Radio tracking - Basic help needed

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I guess now that I ALSO...have to worry about angry HAM guys Fox Hunting ME and my rocket/transmitter combination all to find out if I have a HAM - Tech license (hope they don't take my rocket as hostage as well...until I show them my papers!)...I think at this point I am going to just save up and get a Garmin GPS. What a pain in the.......

Andrew, no you don't have to worry or give up.

The LL Electronics system is license free because its below the power limits set by the FCC.

You can use HAM trackers as long as there is a ham onsite that will agree to be your control operator, not a problem at all at places like MARS in Geneseo.
 
Chris and John-

I DO appreciate all your replies. You all have devoted your time and knowledge in your replies....THANK YOU.

If it seems like I am hung up on this whole licensing thing....I am. For what it is and used for....it just seems like over kill. People who purchase these trackers don't want to get into HAM, and simply want to get their rocket back. I don't really see people taking it to the scenarios you mentioned. I just don't see (with my still limited knowledge) how a guy can magically transform a tracker meant to find pets and rockets into something that will cause major harm. I will follow the rules...but government over site and regulation on something like this is, in my humble opinion....DUMB. I am NOT going to be bouncing signals off the moon or satellites. I am not going to be talking to my pal in Europe or in the arctic. I want to simply follow some beeps into a corn field and get my rocket.....that's all. I think registering with a government agency and getting a license for this purpose is over kill in light of the big picture.

I don't really mean to be argumentative.....I don't want to waste all of your time. But I have limited funds and time (like most of us) and I am simply don't have an interest in HAM......SO...I mentioned GPS (was thinking of sharing the cost and operation with two friends)....again....people have a problem with THAT....GEEEEZ MAN!

Sonic Beeper for $37.00.....I will pull the wax out of my ears and go get my rocket....done.
 
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Sonic Beeper for $37.00.....I will pull the wax out of my ears and go get my rocket....done.

How good are your ears? If you see roughly where your rocket lands then the beeper is a great way to go. If you have no clue then it won't do anything but run out it's batteries in the middle of Farmer Joe's field while you are looking in Farmer Bob's.

The HAM thing is not a hang up at all, or at least it shouldn't be. There are a lot of things to get interested in once you are a HAM. Personally I have not been "on air" in years but I am still glad I have my ticket. Maybe one day I'll get back into it but for now I am happy with the rocket only bit. BTW, it took all of a weekend to study for the test.
 
I have used this method before and actually my ears are pretty good. I also don't usually launch over 4500 feet (I like to actually see my whole flight profile). I also have no problem walking a few rows (where I launch the corn does NOT go for miles) and home in on a loud siren. The one from Apogee is very very loud and when put in its own protective case....with holes (and protected with a fire blanket...which of course comes off after ejection) can be heard for some distance.
 
I have used this method before and actually my ears are pretty good. I also don't usually launch over 4500 feet (I like to actually see my whole flight profile). I also have no problem walking a few rows (where I launch the corn does NOT go for miles) and home in on a loud siren. The one from Apogee is very very loud and when put in its own protective case....with holes (and protected with a fire blanket...which of course comes off after ejection) can be heard for some distance.

It our clubs experience that Sonic devices do not work at all in the corn unless you are within 10 feet of the rocket which is better than nothing.

As you know, Andrew, when you fly with MARS you can borrow the club's trackers, or mine if I am there any time.

--john
 
John-

Thank you, I was very thankful that MARS Club loans out trackers. Indeed I will take the club up on its very generous offer when I visit. Last weekend I was indeed VERY thankful when your club loaned out a tracker to me. But I feel this is beside the point I was trying to make. like I said, I will play by the rules....I just have an opinion on it. Besides when people quit asking, questioning and looking at the big picture.....that is also a scary scenario. I just think licensing these little transmitting beepers is over kill. Now if I was fooling around with equipment that was transmitting all over the globe....or even across town, that is another thing....as I understand it. As you know, I have been trying to understand all this "basic" language given on this thread about this subject.

I have also used sonic beacons at LDRS events at potter. The one was LDRS 28 when they had crops. I personally had a good experience with them. I see what you mean, but they do work WAY more than from 10 feet away....

