My first Level 1 Rocket build

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kcobbva

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Ok, so I've been consuming all yall's information for months and talking here and there; however I realized I haven't captured my own build for my first Level 1 certification attempt. I've probably said somewhere before that I had an 11 year hiatus away from rocketry, and after my daughter built her Big Daddy, it all came back like a ton of bricks. I'd wanted to do Electronics way back when and never did. I'd done lots as a kid and then quite a bit when my oldest was back in grade school with many rockets leading up to the Apogee Saturn-V and a scratch build that launched a 12" GI Joe out on his own parachute. That was fun, but before I knew about NAR, etc; and while I used an H engine, not so sure it met the weight restrictions. Perfect flight though. Anyway, SO...11 years later (and a few months after I've already started) here's my build thread of my first Level 1 attempt: The Madcow Torrent bought at Apogee Rockets. I'd done tons of business with him way back and after watching numerous youtube videos back in august, immediately bought from him when I finally talked my wife into letting me attempt my bucket list! Level 1 and level 2. I immediately purchased a Torrent and a Level-2 rocket from Tim.

So here we go. Level 1: Madcow Torrent.

First, I love the kit. The upper payload area of the rocket was damaged upon arrival, but they squared that away. Instead of a 12" tube, they sent me a 19". Didn't want to cut that because it was "BIGGER". :) I ran the sims through rocksim; it seemed stable, so I reached out to Tim and he assured me it would be stable with the new tube.

So starting off, I began with the motor mount tube. As I began I was only familiar with Bob Smith Epoxy and Fix It epoxy. I'd not even found TRF yet. Here's the motor mount and a little grace on my abilities.
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Test fitting with the 12" nosecone and the 19" in the background.
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This was hoping I made a good fillet for the centering ring to hold in the 38mm motor tube. Also got the fins attached. I tried making a template, but didn't know about payloadbay.com at the time. So I used the old traditional arrow making method of sighting down the shaft.
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Next came making fillets for the fins. Ok, so it's been 11 years since I made fillets with Fix-it Epoxy. Sadly these showed. Since then you all have introduced me to RocketPoxy and taught me how to do it. My Tomach looks soo much nicer. Alas, these will hold for the Level 1.
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I'll continue later....
 
Looking great so far! Keep it up and I'm looking forward to your progress!
 
Ok so continuing. I next began the ebay section. I know it's not "required" for L1; but it was my desire 11 years ago to do, and it is my personal requirement to do. So either pass or fail, I do require myself to meet those desires from the past. It's my bucket list.

Starting off with the basic Madcow ebay sled.
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Making a switch spring to create positive click when the pin is inserted. I KNOW I learned this from TRF somewhere!!! Absolutely did not come up with that concept on my own!
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Adding some electronics to it. So the initial switch worked, but I had alignment problems and issues with the spring. I ended up putting together a second switch w/o the pin and this time it was dead on and holds perfectly.
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Now putting it all together.
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Next I completed building out the bulkheads and black powder wells.
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Finally the av-bay completed.
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Lastly, I wanted to test the altimeter. I'd originally bought one and tested it, but after so many reviews, and reading info on Apogee Components, I ended up purchasing a Perfect Flight CF. It wouldn't sim right in the test vacuum I'd purchased, so I looked about and pulled some canning jars from gardening, and made my own vacuum system. (Not my own idea. I emailed the folks who make Perfect Flight and they helped me out!) This time it worked, and recording apogee and deployment at the altitudes I was expecting.
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Gotta love those beeps!!! more to come.
 
So there's really not much else to build. Used some fix-it epoxy where it is really good and secured the rail button screw to ensure the harness wouldn't get caught up on it. Speaking of the buttons (and a few other things) a big shout out to RocketFamily KML on Youtube in his series on a Torrent Build [video=youtube;OfRAtS4UUdM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OfRAtS4UUdM[/video]. I posed a few questions and he was always helpful and better than Amazon in delivery responding almost immediately! Anyway, the internal tube....
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After that, sanded and then it sat. So I started my Tomach build after black friday
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The torrent sat dormant for a while because I had ordered a camera shroud for the 808 #18 and it didn't work out. So i ordered the other, and that didn't work out. So I bought a #16 and ordered a shroud specified for #16 and that DID work out. The #18 will now be taped to estes fun rockets. Anyway...finally TODAY the temp was near 60, and the wind was finally low. I got to Prime! Amazing how little things like that can make you so very happy!

