TCC's Dairy Aire 2015 - DA2015 - Rained Out

Dairy Aire (DA, DA2015) - Launch canceled due to rain

I am going! My wife and I are staying at the Harris Ranch Inn Friday and Saturday nights.

I went to TCC's October Skies last October, and they were a great bunch of people, and the HPR equipment was excellent. The night launch was awesome! The onsite food vendor was pretty good and was reasonably priced. Bay Area Rocketry was the onsite rocketry vendor. I camped at the site, which was fun, but I highly recommend a cot if tent camping --- the ground was a bit rough. They had a cool T-Shirt --- you had to order in advance.

The only issue I had was that they don't seem to update the website with the most current info about the launch, so if you want to be kept current, you need to sign up for their email chat. Then, as the launch gets closer, you'll be in the loop on the latest details, but you'll also be flooded by a ton of emails you are not a part of. It's all or nothing! Oh well... I highly recommend getting on the list anyway.

I am planning to build my Warlock before this launch --- I need to get started soon! I also need to get started on a better night rocket. I expect I'll have the Pod Rocket with me and the G-force too and maybe even the Leviathan.

I hope to see all my local rocket buddies there!

I'll also be going (probably just Saturday), provided I can get a rocket finished by then. My first TCC launch was October Skies last year and that was great (all except for the swamp just behind the flight line), and I've attended two monthly TCC launches at the same field since. I have the parts to re-build my Excel w/DD, a Minie-Magg kit that I plan to design for night launching (EL wire on the airframe and fin outline, LED-illuminated nosecone), and my first fiberglass kit, a Go Devil 38 from one of Rocketry Warehouse's weekly sales. My original plan from January was that I'd only be working on the Minie-Magg April & May, as dd.xls should have been done (hopefully along with my L2) and Bumbl-B (GLR Firestorm 54) was a solid flyer (in fact pretty much every launch somebody within camera earshot would remark some form of "wow, that's straight" which I found amusing). But both of these were destroyed in the past month, so I'd have to build 3 new rockets to be back up to my desired fleet size in the next month, that's not gonna happen.

Over the next month I'll be focusing on rebuilding the Excel (dd2.xls?) so that I can try another L2 cert at Dairy Aire (this time with electronic eject). Which won't leave me time to sort out all of the details I was going to try to do on the Minie-Magg, but I'll hopefully get the Go Devil 38 (as of yet unnamed) together by then also (looks like it should be a fairly simple build, but I do have to obtain more parts like motor retention, recovery, and bits for the tiny avionics bay / nosecone tracker bay). My next night launch opportunities would be XPRS in September and this year's October Skies.

If I get the Warlock built and get inspired to study for the written test, I might try for my L2.

Here's a direct link for signing up for the TCC Rocket Chat email list. https://www.freelists.org/list/tccrockets

That's the best way to stay in the loop about the launch.

HAHAHAHHAAAA!!!!!!!! You've got it bad!!!! I told you this would happen.

You can literally build the Warlock in an evening. The finish work will take a couple evenings spread out over 2-3 weeks. The fins take the most work to finish. I used a 1/8" round over router bit on the edges. I highly recommend sealing the grain in the plywood. You can use sanding sealer or finishing epoxy. Wipe it on and let it soak in for a minute or two then wipe all of the excess off. I used Rusto X2 primer and paint, but I've heard also good things about Rusto filler primer. 2-3 coats of primer will mostly fill in the spirals. I sand with 320 after it has dried for a day or two. My standard practice with the paint available these days is to wait a week between primer and each subsequent paint color. That way the paint is not only dry to the touch but hard underneath so that you don't get tape texture transferring to the surface.

ThirstyBarbarian said:

If I get the Warlock built and get inspired to study for the written test, I might try for my L2.

Click to expand...

BTW: I used a J350 in my first L2 attempt in a Warlock. That's a great combination. There are a TON of options available now, but when it came out the J350 was THE motor to get your L2 on.

ChrisAttebery said:

HAHAHAHHAAAA!!!!!!!! You've got it bad!!!! I told you this would happen.