Another question....could I own a tracking system and then ask someone to be my "controller" as one guy put it....when I go to other launches? Assuming of course there is a HAM guy there? (other than MARS club I mean).
 
Another question....could I own a tracking system and then ask someone to be my "controller" as one guy put it....when I go to other launches? Assuming of course there is a HAM guy there? (other than MARS club I mean).

Absolutely, you do not need to be licensed to own one.
 
"Absolutely, you do not need to be licensed to own one. "..........

:facepalm:
 
Thanks John.....But may I ask you to read the question one more time..........
 
Ah. The DJ296 doesn't have extended receive?

I stand corrected by you Chris. I had on old ComSpec/Walston/Rocket Hunter on the "oddball" wildlife frequencies and it indeed had weird spacing I couldn't exactly tune with 5khz spacing on the DJ296. Well.......... Since I got a General
ticket, one of my compatriots lost his "old" transmitter and I gave my "old" transmitter to him as he said he couldn't get a new tracker he could use with his particular "old" receiver. In the meantime, I was licensed and had bought a ComSpec on the 1.25cm ham band 222.130Mhz. I had them program it id'ing with my callsign. To get a nice "beep....beep....beep" sound I have to set the TH-F6A to SSB-USB or CW receive. Dooh, stupidhead here forgets the signal strength meter gets funky in this mode!!! Well shoot, I should have recognized that as I watch the meter when I'm on air communicating with an 857 or 817!!!! Anyhow the other night I get everything out and put a rig in FM mode (F6A or DJ296) and I hear a click....click....click of the carrier and I see a nice meter deflection. Now the only thing left would be to do a real range test and see if this is workable in a real tracking situation. Thanks for pointing that out. Kurt
 
Another question....could I own a tracking system and then ask someone to be my "controller" as one guy put it....when I go to other launches? Assuming of course there is a HAM guy there? (other than MARS club I mean).

Yes you may own your own tracking system without being licensed.

Yes you can ask another ham to be in control of the transmitter at a launch.

Now another subject is what 'control' means. But do not go there because it is not a problem at all. For example if I am the 'control operator' and I am able to give you instructions to follow and you follow, I am in control of the transmitter. Easy peasy.
 
"I stand corrected by you Chris. I had on old ComSpec/Walston/Rocket Hunter on the "oddball" wildlife frequencies and it indeed had weird spacing I couldn't exactly tune with 5khz spacing on the DJ296. Well.......... Since I got a General
ticket, one of my compatriots lost his "old" transmitter and I gave my "old" transmitter to him as he said he couldn't get a new tracker he could use with his particular "old" receiver. In the meantime, I was licensed and had bought a ComSpec on the 1.25cm ham band 222.130Mhz. I had them program it id'ing with my callsign. To get a nice "beep....beep....beep" sound I have to set the TH-F6A to SSB-USB or CW receive. Dooh, stupidhead here forgets the signal strength meter gets funky in this mode!!! Well shoot, I should have recognized that as I watch the meter when I'm on air communicating with an 857 or 817!!!! Anyhow the other night I get everything out and put a rig in FM mode (F6A or DJ296) and I hear a click....click....click of the carrier and I see a nice meter deflection. Now the only thing left would be to do a real range test and see if this is workable in a real tracking situation. Thanks for pointing that out. Kurt "

WOW.....Gee...Man I was just wondering about that!! In light of the original post....It all makes sense now! Thanks Kurt!!
 
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Chris-

I know I was just kidding around....I flew last weekend and the club was kind enough to have trackers to lend.

I did call a number of manufactures of trackers and transmitters. Now guys, before I tell you what one guy said....I want you to know....I don't want to open a can of worms here...(and I am NOT going this rout)... but some folks (and I will NEVER tell) said the FCC does not care about a tiny a transmitter from a tracker. This individual went on to say nobody is going to disrupt an AM station fetching a rocket. He told me no worries...just get your tracker and go have fun.....

I am only telling you what he told me. I am NOT advocating going Ham-less I am just saying.....so nobody get all worked up on me :)......

