Metal Lathes

caveduck said:

Arrgh this thread is making me think about looking for more and bigger machine tools. Drooling on my computer over a SB Heavy 10.

Oh yeah, then there's the mill I need...

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Yep, after spending some time on a lathe you'll soon start to go into I-must-find-a-mill mode. Don't ask me how I know . It just snowballs from there....

What you going to do with a broken lathe? I may be interested...
-Ken

pyrobob said:

Yep, after spending some time on a lathe you'll soon start to go into I-must-find-a-mill mode. Don't ask me how I know . It just snowballs from there....

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I know that feeling; I have a lathe, and now I must find a mill.

But I must find the space for the mill; the lathe takes up all the extra space I had.

Aksrockets said:

https://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=218&ad=34399482&cat=&lpid=1&search=Lathe&ad_cid=7

Doesn't look too bad. It's old but it looks like it's been taken good care of. However, its pretty bulky with the motor sticking so far out, so It won't fit in my workshop well.
With a $1200 price range, this one's also on my radar. Its quite a big step up from the smaller mini lathes.
https://www.grizzly.com/products/10-x-22-Bench-Top-Metal-Lathe/G0602


Most of what I'm doing is smaller parts. Closures, nozzles, bulkheads, maybe some transitions or small NC molds. I don't think I'll do much casing work that requires a super long lathe.

Alex

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The South Bend looks pretty good but it is miss advertised. It looks like a 10"x24" at best. The second number is supposed to be the distance between centers, not the length of the rails. It looks like it has been remanufactured however how much tooling is included. Is there a follow rest and a 4-jaw chuck? Centers and chucks. Any other tooling. It's obvious that a lot of work has been done. If the way are not worn, and you want it. I would want to see it turn some round stock and check the od as a function of length. If the tail stock is adjusted correctly the diameter should be within 0.001" down the length of the round. If the tailstock is not adjusted there should be a linear taper. If the ways are worn, the diameter will likely bulge out near the chuck indicating worn ways. I might offer $1K if it is in good shape and see if the offer is accepted, but it's probably worth the asking price if the ways aren't worn and the tail stock can be centered considering all the work that has been done to it.

It's likely stiffer than the Grizzly, but if the Grizzly has more tooling then it should be considered as well.

My personal favorite is a post WW2 13"x36" Clausing Colchuster but it's hard to find a good one today since they didn't have hardened way. They are the simplest lathes to operated I've ever used, and if the ways are not worn, it's easy to hold half a thou. To maintain it, you just have to oil the ways several times a day. I you don't it will wear out in a year of daily use. They are heavy and most are 3-phase but when I retire I want one in the basement.

Bob

pyrobob said:

That's awesome. How did you secure the wood block to the 3 jaw chuck? Were you just using a live center on the tail stock?

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I made a 2.6" x 15" NC by turning the head off a 1/2 x 6 inch lag bolt and epoxying the lag bolt into the balsa block, then chucking it up in the 3 jaw on my 7x12 (tailstock off). Worked great. I even sanded the resin coat while it was still on the lathe. The bolt also added some nose weight that I needed too.

patelldp said:

Proud daddy photos of my South Bend. It is dirty, it has some dings and wear, but it is mine.

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Dan, I'm jealous! Thats a great looking system you've got set up there.

caveduck said:

If your lathe died electronically there is a pretty good chance your controller board is the problem...it happened to me and I found that it's relatively common. There are a couple of guys that repair them for very reasonable fixed cost ~$60 with shipping. I used https://olduhfguy.com and got good service and advice such as ventilating the controller board housing to limit heat buildup.

Almost all mini-lathes including the HF ones are made by SIEG in China. These days they are pretty decent, especially if you do some of the simple upgrades/corrections (YouTube is full of how-to vids). Little Machine Shop sells some with upgraded motors and component selection. They come in various bed lengths up to 20" nominal.

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Mine's at a friend's (solarover12) house who's pretty good with electronics, he's going to see if he can fix it. I told him if he can fix it, he can just have it. He needs one. If not, I'll probably use it for spare parts.

caveduck said:

Arrgh this thread is making me think about looking for more and bigger machine tools. Drooling on my computer over a SB Heavy 10.

Oh yeah, then there's the mill I need...

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Oh me too. Nobody's ever satisfied with just a lathe! Everyone needs a mill too.


I just found this on craigslist this morning
https://stgeorge.craigslist.org/tls/5002221764.html

It's come down to these two last machines. The used Grizzly G0602 and the used SB 10K. Both have their pros and cons.