You can literally build the Warlock in an evening. The finish work will take a couple evenings spread out over 2-3 weeks. The fins take the most work to finish. I used a 1/8" round over router bit on the edges. I highly recommend sealing the grain in the plywood. You can use sanding sealer or finishing epoxy. Wipe it on and let it soak in for a minute or two then wipe all of the excess off. I used Rusto X2 primer and paint, but I've heard also good things about Rusto filler primer. 2-3 coats of primer will mostly fill in the spirals. I sand with 320 after it has dried for a day or two. My standard practice with the paint available these days is to wait a week between primer and each subsequent paint color. That way the paint is not only dry to the touch but hard underneath so that you don't get tape texture transferring to the surface.

Click to expand...

Ha ha! What is happening to me? I used to be so sensible...

Actually, I'm partially motivated by being cheap. When I got the rocket, I figured I'd stick to I motors, and because I didn't have any hardware and was planning on getting a CTI 29mm starter set for my 29mm birds, I thought I would try to fly it on large 6 grain and 6 xl 29mm motors. There just really aren't very many motors in that size that will work though, and now I'm seeing all these great I's and J's in 38mm 5 and 6 grain sizes. So I'm thinking about getting the cert just so I can get the cert special and get a case for free! What a cheapskate!

I agree about the build. It looks like it might only take a few hours to actually build the rocket. Then the rest of the month for finishing! I had in mind a design that was going to involve some vinyl, but with Mark at Stickershock having a family emergency, I'm going to rethink that.

Try CallieGraphics. She did some work for me in the past.

ChrisAttebery said:

BTW: I used a J350 in my first L2 attempt in a Warlock. That's a great combination. There are a TON of options available now, but when it came out the J350 was THE motor to get your L2 on.

Click to expand...

I was talking to one of the guys at LOC the other day about trying to swap out the chute that came with the kit for a brighter color (they didn't have any). We got to chatting about the rocket, and the J350 is the motor he recommended too. I'm guessing a comparable CTI motor would be the 6 grain J354. For a milder ride, there's another white in the 5 grain size --- J290.

My DoorKnob came with a 58" yellow chute. Usually they are orange, red, flo red.

ThirstyBarbarian said:

I was talking to one of the guys at LOC the other day about trying to swap out the chute that came with the kit for a brighter color (they didn't have any). We got to chatting about the rocket, and the J350 is the motor he recommended too. I'm guessing a comparable CTI motor would be the 6 grain J354. For a milder ride, there's another white in the 5 grain size --- J290.

Click to expand...

J290 would be perfect for an L2 attempt. The 6G J381 skid would also be great, although there aren't very many other 6G motors compared to the huge range of 5G and 6Xl options. If you want to do a I motored test flight I can lend you my 5G case (and a spacer if you want 4G). I'll be there on Saturday and Sunday, but I'm not sure about Friday.

One other note about the Warlock, mine also has the 60" burgundy chute and visibility is okay, although orange or yellow would be better.

Regarding night rockets, if you still have one of those PSII builder kits that would be perfect for a night rocket build (like the Partizon I have for night flying). Cover it in LED's and a rocket like a Leviathan or Partizon will fly great on a G80 or G106 Skid.

See you there! I can't wait for this launch, I'll be flying my Frenzy again, as well as my Warlock, Magg, and a few other rockets.

ChrisAttebery said:

My DoorKnob came with a 58" yellow chute. Usually they are orange, red, flo red.

Click to expand...

Mine came with a burgundy chute. I'd prefer orange, red, or any fluorescent color. LOC is perfectly willing to swap it for anything they have in stock, but all they have right now other thtn burgundy is white or tan. I guess they like to source Made in the USA, and there isn't much available right now.

SCrocketfan said:

J290 would be perfect for an L2 attempt. The 6G J381 skid would also be great, although there aren't very many other 6G motors compared to the huge range of 5G and 6Xl options. If you want to do a I motored test flight I can lend you my 5G case (and a spacer if you want 4G). I'll be there on Saturday and Sunday, but I'm not sure about Friday.

One other note about the Warlock, mine also has the 60" burgundy chute and visibility is okay, although orange or yellow would be better.

Regarding night rockets, if you still have one of those PSII builder kits that would be perfect for a night rocket build (like the Partizon I have for night flying). Cover it in LED's and a rocket like a Leviathan or Partizon will fly great on a G80 or G106 Skid.

See you there! I can't wait for this launch, I'll be flying my Frenzy again, as well as my Warlock, Magg, and a few other rockets.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the offer on the loaner case. I may take you up on that. I'll start making motor decisions after I get the Warlock finished and weighed and start running some sims.