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So, now the inevitabe sanding joy.....and more prime coming. Moreover, I'd like to say a special thanks to everyone that's helped me along the way so far answering questions and sharing knowledge. KenECoyote and rharshberger have been a tremendous help as have many others. Thanks everyone. I'm now eagerly watching threads on painting. I'm thinking of a pearl black nosecone faded into a pearl red body tube. Maybe pearl black fins. No decals came with the kit, so I'm flying colors only at this point......after of course, it gets painted. never faded spraycans before, so wish me luck when that time comes.
 

Torrent looks good. The only thing I’d add is to drill a hole at the top and bottom ends of the battery and install another wire tie around the battery the long way.

The small wood “shelf” and one wire tie will keep the 9V secure in three directions. But the G’s from your deployment charges or a launch could slide the battery out. it'll most likely disconnect itself and then things get ugly. Give the 9V a little push and you’ll see it doesn’t take much effort to slide it out from under the tie.
 
Torrent looks good. The only thing I’d add is to drill a hole at the top and bottom ends of the battery and install another wire tie around the battery the long way.

The small wood “shelf” and one wire tie will keep the 9V secure in three directions. But the G’s from your deployment charges or a launch could slide the battery out. it'll most likely disconnect itself and then things get ugly. Give the 9V a little push and you’ll see it doesn’t take much effort to slide it out from under the tie.

Excellent!! I will do just that. Makes complete sense!
 
Just in case it isn't obvious ... make sure the tie goes around the cap as well to keep it from disconnecting, not just around the battery itself. :wink:
 
Great looking rocket. I had just decided to do single deploy for my L1 (hopefully in February or March), but now you are tempting me to shoot for DD.

Are you planning to use redundant altimeters and charges for your DD, and what are you planning for shear pins vs. friction fit?
 
That is a pretty good build you got going on there. ;)
And the Tomach will be way too much fun.

I'm sure you already took care of this, but the only vent hole I can see, with my old eyes, in your av bay is where the "Remove Before Flight" pin is inserted. One hole can be sized adequately, but 3 is better. Couple of small holes 120 degrees away from the pin hole can ensure a little "alpha" doesn't turn into a deployment on the way up.
 
Thanks for your thanks, I enjoy sharing with others my techniques or passing others techniques on, its what the forums are really about.
 
A few more things to add, since the other posters reminded me:

Expanding on BDB’s: Each rocketeer has his own way of doing this and you may already have a plan, but I use friction fit on the coupler and shear pins on the nose cone. The Torrent nose cone isn’t too heavy. I have a Madcow 4” AGM 33 Pike which is pretty similar. I use (2) 2-56 nylon shear pins 180 degrees apart. I use the seams on the nose cone as witness marks. If you soak the holes in the cardboard tube with CA so they harden, and add some thin brass strip to the nose cone where the shear pin inserts, the brass will cut the shear pins clean. It’s better that seeing which plastic decides to give first.

Some use friction fit on both, but the nylon shear pins provide a consistent resistance to separation. Otherwise you have to futz with the fit, either adding tape or sanding because the cardboard tube expands and shrinks with temp and humidity.

I’ll second what igotnothing explained about the vent holes in the switchband. That allows the altimeter to read correctly. You also want small vent holes in each section so the decrease in external pressure as the rocket ascends doesn’t force the rocket to separate. I put one 1/8” hole in each section (the payload and booster sections) for this. You probably won’t go high enough or fast enough on an L1 motor in the Torrent for a pressure separation, but the hole’s don’t hurt and it sucks when your rocket separates early.

And finally, make sure you ground test your BP charges. Also, ground test. Did I mention ground testing? You're gonna want to ground test. On my Pike I use 1 gram of FFFFG for the drogue and 1.3 for the main. Maybe you can use those as starting points.

And don’t forget to ground test.

Good luck on your cert. But you won’t need luck if you ground test.
 
