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  1. #61
    Join Date
    16th January 2017
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    50
    gave version 2 of the spider a go tonight in the dark tonight and it worked perfectly.

    link below


    Level 1, 09/07/2017 PML IO, H152

  2. #62
    Join Date
    14th February 2017
    Posts
    7
    Great Wrad!
    Ignition system looks ok. As well the Soyuz look is amazing!
    Which engine configuration have you set? I see the central 24mm. I suppose D12-0 and B6.
    Just a warning for the B6. B6-2 (Estes) ,I used at beginning, sometime don't have the expected 2 seconds delay and neither the Nar certified 1,53. I got parachute ejection just after 1,6. So in some cases 0,7 0,8 delay seconds only. This lead to some damage to the model. To be safer B6-4 is better even you need to verify the expected altitude of detachment. It depend by the weight you have.
    Next video ... the flight! :-)


  3. #63
    Join Date
    4th October 2014
    Posts
    751
    Quote Originally Posted by LithosphereRocketry View Post
    Especially cool since a 1/50 Saturn 1B is about 6ft tall & 6" in diameter...
    Oh, were you thinking that might not be big enough? How about 11" dia and 12' ...

    http://www.rocketryforum.com/showthr...B-1-23-Upscale

  4. #64
    Join Date
    16th January 2017
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    50
    So this weekend was the big day for the Soyuz. Its late now and i am completely exhausted from a brilliant weekend and some incredible flights. I will follow up with a full launch report for the Soyuz tomorrow when I am fresh and have all the videos and photos sorted out, however the short story is.....the flight was a incredible success! a beautiful flight and a successful recovery!


    A little teaser.....

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    Level 1, 09/07/2017 PML IO, H152

  5. #65
    Join Date
    14th February 2017
    Posts
    7
    Great picture! I wait. I wanna see all of them!! Congratulations Wrad :-)

  6. #66
    Join Date
    22nd February 2013
    Location
    Garland, TX
    Posts
    3,683
    Nice!
    So much of my rocket building time has been diverted toward my "other hobby": Race Timing

  7. #67
    Join Date
    10th July 2007
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    1,267
    Fantastic work on the build and successful flight!
    TRA 13430, Level 3

    "Everybody's simulation model is guilty until proven innocent" (Thomas H. Lawrence 1994)

  8. #68
    Join Date
    12th August 2016
    Posts
    39
    Wow, Impressive.

    Mike

  9. #69
    Join Date
    16th January 2017
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    50
    Launch report

    We had 2 days to get the Soyuz in the air, the weather forecast was fairly consistent for both days with a gentle breeze of a few miles an hour all day patchy cloud and the chance of rain showers passing through in the afternoon. I wasn’t in a rush to get the launch done as I wanted the best possible conditions for the launch, ideally no wind at all.

    In the morning on Saturday we had a little work to do, primarily loading in the nose weight. Parachutes, wadding and motors were all prepped, then nose weight glued in, I was expecting to need between 100 and 150 grams of lead to achieve a cg where I wanted it and a stable spin test. 100 g was loaded in and gave an unstable spin with the rocket tumbling slowly. Another 25 g was added and the rocket quickly settled into a stable nose first spin at a nice and low speed, exactly as hopped. With the nose weight added the total weight came in at 880 g just 24 g lighter than the recommended max suggested by estes for the chosen motors combined. She was heavier than planned but still an expectable weight.

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    With the morning gone to prep and some other launches I finished prepping the launch rod and ignition system aiming for a late afternoon launch, with everything ready to go at 4 pm the predicted rain showers began to roll in putting everything on hold for an hour, as the rain stopped the wind dropped to nothing, and the race was on to pad up.

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    With a couple of extra pairs of hands padding up took about half an hour, with a lot of time fiddling around with the spider ignition system to align the 5 nozzles perfectly. After about 10 minutes of going backwards and forwards trying to make sure everything was perfect I decided I couldn’t align everything any better and the call was made that we were ready to launch.
    Level 1, 09/07/2017 PML IO, H152

  10. #70
    Join Date
    16th January 2017
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    50
    The countdown was called and the button pressed, the spider igniter lit with satisfactory whoosh and puff of white smoke, and all 5 motors lit perfectly.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    The lift off was fantastic, climbing slowly, dead straight, maybe 5 degrees of vertical, and with almost no spin. After approximately 2 seconds the core booster popped followed by the whoosh of the sustainer igniting. All 4 boosters peeled away simultaneously and the sustainer soared on up. At the staging event the sustainer tilted over however to maybe 40 degrees of vertical and now flew down range away from the pad. Due to the angle, apogee passed with approximately 2 seconds remaining on the delay, as she began to angle back down towards the ground I was gripped with fear and holding my breath. Thankfully, in the nick of time, the ejection charge fired and the main chute deployed to a huge sigh of relief. With the main stage touching down gently approximately 50 m down range of the pad.