Andrew, Quite frankly nobody is going to bat an eye as to what Rf tracker anyone is flying. Many an unlicensed flier was using Walston/Rocket Hunter/ComSpec stuff around 216-219Mhz for ages.
If you fly a 250mW transmitter on the commercial FM band 88-108Mhz and screw up someones NPR station and do it long enough, you'll jerk the 'ire of the Federal Cookie Commission and someone
will come "gunning" for you. The stickler here is you'd have to be stupid enough to do it (transmit out of band) "a lot" to get caught.

If you can get by with a very "loud" sonic beacon by all means use it. Especially if you intend all your flights to be visually "trackable". Once you cross the line to completely out of sight for the entire rocket flight, your sonic beacon isn't going to be loud enough if you have no idea where to even look. Kurt
 
"I stand corrected by you Chris. I had on old ComSpec/Walston/Rocket Hunter on the "oddball" wildlife frequencies and it indeed had weird spacing I couldn't exactly tune with 5khz spacing on the DJ296. Well.......... Since I got a General
ticket, one of my compatriots lost his "old" transmitter and I gave my "old" transmitter to him as he said he couldn't get a new tracker he could use with his particular "old" receiver. In the meantime, I was licensed and had bought a ComSpec on the 1.25cm ham band 222.130Mhz. I had them program it id'ing with my callsign. To get a nice "beep....beep....beep" sound I have to set the TH-F6A to SSB-USB or CW receive. Dooh, stupidhead here forgets the signal strength meter gets funky in this mode!!! Well shoot, I should have recognized that as I watch the meter when I'm on air communicating with an 857 or 817!!!! Anyhow the other night I get everything out and put a rig in FM mode (F6A or DJ296) and I hear a click....click....click of the carrier and I see a nice meter deflection. Now the only thing left would be to do a real range test and see if this is workable in a real tracking situation. Thanks for pointing that out. Kurt "

WOW.....Gee...Man I was just wondering about that!! In light of the original post....It all makes sense now! Thanks Kurt!!

Ahhhhhhh, Ya gotta read the whole thread. My impetus to get licensed was 10 years ago the cost of the unlicensed Wildlife/Rocket trackers was pretty close to GPS/APRS tracking via Amateur Radio. I explored the prospect of using
the "unlicensed" 216-219Mhz trackers with a different receiver arrangement because the "system" specific receivers were pretty costly. It was an attempt to drive the cost of tracking down on my part. I played with it and essentially
abandoned it as I pursued an Amateur license to APRS/GPS track and go with 70cm trackers. I still have one ComSpec tracker as mentioned above. Optimally, their receiver is what one would expect for nominal performance. I was seeing if it was possible to do otherwise. Now 10 years ago, it also cost about $1200 to get a deployment controller and GPS tracker on an unlicensed band. That was another reason I went for a license.

I have put several rockets, 8 to be exact, out of sight and could tell by the GPS tracker they had a nominal flight. Didn't see a thing until I walked up to the rocket at a point on the map where the GPS said it was. If I hadn't used some form of radio tracking, all that hardware would likely have been lost.

Like I mentioned, you put a tracking system in a rocket, go to a launch and no one is going to give you grief about anything. That would be akin to asking fliers if they have an LEUP for their ematches!:tongue:

Best of luck, Kurt
 
Andrew, Quite frankly nobody is going to bat an eye as to what Rf tracker anyone is flying. Many an unlicensed flier was using Walston/Rocket Hunter/ComSpec stuff around 216-219Mhz for ages.
If you fly a 250mW transmitter on the commercial FM band 88-108Mhz and screw up someones NPR station and do it long enough, you'll jerk the 'ire of the Federal Cookie Commission and someone
will come "gunning" for you. The stickler here is you'd have to be stupid enough to do it (transmit out of band) "a lot" to get caught.

If you can get by with a very "loud" sonic beacon by all means use it. Especially if you intend all your flights to be visually "trackable". Once you cross the line to completely out of sight for the entire rocket flight, your sonic beacon isn't going to be loud enough if you have no idea where to even look. Kurt

Keep in mind that it's possible for a defective transmitter to transmit out of band, so the scenario you present isn't necessarily the result of deliberate action on the flier's part. Luckily, the FCC's initial response to most RFI complaints assumes that the culprit is unaware of the problems they're causing.
 
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