For the night launch, I do have some builder kits, including a Partizon. I thought yours made a great night rocket, and that might be the one I use. What kind of LED kit did you use? I started looking at some of the kits, and the ones with the RGB LEDs and programmable patterns were a bit more expensive than I thought they would be.

I've got several single-use G75DM motors that I think would work pretty well with a Partizon and an LED setup.

ThirstyBarbarian said:

Thanks for the offer on the loaner case. I may take you up on that. I'll start making motor decisions after I get the Warlock finished and weighed and start running some sims.

For the night launch, I do have some builder kits, including a Partizon. I thought yours made a great night rocket, and that might be the one I use. What kind of LED kit did you use? I started looking at some of the kits, and the ones with the RGB LEDs and programmable patterns were a bit more expensive than I thought they would be.

I've got several single-use G75DM motors that I think would work pretty well with a Partizon and an LED setup.

Click to expand...

My Warlock is ~105 oz for reference built basically stock with a 24X24 nomex, stock 60" chute, quick links, etc. It's almost exactly what the sim file predicted. Since I've only flown it once with no electronics I don't know how close it is to my sim file, but my sim file predicts ~1850 on the I297-8 I flew it on and ~2200 on a I540 or 5G J. I'll probably fly mine on an I540, although I may also fly another I297.

Regarding the night launch, the partizon is great to modify since it splits at the nose cone rather than the middle, so you can run lights the whole length.

I used a light kit from this brand, although I think mine's not waterproof: https://www.amazon.com/dp/SUPERNIGHT/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

These are fairly cheap ($15-20) but the quality isn't great (one of the wires on mine is loose so 1/3rd of the lights sometimes don't work). Ironically waterproof is probably a worthwhile option, my Partizon landed literally 2 feet away from an irrigation ditch full of water.

The only catch is you have to supply a battery system I think- I soldered an RC battery connector to mine and used a 3S lithium battery. You don't have to use the giant 12V adapter, but the little control box and battery on my Partizon add quite a bit of weight, I'd estimate it flies to less than 1000 feet on a G.

I have to figure out motors for the night launch- probably something sparky and H54/H133/H163 for a possible second flight. G75 should be great. Want to do a G75DM drag race if you get the same general lighting setup?

ThirstyBarbarian said:

If I get the Warlock built and get inspired to study for the written test, I might try for my L2.

Click to expand...

NAR or Tripoli? I have a great spreadsheet for the latter.

ThirstyBarbarian said:

I was talking to one of the guys at LOC the other day about trying to swap out the chute that came with the kit for a brighter color (they didn't have any). We got to chatting about the rocket, and the J350 is the motor he recommended too. I'm guessing a comparable CTI motor would be the 6 grain J354. For a milder ride, there's another white in the 5 grain size --- J290.

Click to expand...

J290 is a monster, I think the most total impulse in that size. I have a J285 laying around that I probably should have used for my L2 instead, but hey 1300mph was fun! Of course, you and I fly quite different rockets.

You should definitely borrow that 5G case from SCrocketfan, that way it will have at least two certification flights and will be waiting for his!

watermelonman said:

NAR or Tripoli? I have a great spreadsheet for the latter.



J290 is a monster, I think the most total impulse in that size. I have a J285 laying around that I probably should have used for my L2 instead, but hey 1300mph was fun! Of course, you and I fly quite different rockets.

You should definitely borrow that 5G case from SCrocketfan, that way it will have at least two certification flights and will be waiting for his!

Click to expand...

That J290 flight was awesome! I think Thirsty is going to cert on his own case though with the certification special, possibly after an I flight.

It looks like the J290 would be a perfect flight to ~2300 feet. Only catch is 8 seconds is a slightly short delay and 10 is slightly long. 8 would probably work fine though. I think I'm going to try an I540-9 in my Warlock which will get almost the same altitude.

My L2 may be on a bit more impulse than the J290… Thinking 54mm or 75mm…

SCrocketfan said:

That J290 flight was awesome! I think Thirsty is going to cert on his own case though with the certification special, possibly after an I flight.

It looks like the J290 would be a perfect flight to ~2300 feet. Only catch is 8 seconds is a slightly short delay and 10 is slightly long. 8 would probably work fine though. I think I'm going to try an I540-9 in my Warlock which will get almost the same altitude.

My L2 may be on a bit more impulse than the J290… Thinking 54mm or 75mm…

Click to expand...