Grizzly
Pros:
Cheaper ($1000)
Layout I'm comfortable with/used to.
Comes with quick change tool post
Comes will all tooling necessary
Come with 4 jaw chuck.
Smaller

Cons:
1hp motor (not really that bad, but the SB is probably much better)
Non-American made.

Southbend
Pros:
Better Motor
Solid construction
Everyone seems to love their SB
American Made

Cons:
Too big to fit in my workshop
Relatively "bare bones" (Does NOT include tooling, steadyrest, etc)
More expensive (plus the money I'd have to spend on tooling and upgrades ($150-300).
Older, so it might be more difficult to find replacement parts.

Right now I'm leaning towards the grizzly. The SB looks great, but It's just outside my price/size range.

Thanks everybody for the input! I'll let you all know what I decide.

Alex

CarVac said:

I know that feeling; I have a lathe, and now I must find a mill.

But I must find the space for the mill; the lathe takes up all the extra space I had.

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I spent a ton of time trying to find a mill. They were either too big, too heavy, too something or other. I learned milling on some nice Bridgeport's but it just wasn't in the cards for me at the time. I was giving some serious thought to a Jet midsize mill but one day I walked in a surplus machining store and found a smallish mill that needed some attention. It was a Chinese no name import that needed a little work, and it was the right price.... As everyone is well aware, the machine cost is just a drop in the bucket; get ready to dump a bunch of cash on new tooling!

I'm thinking on one of these but with more way length. 12" x 30" is more what I have in mind:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Bolton-Too...443?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a7cdb8d0b

I have a Sherline lathe along with the mill attachment and really like it. It's very accurate for smaller parts but may be too small if your needs are for something larger. What I like about Sherline is that they carry replacement repair parts on their website at very low prices. So it's very inexpensive to keep the tool in perfect running condition. They also have an extremely broad range of add-on tooling so that you can make about anything you'd need on a lathe or mill.

I also have a couple of older lathes in storage that I need to refurbish when I get the time. One is an older Craftsmen lathe in great shape but I need to finish building my new workshop in order to have room for it. The larger lathes really need to be mounted on a very sturdy base that is flat within a few thousandths of an inch, or else it will be difficult to have any accuracy.

Alex....did you ever get a G0602? I am looking at getting one soon and wondered about your experience if you had one. BTW...enjoying your boosted dart thread.

I love my old Craftsman Commercial. It isn't heavy duty but it fits the space I have, has lots of tooling, and does a nice job on everything I do. I got a used Grizzly mill and am in the process of converting it to DRO on all 3 axes. When I can work on it that is.

@pyrobob: You are spot on correct. I also have an Atlas post-WW2 era lathe. I bought it used from the original owner who looks like he never used it. Cleaned it up, replaced the original motor with a sealed unit (from Taiwan), and have used it for 27 years. Old school American built is very heavy duty, and high quality stuff.

Rocket86 said:

I love my old Craftsman Commercial. It isn't heavy duty but it fits the space I have, has lots of tooling, and does a nice job on everything I do. I got a used Grizzly mill and am in the process of converting it to DRO on all 3 axes. When I can work on it that is.

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Very nice!

Blackleaf99 said:

@pyrobob: You are spot on correct. I also have an Atlas post-WW2 era lathe. I bought it used from the original owner who looks like he never used it. Cleaned it up, replaced the original motor with a sealed unit (from Taiwan), and have used it for 27 years. Old school American built is very heavy duty, and high quality stuff.

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No doubt, old school American engineering is hard core. I'd love to see a return of American engineering and produced equipment. It's a personal goal of mine. We shall see....

I bought a huge 60's vintage LeBlond Tool and Diemaker lathe (10 HP 3 Phase motor with a 84" bed) that was tagged as surplus by my employer. Funny thing is that I was the primary user of the the lathe (after hours) as it was great for turning 6" motor hardware.
I spent more to have an equipment rigger move it out of the shop and to its new location, than for the lathe itself. All in all, it was a kick ass bargain.

John

Rocket86 said:

I love my old Craftsman Commercial. It isn't heavy duty but it fits the space I have, has lots of tooling, and does a nice job on everything I do. I got a used Grizzly mill and am in the process of converting it to DRO on all 3 axes. When I can work on it that is.

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Hmm!!! That's a really interesting application for your milling attachment! I love the ingenuity.

I'll be using my dad's Bridgeport today to slot my tube.

Titan II said:

Alex....did you ever get a G0602? I am looking at getting one soon and wondered about your experience if you had one. BTW...enjoying your boosted dart thread.