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    All 4 boosters and the core stage were recovered with basically no damage. 1 of the mock nozzles was knocked loose, and the cord to retain the core booster to 1 of the side boosters was severed by one of the motors, however the booster tumbled harmlessly back to the ground. The main parachute was slightly singed by the ejection as was one of the booster streamers however the rocket was in fine shape to fly again with no repairs.

    On the Sunday, we tried again for a second launch, however just as we padded up the weather took a turn for the worse, with the wind rising and rain incoming, I called off the attempt, opting to fly again when the weather is better.

    Overall the weekend was brilliant, I was a little disappointed to not get a second attempt to launch, however that doesn’t detract from what was rely a perfect weekend and a fitting culmination of a lot of hard work.

    To top it all of the Soyuz was voted the best down scale rocket, taking home the trophy!

    I have got to give massive thanks to my brother and PieroAcme for the help on the build, to everyone on the day who helped me out with prep and padding up, and to the midland rocketry club here in the UK for the fantastic weekend of rocketry.
    Level 1, 09/07/2017 PML IO, H152

  11. #71
    Join Date
    14th February 2017
    Posts
    7
    Beautiful report! I felt like being there to see the launch. :-)(-:
    The success of a complex project like this (and you got also the trophy!) is something of special !
    My compliments again! You did a great work.

  12. #72
    Join Date
    22nd February 2013
    Location
    Garland, TX
    Posts
    3,683
    Very cool. Congrats on the success.
    So much of my rocket building time has been diverted toward my "other hobby": Race Timing

  13. #73
    Join Date
    26th January 2010
    Location
    Northern California
    Posts
    13,154
    Awesome job on the rocket!
    NAR 91107, Level 2

    I really, really hate bugs.

  14. #74
    Join Date
    19th February 2017
    Location
    The world, probably
    Posts
    465
    Quote Originally Posted by qquake2k View Post
    Awesome job on the rocket!
    Do I see a Soyuz in your future?

    Seriously, that would be amazing...
    NAR #104043

    crmrc.org

  15. #75
    Join Date
    18th January 2009
    Location
    Virginia - Central
    Posts
    3,999
    Excellent job, well done.
    Did you mention the final motor selections for fight?...not sure I saw confirmation on that.

    "Great Wrad! Ignition system looks ok. As well the Soyuz look is amazing!
    Which engine configuration have you set? I see the central 24mm. I suppose D12-0 and B6.
    Just a warning for the B6. B6-2 (Estes) ,I used at beginning, sometime don't have the expected 2 seconds delay and neither the Nar certified 1,53. I got parachute ejection just after 1,6. So in some cases 0,7 0,8 delay seconds only. This lead to some damage to the model. To be safer B6-4 is better even you need to verify the expected altitude of detachment. It depend by the weight you have. "
    We got two categories of pilots around here. We got your prime pilots that get all the hot planes, and we got your pud-knockers who DREAM about getting the hot planes.
    Now what are you two pud-knockers gonna have?... Huh?”
    Pancho Barnes-
    The Right Stuff
    http://www.mwavs.com/0053148414/M4RS...udknockers.m4r

    Tripoli #2747

  16. #76
    Join Date
    26th January 2010
    Location
    Northern California
    Posts
    13,154
    Quote Originally Posted by LithosphereRocketry View Post
    Do I see a Soyuz in your future?

    Seriously, that would be amazing...
    I just now noticed this post. Not sure how I missed it. I appreciate the compliment, but no, a Soyuz is beyond my meager skills. I've only ever done one scale scratch build, and it was a much simpler design.
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    NAR 91107, Level 2

    I really, really hate bugs.

  17. #77
    Join Date
    27th October 2009
    Location
    Brigham City, UT
    Posts
    2,176
    Beautiful model! And cool Spider ignition system! If I ever use a spider system, this is the thread to re-visit.