Too bad, I was thinking it would be funny if we all used that same case for L2 flights. The I540 is an absolute demon, but you knew that. I want to try one in my Nuke after I fiberglass it and test with an I566.

Speaking of delays after my prang I am taking every excuse to put electronic ejection in every rocket I can.

I like the new profile picture. Was that an H100?

watermelonman said:

I like the new profile picture. Was that an H100?

Click to expand...

SCrocketfan, I assume you had this Minie-Magg at Snow Ranch last weekend? FYI, I got some pretty good video of the launch at 3:20, it was slow enough on the up part that I was able to keep it in frame most of the ascent, and since it was the only rocket on the pads at the time I filmed it the whole way to the ground. So there's a 1080p/60fps video (~491 MB) available here, just go to More -> Download video.

SCrocketfan said:

My Warlock is ~105 oz for reference built basically stock with a 24X24 nomex, stock 60" chute, quick links, etc. It's almost exactly what the sim file predicted. Since I've only flown it once with no electronics I don't know how close it is to my sim file, but my sim file predicts ~1850 on the I297-8 I flew it on and ~2200 on a I540 or 5G J. I'll probably fly mine on an I540, although I may also fly another I297.

Regarding the night launch, the partizon is great to modify since it splits at the nose cone rather than the middle, so you can run lights the whole length.

I used a light kit from this brand, although I think mine's not waterproof: https://www.amazon.com/dp/SUPERNIGHT/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

These are fairly cheap ($15-20) but the quality isn't great (one of the wires on mine is loose so 1/3rd of the lights sometimes don't work). Ironically waterproof is probably a worthwhile option, my Partizon landed literally 2 feet away from an irrigation ditch full of water.

The only catch is you have to supply a battery system I think- I soldered an RC battery connector to mine and used a 3S lithium battery. You don't have to use the giant 12V adapter, but the little control box and battery on my Partizon add quite a bit of weight, I'd estimate it flies to less than 1000 feet on a G.

I have to figure out motors for the night launch- probably something sparky and H54/H133/H163 for a possible second flight. G75 should be great. Want to do a G75DM drag race if you get the same general lighting setup?

Click to expand...

Thanks for the link --- this price is a lot closer to what I had in mind! Did you just mount the controller and battery to the outside of the rocket?

Now that I'm thinking about it, I'll need to check on the delays on the G75's I already have to see if they'll work with the Partizon for the night launch, but yeah, I'd be up for a drag race if I get the rocket ready by then.

watermelonman said:

NAR or Tripoli? I have a great spreadsheet for the latter.



J290 is a monster, I think the most total impulse in that size. I have a J285 laying around that I probably should have used for my L2 instead, but hey 1300mph was fun! Of course, you and I fly quite different rockets.

You should definitely borrow that 5G case from SCrocketfan, that way it will have at least two certification flights and will be waiting for his!

Click to expand...

I'm a NAR member, so if I decide on a cert attempt, I'll probably cert with NAR if I can arrange for someone to sign off for me at this Tripoli event. That J290 looks like a great motor! It has a pretty long burn. Not really a long-burn motor, but more than some.

woferry said:

SCrocketfan, I assume you had this Minie-Magg at Snow Ranch last weekend? FYI, I got some pretty good video of the launch at 3:20, it was slow enough on the up part that I was able to keep it in frame most of the ascent, and since it was the only rocket on the pads at the time I filmed it the whole way to the ground. So there's a 1080p/60fps video (~491 MB) available here, just go to More -> Download video.

Click to expand...

Thank you for filming that flight, great video! You also got great video of one of my other flights, thanks. It was cool to have video review of those flights.

watermelonman said:

Too bad, I was thinking it would be funny if we all used that same case for L2 flights.

Click to expand...

The brotherhood of the traveling case?

ThirstyBarbarian said:

Thanks for the link --- this price is a lot closer to what I had in mind! Did you just mount the controller and battery to the outside of the rocket?

Now that I'm thinking about it, I'll need to check on the delays on the G75's I already have to see if they'll work with the Partizon for the night launch, but yeah, I'd be up for a drag race if I get the rocket ready by then.

Click to expand...

Sounds great. G75-6 should work well. I did just tape the battery (in a small box) and controller to the side, which does add a lot of drag, but since it's a night flyer losing a bit of altitude.

woferry said:

SCrocketfan, I assume you had this Minie-Magg at Snow Ranch last weekend? FYI, I got some pretty good video of the launch at 3:20, it was slow enough on the up part that I was able to keep it in frame most of the ascent, and since it was the only rocket on the pads at the time I filmed it the whole way to the ground. So there's a 1080p/60fps video (~491 MB) available here, just go to More -> Download video.

