Red Arrow Hobbies stealing money

This thread has gone into some serious depth of the issues, which I just don't get.

When I buy a TV at Best Buy, I don't give a flip about what the manager does in his free time, how he's spending the money or how much he really loves TV's.

I wanna know if he's got the TV I want, if he's got the best price, and if it's going to be delivered on time.


Worrying about anything else is totally illogical.

Dave, the difference is, I think, that a lot of want to believe that we have a more personal relationship with the vendors then you do with the TV salesperson. Many of them (rocket vendors) come to our (collective) launches, and we get to talk to them, their wives and family, whatever. And it is nice to have a vendor remember you and what you want. In truth, though, realistically, the only relationship that actually matters here is the one between your dollars and their product. Ultimately, that's what the vendor will most likely care about. These people are friendly to deal with (and they should be), but you're not going to invite them to your wedding/funeral/graduation/holiday party, etc. For the most part, they're still vendors and we're still customers. As you say, anything else going on in the background shouldn't matter. If a vendor in question can't maintain his business based on whatever, that person shouldn't continue to operate the business. Its that simple.

I'm really surprised Red Arrow has not weighed in yet.

Lowpuller said:

I'm really surprised Red Arrow has not weighed in yet.

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He doesn't use the forums.

tbonerocketeer said:

He doesn't use the forums.

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Maybe a source of the disconnect he has with his customers, but certainly a wise decision if he wants to maintain his illusion of being a proper businessperson.

EXPjawa said:

Dave, the difference is, I think, that a lot of want to believe that we have a more personal relationship with the vendors then you do with the TV salesperson.

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Its a good sales technique from a vendor standpoint. And I'm friends with vendors....so I don't think its any kind of dishonest practice.....Its good business to have some connection felt by customers.

But when they use that connection to forgive doing a poor job, thats the time to cut bait.

soopirV said:

Maybe a source of the disconnect he has with his customers, but certainly a wise decision if he wants to maintain his illusion of being a proper businessperson.

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I don't disagree, but realize only a small percentage of fliers use this forum. Go talking around the flight line- most have a distaste for this place and use it sparingly if at all.

soopirV said:

Maybe a source of the disconnect he has with his customers, but certainly a wise decision if he wants to maintain his illusion of being a proper businessperson.

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Lots of our vendors are not on the forums. Some people are not interested in some of the stuff that goes on in here. Some don't have time for it, and some don't do a lot when it comes to computers or social media. I know, they need to adapt to changing business practices, but consider how many have not added inventory yet.

soopirV said:

Maybe a source of the disconnect he has with his customers, but certainly a wise decision if he wants to maintain his illusion of being a proper businessperson.

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Not really the new owners of this place have seen fit to ban many of the vendors who used to frequent here. Shrox & Uncle Mike are just two of the banned. I know a lot of them don't bother to post here anymore as well.

soopirV said:

Maybe a source of the disconnect he has with his customers, but certainly a wise decision if he wants to maintain his illusion of being a proper businessperson.

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It's also pay to play for vendors.

I sent him a pm on facebook couple weeks back.
Told him he should respond at least.
He's probably trolled this thread, which led to his post about his legal problems.

Lowpuller said:

I'm really surprised Red Arrow has not weighed in yet.

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Over the years I have built quite a few personal friendships
with people that buy stuff from me......

I take personal offense to that being belittled.......

When I go to a big launch that many have come from far and wide
it is just incredible to see old friends that I haven't seen in so long....
The conversation is always about family,, friends,, work,, home,, many things.....

Teddy

onebadhawk said:

Over the years I have built quite a few personal friendships
with people that buy stuff from me......

I take personal offense to that being belittled.......

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Its not being belittled by me teddy.... You're one I count as a friend.

But if I ever order a motor and don't get it for months (and its not a supply issue) You'd still be my friend...just not my vendor.


(to be clear, I have no doubt Teddy will be my vendor forever.....it's just an example)

I hear ya Dave..

this whole thread is a damn shame...

I used to order from RA .. all good... a long time ago..

Teddy

onebadhawk said:

I hear ya Dave..

this whole thread is a damn shame...

I used to order from RA .. all good... a long time ago..

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Yea. Life's a weird thing...and I wish him well....but I'm not sending my cash down the spiral with him.

DavidMcCann said:

(to be clear, I have no doubt Teddy will be my vendor forever.....it's just an example)

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Yeah Teddy's okay I guess, but he keeps on promising to buy me a glass of red but does not deliver!

mpitfield said:

Yeah Teddy's okay I guess, but he keeps on promising to buy me a glass of red but does not deliver!

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Oh man. We get into that and I'm not gonna be able to get my truck off the field lol. I need to put up a case of alchemy or eclipse in the basement for next summer.

