MWP Demon Drag Race

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But what you did changed the shape of the fins. Rendering it modified beyond the "NASCAR template" ??? Yes?? No??

If I recall, Sather altered the shape of his fins at the N5800 drag race and was "pre-disqualified" for doing so.

Called Tim before doing such mods to pre said finnage-

Was told "build it"

Notice EVERY Drag race since has had a *Nascar Template* rule in effect..Like to think "I innovated"!:lol:

Sather tried to fly a Rocket with one fin....:lol: THAT didn't stick out did it? :lol:
 
If I recall, Sather altered the shape of his fins at the N5800 drag race and was "pre-disqualified" for doing so.

Yeah, but I declared it up front (DQ - photo 1). If you are subtle and sneak it past the judges, it is selectively enforced. (Winners, MWP 2011 & 2012 - photos 2 & 3)

DQ MWP 2011.jpg

Winner MWP 2011.JPG

Winner MWP 2012.JPG
 
Called Tim before doing such mods to pre said finnage-

Was told "build it"

Notice EVERY Drag race since has had a *Nascar Template* rule in effect..Like to think "I innovated"!:lol:

Sather tried to fly a Rocket with one fin....:lol: THAT didn't stick out did it? :lol:

Yes, this rocket was pre-NASCAR template. In fact it was this act by the Firestarter that forced this rule change.
 
But what you did changed the shape of the fins. Rendering it modified beyond the "NASCAR template" ??? Yes?? No??

If I recall, Sather altered the shape of his fins at the N5800 drag race and was "pre-disqualified" for doing so.

I can't remember, did Sather have to wear the dress for his cheating act?
 
Yeah, but I declared it up front (DQ - photo 1). If you are subtle and sneak it past the judges, it is selectively enforced. (Winners, MWP 2011 & 2012 - photos 2 & 3)

And I called it that photos 2 and 3 didn't pass the nascar template...I like consistency in rules if I'm playing:).

I have played 4 times....won 2 times. And boy was the Gusmeister not happy at MWP5 when a no-name (me) won! :wink: That rocket (arrow) was actually bone stock, just built light and minimalist. The Comp3 from a few years back, I was a bit more creative....since there were a lot of creative entrants (like Dixie)!

Will play again when the time is right. In the meantime, good luck to all you demons out there!

P.S. knock on wood, haven't ever worn the dress yet!
 
What?
No bragging?
No boasting?
No wagering? (so far)...

You guys are boring, come on whip it out.

Like to think "I innovated"

Gus's innovation at MWP was indeed stunning. :surprised: And, in the true Wildman tradition, he has agreed to "whip it out" at a rematch. Coming to you at mini MWP 2017, Sather vs Gus Part Deux... the original 3" Wildmans from 2009 in the fields near Princeton. The only rules are...

Rockets will be as they were flown at MWP 9, and made available for inspection (measurements and weight).

Altimeters will be Stratologgers.

Since the waiver is no longer sufficient for the full brunt of the L935, the motor will be AT K700-W. Motors will be assembled by a neutral and assigned by chance.

Recovery will have neutral observers to note altimeter reported altitude(s) in the field.

And when Gus whips my tush for a second time, the conspiracy theories will end, and Gus will forever have stamped his reputation as a steely-eyed missile man.
 
I can't remember, did Sather have to wear the dress for his cheating act?

Wrong, Tim. It was NOT cheating. I declared up front the fin change, and my flight was not part of the competition. (Not subject to winning OR losing.) It also was not an advantage. The fins were not just cut down, as my pattern did not fit the stock fin, (span wider at the tip). They were re-finned and slightly heavier. Sims had it 200' LOWER, which is pretty much how it flew. My goal was to survive the N5800, which it did, unlike the rockets directly on either side of mine.

cheat CHēt 1. act dishonestly or unfairly in order to gain an advantage, especially in a game or examination. "she always cheats at cards"
 
I have played 4 times....won 2 times. And boy was the Gusmeister not happy at MWP5 when a no-name (me) won! :wink: That rocket (arrow) was actually bone stock, just built light and minimalist.