Click to expand...

BTW: Thirsty, woferry got some great video of your pod rocket too. Nice flight!

SCrocketfan said:

That J290 flight was awesome! I think Thirsty is going to cert on his own case though with the certification special, possibly after an I flight.

It looks like the J290 would be a perfect flight to ~2300 feet. Only catch is 8 seconds is a slightly short delay and 10 is slightly long. 8 would probably work fine though. I think I'm going to try an I540-9 in my Warlock which will get almost the same altitude.

My L2 may be on a bit more impulse than the J290… Thinking 54mm or 75mm…

Click to expand...

I'm not even certain I'm going to try to cert, but my plan was to get the case using the cert special. We'll see how it goes. I have a few things to get ready for the launch and I'll see how far I get.

I think I might have outsmarted myself again trying to save money. Instead of just buying a 5 grain 38mm case, which I think would be perfect, I got a 29/38 adapter and figured I could get started with the 29mm 6gxl loads for the 29mm starter set I was already getting. I've got a H226 and a I243 load for that case. I kind of wish I could just swap those loads and the case and adapter for 38mm loads and hardware for the Warlock. My Wildman BS order was just getting too big, so I was looking for ways to shave a few costs, and I didn't really get what I wanted.

ThirstyBarbarian said:

I'm not even certain I'm going to try to cert, but my plan was to get the case using the cert special. We'll see how it goes. I have a few things to get ready for the launch and I'll see how far I get.

I think I might have outsmarted myself again trying to save money. Instead of just buying a 5 grain 38mm case, which I think would be perfect, I got a 29/38 adapter and figured I could get started with the 29mm 6gxl loads for the 29mm starter set I was already getting. I've got a H226 and a I243 load for that case. I kind of wish I could just swap those loads and the case and adapter for 38mm loads and hardware for the Warlock. My Wildman BS order was just getting too big, so I was looking for ways to shave a few costs, and I didn't really get what I wanted.

Click to expand...

If you don't want to cert you can definitely borrow my 5G case (with spacers if you want 4G or 3G). The H226 would work in the G-force and I243 in the Pod Rocket if you wanted to fly those motors, the 6XL motors are quite powerful.

woferry said:

SCrocketfan, I assume you had this Minie-Magg at Snow Ranch last weekend? FYI, I got some pretty good video of the launch at 3:20, it was slow enough on the up part that I was able to keep it in frame most of the ascent, and since it was the only rocket on the pads at the time I filmed it the whole way to the ground. So there's a 1080p/60fps video (~491 MB) available here, just go to More -> Download video.

Click to expand...

SCrocketfan said:

BTW: Thirsty, woferry got some great video of your pod rocket too. Nice flight!

Click to expand...

Great video of the Pod Rocket, Woferry! The coast phase and the deployment are great. Often that's the hardest part to see even on video.

Thanks for pointing that out, SC!

SCrocketfan said:

If you don't want to cert you can definitely borrow my 5G case (with spacers if you want 4G or 3G). The H226 would work in the G-force and I243 in the Pod Rocket if you wanted to fly those motors, the 6XL motors are quite powerful.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the offer. It sounds like there are going to be lots of great options. This is going to be fun launch!

watermelonman said:

Too bad, I was thinking it would be funny if we all used that same case for L2 flights. The I540 is an absolute demon, but you knew that. I want to try one in my Nuke after I fiberglass it and test with an I566.

Speaking of delays after my prang I am taking every excuse to put electronic ejection in every rocket I can.

I like the new profile picture. Was that an H100?

Click to expand...

You going to fly an I540 in the Nuke at Dairy Aire? I566 should also rock.

I tend to avoid relying on AT motor ejection for HPR, but CTI is usually reliable. It may have just been the old delay on that E16 as I haven't seen many problems with hobbyline motors. Is that rocket fixable?

My profile picture was an H410 Vmax (baby H, .4 second burn) and was the rocket's second flight and my second HPR flight. I don't think the H100 is enough thrust for this rocket, I usually keep the thrust over 200 newtons now that it has nose weight, it just is more stable on higher thrust motors. 29mm H160 was great though last weekend, it hit 1460 feet (see attached).