I'm always glad to see someone else use DD on their L1 cert. It really isn't as hard as it sounds. Especially if you don't get into all the shear pin/friction fit, LiPo battery, redundant charge debate. Just my opinion, but if you have a light nose cone, friction fit so it's tight (you can lift the rocket and give a lite shake without the nose cone coming off) and don't over do the drogue ejection charge (ground test, ground test, ground test) and you will be fine. All the ground testing will also make you more comfortable with the DD part of the flight. It will all go well!

Good Luck!
 
Great looking rocket. I had just decided to do single deploy for my L1 (hopefully in February or March), but now you are tempting me to shoot for DD.

Are you planning to use redundant altimeters and charges for your DD, and what are you planning for shear pins vs. friction fit?

BDB,
I thought about going redundant, however after reading a lot of posts and a few discussions with board members, it made since to table that for another rocket on down the line. I tested my alt and validated it's working. I'll test the ematches and bp load in the yard to ensure ejection happens properly; then I'll size the motor ejection to probably the longest delay so it will act as a backup for the drogue deployment. I'm also using shear pins vs. friction fit. I like friction fit, but I've seen swelling on rockets 10 years ago and it was really easy taping holes for the shear pins and sealing with CA glue. Best of luck to you. It's an awesome ride!! Mine is probably April. I'm traveling to Seattle in Feb, so I miss that club meeting, the get to meet in march, and hopefully get everything squared away so I can do L1 in April.
 
That is a pretty good build you got going on there. ;)
And the Tomach will be way too much fun.

I'm sure you already took care of this, but the only vent hole I can see, with my old eyes, in your av bay is where the "Remove Before Flight" pin is inserted. One hole can be sized adequately, but 3 is better. Couple of small holes 120 degrees away from the pin hole can ensure a little "alpha" doesn't turn into a deployment on the way up.

Thanks. That's the 360 lens issue :) I did put 1/8" vent holes in line with each fin on the ebay band. The pin hole is just a little bigger than the 1/8". Again, more advice I'd learned from this forum....and had I not previously I just would have! Appreciated!
 
A few more things to add, since the other posters reminded me:

Expanding on BDB’s: Each rocketeer has his own way of doing this and you may already have a plan, but I use friction fit on the coupler and shear pins on the nose cone. The Torrent nose cone isn’t too heavy. I have a Madcow 4” AGM 33 Pike which is pretty similar. I use (2) 2-56 nylon shear pins 180 degrees apart. I use the seams on the nose cone as witness marks. If you soak the holes in the cardboard tube with CA so they harden, and add some thin brass strip to the nose cone where the shear pin inserts, the brass will cut the shear pins clean. It’s better that seeing which plastic decides to give first.

Some use friction fit on both, but the nylon shear pins provide a consistent resistance to separation. Otherwise you have to futz with the fit, either adding tape or sanding because the cardboard tube expands and shrinks with temp and humidity.

I’ll second what igotnothing explained about the vent holes in the switchband. That allows the altimeter to read correctly. You also want small vent holes in each section so the decrease in external pressure as the rocket ascends doesn’t force the rocket to separate. I put one 1/8” hole in each section (the payload and booster sections) for this. You probably won’t go high enough or fast enough on an L1 motor in the Torrent for a pressure separation, but the hole’s don’t hurt and it sucks when your rocket separates early.

And finally, make sure you ground test your BP charges. Also, ground test. Did I mention ground testing? You're gonna want to ground test. On my Pike I use 1 gram of FFFFG for the drogue and 1.3 for the main. Maybe you can use those as starting points.

And don’t forget to ground test.

Good luck on your cert. But you won’t need luck if you ground test.

All Excellent advice! I definitely plan to ground test, I'm just having difficulty finding BP. When I taught for the VA Game Dept; it was easy, but that was a long time ago now. The guys in the club said they'd give me some (very nice folks) but that's not till march since I can't make the feb meeting.

As for the shear pins, this should sum that up and done JUST like you recommended.
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I was going to make a small gold alignment mark on the nosecone/payload bay after finishing. For the lower/ebay/payload tubes, I created a small balsa alignment guide I saw on the youtube build I'd mentioned previously. Thought that was a good idea. (That's the larger pin hole by the alignment guide)
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I'm always glad to see someone else use DD on their L1 cert. It really isn't as hard as it sounds. Especially if you don't get into all the shear pin/friction fit, LiPo battery, redundant charge debate. Just my opinion, but if you have a light nose cone, friction fit so it's tight (you can lift the rocket and give a lite shake without the nose cone coming off) and don't over do the drogue ejection charge (ground test, ground test, ground test) and you will be fine. All the ground testing will also make you more comfortable with the DD part of the flight. It will all go well!

