Dyeing CA (while it is liquid)?

Hi folks,

There have been times when I'm using thin CA to harden balsa parts. Actually I do it a lot. As my eyes age, in some lighting conditions it is tough to see where I've already soaked in the CA and where it hasn't been applied. Also, if I'm sanding down a hardened bit of balsa, it would be nice if the CA were colored so I could see that I'm starting to sand through.

I have noticed that thin CA acts like a pretty good solvent on stuff like sharpie marker ink. Is there something I can buy that will dissolve into the CA (without kicking off its setting process) that would dye it? In my mind, I'd get a hobby lobby bottle of the pink stuff, dump in the dye powder, shake it up, and then whenever I use that bottle, I'd get well colored hardened balsa...

Anybody ever done this?

Marc

Marc_G said:

Hi folks,

There have been times when I'm using thin CA to harden balsa parts. Actually I do it a lot. As my eyes age, in some lighting conditions it is tough to see where I've already soaked in the CA and where it hasn't been applied. Also, if I'm sanding down a hardened bit of balsa, it would be nice if the CA were colored so I could see that I'm starting to sand through.

I have noticed that thin CA acts like a pretty good solvent on stuff like sharpie marker ink. Is there something I can buy that will dissolve into the CA (without kicking off its setting process) that would dye it? In my mind, I'd get a hobby lobby bottle of the pink stuff, dump in the dye powder, shake it up, and then whenever I use that bottle, I'd get well colored hardened balsa...

Anybody ever done this?

Marc

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Ive heard of food coloring in white glue. CA tho....thats a tough call. Try it????

CA sets up with water. I highly doubt that adding food coloring would do anything more than cause the entire batch to kick off.

What I've taken to doing for CA on balsa is to paint the part with a Sharpie after the CA has set up, then sand until it's gone. if a spot starts to turn grey (or a fuzzy color of whatever color pen I used), then I've sanded through the CA. I'll add a drop or two over the affected area, use a different color Sharpie, and carefully sand until that color is gone (taking care not to sand through the older CA application. I've got a photo tutorial on the process... Here.

That's how I was able to get the finish on these nosecones to look so good...

Scotty Dog said:

Ive heard of food coloring in white glue. CA tho....thats a tough call. Try it????

Click to expand...

If food coloring is dissolved in water it would not work. If it is in alcohol, maybe...

You might try dripping a little bit of the ink from a Sharpie pen into the CA, and see if that works (I'd use it on a nearly empty bottle). Likewise, CA reacts with my printouts... Perhaps a small amount of toner from a printer might work... but then again, it might just cause it to kick.

Maybe call the Bob Smith company? They might have an answer handy.

I have from time to time used Epoxy coloring pigments in medium CA. Usually red but these liquid pigments come in Amber, Yellow, Red, Blue and Green. I don't use thin CA for anything so have no experience with it but it works well with Medium CA. A single drop or two in up to about 1/2oz of epoxy or CA seem to be all you need for good "transparent" color.

That said I've been finishing models and Nosecone, Transitions and wood parts to look like plastic for years using Medium CA or just primers getting the same mirror smooth results.
Actually I've found chucking the Cone or transition in a drill or dremel and spinning it while holding a CA soaked paper towel against the wood works the CA into the Balsa or Basswood evenly in layers without leaving paper bits behind.

Epoxy pigments are available from Micro Mark and many epoxy selling vendors.

You could try powdered food coloring as well, can't say how it would work as I've never tried it but that should get around the water kicking off the CA.

mjennings said:

You could try powdered food coloring as well, can't say how it would work as I've never tried it but that should get around the water kicking off the CA.

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The next question is, would the food coloring dissolve in the CA?

I've got 7 FD&C food dyes in powdered form at school; I might give it a run tomorrow. The only problem is lack of a good way to contain a drop of CA/dye and prevent exposure to moisture in the air. I'm sure there is something around that will work.

Doug

I would be grateful to hear the results. I think if the dye is going to kick off the CA, it will do so quickly and be pretty obvious with heat/fumes. If the powder doesn't kick it, the liquid drops should still be liquid a few minutes later, even exposed to air.

I've found the Castin' CRaft dyes on Amazon for under <$10 shipped per one ounce bottle ("infinite lifetime supply" for me).

I look forward to hearing the powdered food dye experiment results; otherwise will order a bottle of Castin' Craft.

I appreciate everyone's help!

I gave up after 3 of the 7 totally failed to dissolve. I'm guessing the dyes are fairly polar and CA is generally nonpolar.

Doug

dcbertelsen said:

I gave up after 3 of the 7 totally failed to dissolve. I'm guessing the dyes are fairly polar and CA is generally nonpolar.