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Nope, I didn't. I moved away to college before I saved the money to buy one. I have access to some bigger ones now...

Alex

Johnly said:

I bought a huge 60's vintage LeBlond Tool and Diemaker lathe (10 HP 3 Phase motor with a 84" bed) that was tagged as surplus by my employer. Funny thing is that I was the primary user of the the lathe (after hours) as it was great for turning 6" motor hardware.
I spent more to have an equipment rigger move it out of the shop and to its new location, than for the lathe itself. All in all, it was a kick ass bargain.

John

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Nice score! We had one about the same size at my school and I always wondered how they even got it in the building. Maybe they built the building around the lathe.... How long did it take for them to remove and install it?

patelldp said:

Hmm!!! That's a really interesting application for your milling attachment! I love the ingenuity.

I'll be using my dad's Bridgeport today to slot my tube.

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I totally missed the milling attachment in the picture. I have one on my Craftsman and used it for odd and end stuff. What's going on this picture, I can't tell? Is that some sort of etching device hooked up the milling attachment, and what for?

Looks like a Dremel with a flex cable cutting fin slots. Very innovative.

I always wanted THESE
I was just a few months away from buying one when life drastically changed.
A welder buddy of mine bought and old used one and he loves it.
He also has an old South Bend lathe.

pyrobob said:

Nice score! We had one about the same size at my school and I always wondered how they even got it in the building. Maybe they built the building around the lathe.... How long did it take for them to remove and install it?

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The beast weighs a bit over 6,000 pounds, but the riggers had the specialized equipment needed to jack it up and place it on a roller base with solid steel wheels to get it out of the building. From there onto a tilt bed trailer for the 15 mile drive to its new home. It took them about a half a day for the move and it cost me $1800 for the service. The shop didn't have 3 phase power, so with my neighbor( a steel mill electrician) we addressed that need.

John

This is how I did my slots today.

Johnly said:

The beast weighs a bit over 6,000 pounds, but the riggers had the specialized equipment needed to jack it up and place it on a roller base with solid steel wheels to get it out of the building. From there onto a tilt bed trailer for the 15 mile drive to its new home. It took them about a half a day for the move and it cost me $1800 for the service. The shop didn't have 3 phase power, so with my neighbor( a steel mill electrician) we addressed that need.

John

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$1800 sounds reasonable for that kind of work and especially if that was more than what you paid for the lathe itself, I would say that's a total score. How much does the chuck weigh? Do you need an overhead block and tackle to change it?

patelldp said:

This is how I did my slots today.

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Nice. Do you manually index it and eye ball it or do you have an indexing head?

pyrobob said:

Nice. Do you manually index it and eye ball it or do you have an indexing head?

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Have an indexing head, but eyeballed it. No real need for precision...just marked the slots and zipped them.

I have a build thread going on www.rocketryspot.com, check it out!

patelldp said:

This is how I did my slots today.

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I'm pretty envious of that. Next year I may be doing that too, but not on a Bridgeport. I almost got in an accident driving home from work last week while I was gawking at what looked like a 49" on an open trailer going down the highway, to make somebody very happy no doubt.

pyrobob said:

$1800 sounds reasonable for that kind of work and especially if that was more than what you paid for the lathe itself, I would say that's a total score. How much does the chuck weigh? Do you need an overhead block and tackle to change it?

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The 3 jaw chuck stays on the lathe most of the time, as moving a piece of steel about 18" inches in diameter and about 10" tall is a chore. Every now and then I need to switch over to the 4 jaw or the collet chuck and the work begins. When I was young and foolish I would do it myself with a cradle to assist, now it's a two person job.

John

pyrobob said:

No doubt, old school American engineering is hard core. I'd love to see a return of American engineering and produced equipment. It's a personal goal of mine. We shall see....

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There are probably 1000's of American built lathes sitting in workshops, garages, etc. with no one using them. I hate to say it, but honestly the newest generation of kids probably will never have any interest in using them. Or for that matter, even knowing what these machines are . . .

Blackleaf99 said:

There are probably 1000's of American built lathes sitting in workshops, garages, etc. with no one using them. I hate to say it, but honestly the newest generation of kids probably will never have any interest in using them. Or for that matter, even knowing what these machines are . . .

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You're probably right on the former, and I have anything to do with it, wrong on the latter . At least for my son, I definitely want him creating and building stuff. Whether that's en vogue I don't really care. Of course, I didn't really help myself by buying him a Nintendo Wii U but we're pretty good at regulating that sort of thing.