Good Luck!

Thanks! More excellent advice!
 
For all I've not acknowledged, Thanks for the comments and advice! Much appreciated!

So today all I could do was sand down the primer so I can prime it again. Raining and took the wife out to Capital Steps show. Just a dry sand at this point. From the coverage, I can see I'm going to do this at least two more times, then wetsand the last before moving on to paint. Had to swing by Pep boys and pick up three more cans of Primer, and after thinking about it, another black and two more red; knowing the size of the rocket and what I'm painting. I think it's time for Photoshop and a pho painting job.
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edit - add. Also wasn't happy with my fillets on this. The lines were just too strong, so I finally sat down tonight with some Elmers and filled out those a bit. Will sand it down tomorrow and hopefully be done with that.
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So I found there were low spots on the nosecone where the seams were so I filled those in with bondo and then reprimed and sanded the rocket again.
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Another sanding at 400 Grit. Will prime and begin wet sanding soon.
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Wow can't believe o missed most of this thread! I built a MC Torrent for my junior Lv 1 cert about a year ago. That is a nice rocket! One question and suggestion just from my experience of launching it? Did you build the Motor mount stock? If so you'll probably want to get a larger parachute. In my past experience I've seen the kit to be a little flexible at the fins. If it hits the ground too hard it's very likely to buckle the airframe right above the fins. A larger parachute could help OR you could maybe fill the fin can with some expanding foam to stiffen everything up. Just a thought that I thought I'd mention.

Hope your flight is great and I can't wait to see the video! ;)
 
If you have spent ample time and money building a rocket you definitely want a 2nd altimeter at some point.
Maybe I missed it but another Stratologger CF is cheap compared what you will lose in an bad event.
Dave A
 
Wow can't believe o missed most of this thread! I built a MC Torrent for my junior Lv 1 cert about a year ago. That is a nice rocket! One question and suggestion just from my experience of launching it? Did you build the Motor mount stock? If so you'll probably want to get a larger parachute. In my past experience I've seen the kit to be a little flexible at the fins. If it hits the ground too hard it's very likely to buckle the airframe right above the fins. A larger parachute could help OR you could maybe fill the fin can with some expanding foam to stiffen everything up. Just a thought that I thought I'd mention.

Hope your flight is great and I can't wait to see the video! ;)

Yeah, I've simmed this one in RS numerous times watching the landing speed. Knowing it's my L1 and I NEED it to fly again, I did change the chute. Bought a 44" Loc Angel from Apogee to replace the stock main. What size did you end up with? I do wish I'd known about/used RocketPoxy on the fin fillets though; but used Fix-it Epoxy because I was familiar with it from builds many years ago. I hear it's pretty brittle, so hopefully the 44" will bring it back down ready to go again....e.g. passing!
 
If you have spent ample time and money building a rocket you definitely want a 2nd altimeter at some point.
Maybe I missed it but another Stratologger CF is cheap compared what you will lose in an bad event.
Dave A

A Quark would also be a great candidate for a backup altimeter...cheap and if you wanted to try the Eggtimer stuff, it should be a great starting point. My :2:
 
If you have spent ample time and money building a rocket you definitely want a 2nd altimeter at some point.
Maybe I missed it but another Stratologger CF is cheap compared what you will lose in an bad event.
Dave A

Thanks Dave. I do have a second Stratologer CF on the way. I just wasn't sure about trying to fit two 9v batteries, etc all over on the first one. I would assume from previous reading that one is set at apogee and for for a second or two after apogee; then one at say 700ft and one at 600ft; all tied into the same BP or possibly two BP reservoirs. However I've not gotten there yet. Maybe I'll do that with my Level 2 attempt (the Madcow Level-2). Just because I've not done it yet and will not just be "repeating" myself from the level 1.

I see you are in Alexandria as I am. Do you fly with NOVAAR?
 
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