  18. #78
    Join Date
    16th January 2017
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    50
    Quote Originally Posted by MaxQ View Post
    Excellent job, well done.
    Did you mention the final motor selections for fight?...not sure I saw confirmation on that.
    I flew her on 4 B6-2 motors and a central D12-0 and D12-5, I am hoping there will be a chance to launch again this weekend, and I will be using B6-4 motors this time as was suggested to increase the time between stage separation and streamer deployment.
    Level 1, 09/07/2017 PML IO, H152

  19. #79
    Join Date
    18th January 2009
    Location
    Virginia - Central
    Posts
    3,999
    Quote Originally Posted by qquake2k View Post
    I just now noticed this post. Not sure how I missed it. I appreciate the compliment, but no, a Soyuz is beyond my meager skills. I've only ever done one scale scratch build, and it was a much simpler design.
    That's a beauty...what is that motor? Nice flame.
    We got two categories of pilots around here. We got your prime pilots that get all the hot planes, and we got your pud-knockers who DREAM about getting the hot planes.
    Now what are you two pud-knockers gonna have?... Huh?”
    Pancho Barnes-
    The Right Stuff
    http://www.mwavs.com/0053148414/M4RS...udknockers.m4r

    Tripoli #2747

  20. #80
    Join Date
    26th January 2010
    Location
    Northern California
    Posts
    13,154
    Quote Originally Posted by MaxQ View Post
    That's a beauty...what is that motor? Nice flame.
    Thank you! The motor was an H128 White Lightning. This is what happens when you forget a forward o-ring.


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3QtH3rdXVJE
    NAR 91107, Level 2

    I really, really hate bugs.

  21. #81
    Join Date
    16th January 2017
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    50
    So the Soyuz flew again this weekend, with near perfect conditions. The flight was fantastic once again with the up part working perfectly. Unfortunately the same cant be said for the down part. The ejection charge failed on the main motor resulting in the core stage coming in ballistic. The impact has destroyed the core of the rocket up to the inter-stage gap. Alas the Soyuz is no more.

    However once I have assessed the damage properly she may rise again from the crumpled ashes.
    Level 1, 09/07/2017 PML IO, H152

  22. #82
    Join Date
    16th January 2017
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    50
    Level 1, 09/07/2017 PML IO, H152

  23. #83
    Join Date
    19th February 2017
    Location
    The world, probably
    Posts
    465
    Quote Originally Posted by wrad View Post
    So the Soyuz flew again this weekend, with near perfect conditions. The flight was fantastic once again with the up part working perfectly. Unfortunately the same cant be said for the down part. The ejection charge failed on the main motor resulting in the core stage coming in ballistic. The impact has destroyed the core of the rocket up to the inter-stage gap. Alas the Soyuz is no more.

    However once I have assessed the damage properly she may rise again from the crumpled ashes.
    Nooooo!

    If you're even considering a rebuild... do it, definitely. That was a beautiful rocket.

    Plus, what else are you gonna do with 4 R-7 drop-aways?
    NAR #104043

    crmrc.org

  24. #84
    Join Date
    16th January 2017
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    50
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Level 1, 09/07/2017 PML IO, H152

  25. #85
    Join Date
    23rd January 2015
    Location
    Draper, UT
    Posts
    87
    What a horrible loss, but now you have time to put all of it up on Thingiverse, right?
    Let us create vessels and sails adapted to the heavenly ether, and there will be those who will not shrink from even that vast expanse. - Kepler to Galileo in 1610

    NAR 86500
    Level 2

  26. #86
    Join Date
    16th January 2017
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    50
    I had completely forgotten about that, I had the thing all done just unpublished. Hear you go.

    https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2513960
    Level 1, 09/07/2017 PML IO, H152

  27. #87
    Join Date
    10th July 2007
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    1,267
    Sorry to see it hit the deck. Such a nice build. You will rebuild...

    Thanks for posting it on thingiverse. I will be building one
    TRA 13430, Level 3

    "Everybody's simulation model is guilty until proven innocent" (Thomas H. Lawrence 1994)

  28. #88
    Join Date
    14th February 2017
    Posts
    7
    Achhh..Hi Wrad, it is sad to see that. Unfortunately this is the rocketer life...
    But, I think will be not a problem to repair for you.
    You can cut at interstage section an just rebuild just the 2nd stage... I already did that ;-)

    Did you understood why the D12-5 failed? Is it ejection charge failure? It is quite unusual for Estes.

    In my case I was testing a system to keep the shock cord into the body tube, but the result was the cord cut..

  29. #89
    Join Date
    16th January 2017
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    50
    From the look of the motor after the launch it appears that ejection charge fizzled rather than popped as such, there was a lot of unburnt powder in the motor tube and hardly any of the usual soot on the wadding. I agree it is an odd failure for an estes motor. Maybe it was more down to my storage and handling of the motors at some point.
    Level 1, 09/07/2017 PML IO, H152

  30. #90
    Join Date
    16th January 2017
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    50
    Forgot about this video from the fist launch. Soyuz from 45 seconds in.



    have some more footage from the first launch as well which i will edit at some point soon.

    Level 1, 09/07/2017 PML IO, H152

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