My transaction has been finalized; my refund came through PayPal a few days ago. I'd really rather that we didn't have this issue, like Teddy said, this thread is a shame I really don't like giving negative reviews on anyone, anytime. And I still hold no personal ill will toward Dave, I do hope that he's able to get things right. But in the meantime, I also hate to see innocent rocketeers get caught up in this drama that they have no business getting caught up in. I hope things get better.

So maybe we should let this die for now. I'm sure there's enough here to convince anyone not to purchase from RA. Its a shame because there are few and far between vendors in our hobby and RA had some pretty cool kits namely Sheri's line, but would be even better as one mentioned to make the correction to the kits to make them better in the way that parts fit and the quality of the pieces

Why did Sheri's move to RAH?

Why does Sheri not post on the forum?

Lowpuller said:

Why did Sheri's move to RAH?

Why does Sheri not post on the forum?

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Sheri's was bought out by RAH, and Sheri has had issues with members of this forum in the past and no longer visits here. AFAIK

roc_boy said:

My transaction has been finalized; my refund came through PayPal a few days ago. I'd really rather that we didn't have this issue, like Teddy said, this thread is a shame I really don't like giving negative reviews on anyone, anytime. And I still hold no personal ill will toward Dave, I do hope that he's able to get things right. But in the meantime, I also hate to see innocent rocketeers get caught up in this drama that they have no business getting caught up in. I hope things get better.

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Glad to hear you got a refund, hopefully I'm next!

If you're into RC Aircraft and ever purchased from ChiefAircraft, it looks a lot like RAH. They don't show out of stock and gladly take your money, so now you wait, never knowing how long it might take!
A friend got taken in years ago like that so he called them up asking about a product, was told yes it's in Stock so he placed the Web order, they took his money and he had to call them again to be asked if he wanted partial shipment of his order.... he stopped using them.

rharshberger said:

Sheri's was bought out by RAH, and Sheri has had issues with members of this forum in the past and no longer visits here. AFAIK

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Is the check in the mail?


couldn't resist

JP Morgan said:

Glad to hear you got a refund, hopefully I'm next!

If you're into RC Aircraft and ever purchased from ChiefAircraft, it looks a lot like RAH. They don't show out of stock and gladly take your money, so now you wait, never knowing how long it might take!
A friend got taken in years ago like that so he called them up asking about a product, was told yes it's in Stock so he placed the Web order, they took his money and he had to call them again to be asked if he wanted partial shipment of his order.... he stopped using them.

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Thanks for the heads-up on Chief. I am into RC helis & multitirotors - I have heard of Chief but never ordered from them, I'll be sure to avoid them now, thanks
After you elevate your PayPal dispute to a "claim", they allow 14 days for the vendor to respond. We never received a response, and PayPal fully refunded my funds a day or two after that 14 day period was up.

DavidMcCann said:

I don't disagree, but realize only a small percentage of fliers use this forum. Go talking around the flight line- most have a distaste for this place and use it sparingly if at all.

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I know that I waste too much damn time on this forum, but it does contain cutting edge information. A vendor would be wise to check in or at least lurk. Tim at Apogee posted a few times over the years, but I suspect that one of his employees lurks among the forums to keep on top of things.

The main benefit of this forum to me is precisely the intel gathered on new products, product availability, and vendor status. Most rocketry vendors are not Amazon Prime where you click it and forget it. The rocketry vendors are individuals with small-time businesses, inventory issues, less than perfect websites, and other life problems. I always check this forum for any updates before placing an order.

mpitfield said:

Yeah Teddy's okay I guess, but he keeps on promising to buy me a glass of red but does not deliver!

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I'm afraid to have any red wine with you and Dave,, Michael..
If I drink 2 glasses of that I'll pass out...
With you guy's around I'm afraid I'll wake up
with a twenty dollar bill in one hand, a single red rose in the other,
and this really cheap feeling......lol..

Teddy

roc_boy said:

Thanks for the heads-up on Chief. I am into RC helis & multitirotors - I have heard of Chief but never ordered from them, I'll be sure to avoid them now, thanks
After you elevate your PayPal dispute to a "claim", they allow 14 days for the vendor to respond. We never received a response, and PayPal fully refunded my funds a day or two after that 14 day period was up.

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Thanks for that info, I'll have to check and see what kind of status I'm at, not sure...

About Chief, they will obtain the product ASAP if it's out of stock, problem is you never know because of non-updated stock .
I've always gotten my orders from them and just got tired of not knowing for certain if all would be shipped same time...

onebadhawk said:

I'm afraid to have any red wine with you and Dave,, Michael..
If I drink 2 glasses of that I'll pass out...
With you guy's around I'm afraid I'll wake up
with a twenty dollar bill in one hand, a single red rose in the other,
and this really cheap feeling......lol..

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It'll be an onion in one hand and a really huge carrot in the other

DavidMcCann said:

It'll be an onion in one hand and a really huge carrot in the other

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hahahahaha,,
Comon man,,,
Not an onion...

Teddy

onebadhawk said:

hahahahaha,,
Comon man,,,
Not an onion...

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Ok...it won't be just one