But, once i found out that your from *Vis-Con-Sin* :D (like the me originally) and, that your last name ended in "Berg", we became life long friends! :eek:

Gus's innovation at MWP was indeed stunning. :surprised: And, in the true Wildman tradition, he has agreed to "whip it out" at a rematch. Coming to you at mini MWP 2017, Sather vs Gus Part Deux... the original 3" Wildmans from 2009 in the fields near Princeton. The only rules are...

Rockets will be as they were flown at MWP 9, and made available for inspection (measurements and weight).

Altimeters will be Stratologgers.

Since the waiver is no longer sufficient for the full brunt of the L935, the motor will be AT K700-W. Motors will be assembled by a neutral and assigned by chance.

Recovery will have neutral observers to note altimeter reported altitude(s) in the field.

And when Gus whips my tush for a second time, the conspiracy theories will end, and Gus will forever have stamped his reputation as a steely-eyed missile man.

I accept Sather's challenge and, will accept the results good or bad (in my case) to be "the results".

Every rocket design has a sweet spot and, when you find it (mine was the lightest of the batch) maybe things including a motor variable that can vary by 10% from Certification testing... Well.....the results can be stunning or damning.

Jason! :smile:

QUESTION #3

IF i pre-pressurize Diane's AV Bay, say to 1.2 bar (of course everything sealed off tightly)....engage a magnetically controlled on/off switch from outside of the airframe...hooked to a small Baro based Altimeter...running in tandem with a Perfectflite 1 G activated switch...hooked to a small 1/2 gram charge that blows a small vent during the flight...

Basically the Rocket lets out a little fart about 5 seconds into the flight and, thinks its now started from 1500ft below sea level to whatever we cap out at...

Would that be considered cheating?

Always thinking, always plotting, always quick with a joke or to light up another smoke.
 
But, once i found out that your from *Vis-Con-Sin* :D (like the me originally) and, that your last name ended in "Berg", we became life long friends! :eek:

Indeed...what's funny is that I remember thinking who is this Gus fella and why the hey does he have issues with me?. I honestly wasn't trying hard to win that race....just really liked the price tag on a large-ish 4" diameter rocket and liked the prospect of long-ish White Thunder motors....the K1440WT and the Arrow was a good combo. Didn't like the fin design on the Arrow, so decided to bury it at Princeton a few years later. :wink:...the reason I no longer trust (most) screw switches! Going to be good to see you again in under a month, Uncle Gus!

Hmm, I have a non-optimized 3" Wildman that could play at MMWP '17....this could be fun!

-Eric-
 
Basically the Rocket lets out a little fart about 5 seconds into the flight and, thinks its now started from 1500ft below sea level to whatever we cap out at...

How do you ground test something like that- with a sack of Taco Bell burritos and a funnel?
 
Wrong, Tim. It was NOT cheating. I declared up front the fin change, and my flight was not part of the competition. (Not subject to winning OR losing.) It also was not an advantage. The fins were not just cut down, as my pattern did not fit the stock fin, (span wider at the tip). They were re-finned and slightly heavier. Sims had it 200' LOWER, which is pretty much how it flew. My goal was to survive the N5800, which it did, unlike the rockets directly on either side of mine.

cheat CHēt 1. act dishonestly or unfairly in order to gain an advantage, especially in a game or examination. "she always cheats at cards"

Yes, sorry, cheating was too strong a word, maybe "deviation."
 
....just really liked the price tag on a large-ish 4" diameter rocket and liked the prospect of long-ish White Thunder motors....the K1440WT and the Arrow was a good combo. Didn't like the fin design on the Arrow, so decided to bury it at Princeton a few years later.

-Eric-

I personally thought the Wildman Arrow was one of the ugliest rockets I ever built...Flew it twice then it spent years propping up a wall in my shop...
I'd pull it out every once in awhile and, pee on it just for spite.
NOW that K1440 was a different story though- Who would have known the effect it would leave on someone like Claude?
I think he's burned at least a 100 since!

Ahhhhh, memories! :rolleyes:
 
My mind works in pictures and, now dry heaving on my car. Boooo

Nick? This is what we seasoned vets call "f:Dreplay", it gets us ready for the annual gathering of the Good, the Bad and, the Uglies....

