss in the mix. Perhaps I'll just do the 6 40-120 loads)


    Now for some porn....
    G53FJ



    G76G



    G138T



    G77R



    G79W



    H250G

    H238T x 2



    I200Wx 2



    H268R
    Last edited by DavidMcCann; 26th October 2017 at 02:31 AM.
    David McCann
    Dave's Rockets | My Flights
    URRG |URRF 4| Level 2 | TRA# 14210

  16. #16
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    I have two 29/40-120 cases, and 29/120, 29/180, and 29/240. I've used them all a lot.
    NAR 91107, Level 2

    I really, really hate bugs.

  17. #17
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    Nice pics David. Said it before and will say it again, that Optima is a great looking rocket.
    I'm soon to be burning lots more 29s. I forget I have a Hurricane 38 to finish and fly. Lol. Just need my AV bay finished up.
    I asked the cases question because he said those cases don't require Haz shipping and, like we both laid out, they quite obviously do.
    Not a big fan of the blues, but I do like the reds and greens, stupid greens are always a PITA to light.
    Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool.
    TRA #16513
    Level 1: Danger Close ---AT H123W to 1240'--- 29 OCT 2016
    Level 2: Binder Design Tyrannosaur ---AT J315R to 2148'--- 30 SEP 2017

  18. #18
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    Thanks! The blues don't look impressive, but they move FAST.
    David McCann
    Dave's Rockets | My Flights
    URRG |URRF 4| Level 2 | TRA# 14210

  19. #19
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    Thanks David

    I'm familiar with AT's line but I've never been in the 29 territory; I've always been in the 38 or 54's. Without a local prefec, I'm looking at mid's for weekend fun with the fam when we don't want to hit the road out of town or when I just need a quick hit of AP.

    Thanks again

    Nathan

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by grouch View Post
    No HAZ on motors for those cases. At least in the US, not sure about Canada. This was the big driver to getting my first AT case.
    Comment was a general "per order" statement. Some people think when they first start out, they need to pay HAZMAT on each & every motor they order.. so, 6 motors, 6 hazmat fees.. Not so. One hazmat fee, any number of motors.. But if you order all non -hazmat motors not need. But if one is hazmat, you need to have it..

    See the PDF links, they detail what is hazmat & not. And there is a mix (need & not need) for any of the cases..

    And, I fly in the US. (Sorry Canada, Sorry CAR!) We (the club) do an annual 'group order' to mitigate HAZMAT. A US-side flyer holds my motors for me! (And I can ship to his address when needed..)
    -paul

    NAR# 101258 - L1
    www.CRMRC.org
    I don't know the same things you don't know..

  21. #21
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    I'm a fan of the RMS-Plus 29mm line, from 29/100 through 29/360. Baby G (G54) through Baby I (I200), most non-hazmat, cored grains. For G reloads, I use the 29/120 more than my Hobbyline 29/40-120, due to cored rather than slotted grains, redline availability, and ease of assembly. If you like the F40 hobbyline (hazmat), the G54 is a good substitute, nearly identical total impulse, and non-hazmat. I probably use the 29/180 & 29/240 the most, but all get a good workout. The 29/360 is great for the Mega Der Red Max.
    Paul
    NAR #87246 L1 - Section #558 - www.wooshrocketry.org
    "If we weren't all crazy, we would go insane" - Jimmy Buffett

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by dpower View Post
    I'm a fan of the RMS-Plus 29mm line, from 29/100 through 29/360. Baby G (G54) through Baby I (I200), most non-hazmat, cored grains. For G reloads, I use the 29/120 more than my Hobbyline 29/40-120, due to cored rather than slotted grains, redline availability, and ease of assembly. If you like the F40 hobbyline (hazmat), the G54 is a good substitute, nearly identical total impulse, and non-hazmat. I probably use the 29/180 & 29/240 the most, but all get a good workout. The 29/360 is great for the Mega Der Red Max.
    Hey thanks for the info!

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Normzilla View Post
    Thanks David

    I'm familiar with AT's line but I've never been in the 29 territory; I've always been in the 38 or 54's. Without a local prefec, I'm looking at mid's for weekend fun with the fam when we don't want to hit the road out of town or when I just need a quick hit of AP.

    Thanks again

    Nathan
    No problem... and don't forget, you can launch class 1 without a waiver.... thats up to 4.4 oz of propellant in a rocket weighing less than 3.3 pounds on the pad. that covers a bunch of H motors
    David McCann
    Dave's Rockets | My Flights
    URRG |URRF 4| Level 2 | TRA# 14210

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavidMcCann View Post
    No problem... and don't forget, you can launch class 1 without a waiver.... thats up to 4.4 oz of propellant in a rocket weighing less than 3.3 pounds on the pad. that covers a bunch of H motors

    Is there a list of motors that meet the under 4.4 oz?

  25. #25
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    I don’t know if there’s a list, but looking at thrustcurve.com it looks like all the AT 29/240 and below motors are good
    David McCann
    Dave's Rockets | My Flights
    URRG |URRF 4| Level 2 | TRA# 14210

  26. #26
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    Nice thanks!

    Nate

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavidMcCann View Post
    No problem... and don't forget, you can launch class 1 without a waiver.... thats up to 4.4 oz of propellant in a rocket weighing less than 3.3 pounds on the pad. that covers a bunch of H motors
    Provided you have a launch system that will get you 100' away from said H motors.

  28. #28
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    And you still need level 1 to buy the reloads.

    John S. ---- NAR #96911 ---- TRA #15253 ---- MDRA #067 ---- BARC #028
    L1, 3/15/14: Aerotech Sumo, CTI H133BS
    L2, 6/21/14: Giant Leap Vertical Assault, CTI J240RL
    L3, 3/12/16: MAC Performance Radial Flyer, CTI M1101WH
    Altitude: 13,028', L3 flight; Speed: Mach ???, L3 flight

  29. #29
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    Get a 29/40-120 case and fly the heck out of it, the loads are all cheap and no hazmat. When you decide to go into HPR, get either an AT 29/240 set or a CTI 3G set. Some dealers used to give you the CTI 3G cert load when you bought the hardware... don't know if that's true anymore.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by cerving View Post
    Get a 29/40-120 case and fly the heck out of it, the loads are all cheap and no hazmat. When you decide to go into HPR, get either an AT 29/240 set or a CTI 3G set. Some dealers used to give you the CTI 3G cert load when you bought the hardware... don't know if that's true anymore.
    Not correct. The F impulse motors and at least the G138 incur HAZMAT.


    John S. ---- NAR #96911 ---- TRA #15253 ---- MDRA #067 ---- BARC #028
    L1, 3/15/14: Aerotech Sumo, CTI H133BS
    L2, 6/21/14: Giant Leap Vertical Assault, CTI J240RL
    L3, 3/12/16: MAC Performance Radial Flyer, CTI M1101WH
    Altitude: 13,028', L3 flight; Speed: Mach ???, L3 flight

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