Doug

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You try my idea about dripping Sharpie ink or printer toner?

dcbertelsen said:

I gave up after 3 of the 7 totally failed to dissolve. I'm guessing the dyes are fairly polar and CA is generally nonpolar.

Doug

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Thanks. No worries... I will just get some of the Castin' Craft dye. I appreciate your efforts.

Toner is a good idea but I don't have easy access to extra toner.

K'Tesh said:

You try my idea about dripping Sharpie ink or printer toner?

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I haven't; mostly because I haven't needed to. The food dyes were just to satisfy my curiosity and further the general knowledge.

Doug

I've purchased some Castin' Craft dye and will do some tests with it in thin CA and post results once done. I should have the material by end of next week but may not have time to work with it for another week or two after that. Thread will go dormant but I will resurrect it when I have something to say!

Marc

Marc:
I just ordered a set of Opaque epoxy dyes from Micro-Mark. These like the Castin' craft are supposed to be for epoxy but these new dyes are supposed to be Opaque reather than transparent. Should have them in a week or so. I'll let you know if they work as well as the Castin craft dyes in CA sometime there after

Update:
Got the New 7 color set of Opaque Pigment dyes from Micro-Mark today. They are in fact Also Castin' Craft brand but unlike the ones i've had since 2010 these are in fact Opaque.
Today I did a little test using some scrap T3 Body tube and 1/32" Basswood. Mixed two drops of each Transparent and Opaque dyes in a small amount of Medium Zap CA. As before the the dye mixed CA still works just as well as before adding the dye. I used red Transparent and Blue Opaque for these test.
Used the dyed CA to both attach the wood to the body tube and then add a heavy fillet to each. I wasn't looking from neat just to get the fillets in place. I did use CA Kicker to set the wood/body joint but allowed the CA fillets to air dry.
I believe this stuff is what your looking for

New Opaque Pigments from Castin' Craft works great in both epoxy and CA. See photo's in previous post.

Thanks for the info. I'm still waiting for my castin' craft dye to show up. It's due early this coming week.

The dye came today. I may put it into my partial bottle of CA and see if it damages the CA over time. I won't have time to test actual use until the weekend. From the tests John showed above, looks like it will work just as well for me. My only concern is, what will it do to the shelf life of the CA? It's OK if I have to mix it up in a batch and use it quickish, but it would obviously be better if I could dump some in and be done with it for a while.

I've got the black opaque version of the castin craft, by the way!

Marc

Marc_G said:

The dye came today. I may put it into my partial bottle of CA and see if it damages the CA over time. I won't have time to test actual use until the weekend. From the tests John showed above, looks like it will work just as well for me. My only concern is, what will it do to the shelf life of the CA? It's OK if I have to mix it up in a batch and use it quickish, but it would obviously be better if I could dump some in and be done with it for a while.

I've got the black opaque version of the castin craft, by the way!

Marc

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Marc:
I've Always used just a few drops in whatever CA or epoxy was going to be used immediately. Mixing in small batches ensures the Resin or CA still works as it's intended.

One Ounce of the Opaque Castin' Craft Pigments is enough to treat a Quart of Resin or CA. Generally it only takes two or three drops in the usually amount of CA (Std. Condiment Cup) used to do fillets on an average size LPR or MPR model. If the amount is noted as the project progresses it's easy to mix additional batches that match the color and/or density. I generally use X number drops in X grams of CA or epoxy.

Hi everyone,

I finally got around to working on this. The dye has been sitting on my work table for months... it gradually separated with the black stuff at the bottom and what looked to be clear oily matrix on top. Since the bottle has a squirt top to it, I inverted the bottle and let the dye stuff (I'm assuming it's particles) settle to the bottom. I squeezed a few drops into a mostly full small bottle of Hobby Lobby thin CA.



I shook it up and it dispersed into the CA smoothly:



I tried some on a scrap of balsa. It worked fine but the dye was a bit weak:



I added a bit more dye to it, shook it up well, and it was much darker:



I successfully used it to coat a nose cone:



I was a bit concerned by whatever carrier fluid the black particles were suspended in might weaken the CA after cure, but it seems fine. There's no oily trace or anything.

The particles started to settle in the CA bottle after an hour... but easily resuspended. However, by the next morning the CA had started to cure and was jelly like, unusable. By the next day it was solidly cured.

Bottom line, this works fine, but the CA is not stable as a liquid once the dye is added. As Micro described above, you do have to make up a batch and use it pretty might right away.

I like this trick. It's great to be able to see the penetration of the CA into the wood, giving more confidence while sanding off high spots.