I dare you to find another club with such talent, wit and, the ability to start a National Guard called in riot.

Your really going to enjoy MWP...that ground is sacred to me! :) Plus I've dumped ALOT of titanium into over the years...probably the second largest depository of such on US soil. :rolleyes:
 
Ok, so we know we can't alter the fins...Done deal.
Motors go into lock down and, are delved out the day of the launch...*Rats*
Igniters are to only be Estes in configuration...hmmmm!

No answer on the pressurizing Av Bay...Copy. :D "Rocket ripping sheets right off the deep hole it was just launched out of!" ;)

QUESTION #4

Pressurizing of Nosecones...Can *we* administer a shot of oooooowwww, about 120-125psi of Helium gas to the cone?
Nothing really new here in the world of aerospace. May help with deforming issues of the polycarbonate shnozz while under immense flight stresses. I'm sure though that it wouldn't in ANY way help pull that little rascal up by it's boot straps in the last few feet of the apogee event. ;) :no:

Added *BONUS* Who wouldn't just love to hear Terry Smemo rocking the mic at the LCO table while taking little tokes of leftover Helium from my bottle?

I bet Adrian would sound hilarious too! :lol:
 
Gus, Gus, Gus... You can't make all those changes, but it doesn't matter. We all know I'm winning, so you'd better get your good shoes ready for that dress...
 
Can *we* administer a shot of oooooowwww, about 120-125psi of Helium gas to the cone?

AFAIK, there is no restriction to any method of adjusting the Cg as long as you preserve stability. So sure, if you want to add weight to the nose cone, go for it.

When you pressurize Helium (or any gas), you increase its density and thereby defeat the intended benefit (of being lighter than air)

Assuming the temperature and volume remain constant, you increase the molecules of Helium in direct proportion to pressure. PV=nRT

At standard temperature and at sea level, dry air has a density of 1.2754 kg/m3 and a pressure of 14.7 psi, Helium = 0.178 kg/m3.

So, if you pump helium to 125 psi you increase its density by a factor of 8.5 (125 psi / 14.7 psi), making it 1.51 kg/m3, or 1.18 times HEAVIER than air.

Because the helium atom is very small, it can easily diffuse through many materials, so that the pressurized volume will deflate quickly.

The method (valve, plug, ...) you use to contain the pressurized Helium will add even more weight (and some drag) to the nose cone as well.

And just to make sure Gus will read this far... Kari Byron is a red-head.

kari-byron-3.jpg


And she wants to know... "Hey, Gus. How come you are asking all these QUESTIONS if you aren't even in the event?"
 
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And with that post. This has officially come to an end.

Nothing better could follow that!

Hats off to ya, Sather
 
Gus - How about a spring loaded weight in the payload set to release at apogee then the altimeters to delay 2 sec after apogee, maybe worth 17.3 more feet according to my err calculations. Man I could get into this Smoky Y stuff! Altimeter in the nose cone - 200' harness and ejection charge of, well we will just say it will extend that 200'
 
Well, my Demon 98 is finished. 8lbs 8oz fully prepped w/o motor... Not light enough to win highest altitude, but as long as it holds together I'll be happy.
Why do iPhone pictures always go sideways??? :mad:
They were correct when I opened them up on the computer. I give up. Everyone turn your monitors on they're sides to view the pics... :facepalm:
 
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Well, my Demon 98 is finished. 8lbs 8oz fully prepped w/o motor... Not light enough to win highest altitude, but as long as it holds together I'll be happy.
Why do iPhone pictures always go sideways??? :mad:
They were correct when I opened them up on the computer. I give up. Everyone turn your monitors on they're sides to view the pics... :facepalm:

That looks great! Wish I could join in on that drag race. I'm using the iPhone app and the pictures are correct, at least for me.
 
OK, first thought... It's not YELLOW??? That's a BRIGHT :cool: green.
Second thought, why four fins?
Third thought, does this DQ you from winning (or losing?) the drag race? NASCAR template and all that?
Looks cool though.
 
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