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  1. #31
    Join Date
    8th October 2014
    Location
    Mesa,Az
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    689
    And realizing I did not show a pic of the Aerotech 29mm 40/120 motor casing in the rocket using the custom spacer shown earlier. Here it is. The hook fits the casing perfectly,with the spacer. Just as it would if the thrust ring and hook were installed per instruction only the spacer would not be needed. I was able to use the product supplied in the kit and still be able to put an Aerotech H180 or small I motor in the 29mm mount. I like using the parts that come in with the kit when the alternative is spending more$$. Of coarse if the hook failed and I lost the casing that would be spendy but I havent had a failure yet with this technique. If I decide to use the new retainer i could just clip off the clip and add the retainer.Attachment 249456


  2. #32
    Join Date
    8th October 2014
    Location
    Mesa,Az
    Posts
    689
    Its still surprising how tall this rocket is.
    Attachment 249540


  3. #33
    Join Date
    8th October 2014
    Location
    Mesa,Az
    Posts
    689
    (Dont forget to click on the pics for screen sized views and a better feel for the size.)
    I have the the two parachutes attached/ 30" and 22". Im going to fly this bird on an Aerotech F50-4 and then An Aerotech G64-4 for the first flights using the stock deployment feature of 2 parachutes in separate sections. Also I not be cementing the couplers to the airframe/attach with screws so that I can modify with Dual Deployment. Although I will use the motor ejection for the first deployment and then electronic main parachute deployment at around 500'. The forward coupler will house the electronics and main chute deployment out the nose cone. (The plan) / Alternate possible electronics in forward section of the airframe, in coupler, with the main parachute housed in the middle airframe section with separation for main between those sections. I wont be cutting into the airframe at all so as to keep its integrity. I am leaning towards main chute in the middle. I dont like the weight in the rear and forward sections and that may stress the middle section a bit.
    Attachment 249541Attachment 249542Attachment 249543Attachment 249544

  4. #34
    Join Date
    22nd January 2009
    Location
    Plano, TX
    Posts
    3,325
    Quote Originally Posted by crazyed View Post
    And realizing I did not show a pic of the Aerotech 29mm 40/120 motor casing in the rocket using the custom spacer shown earlier. Here it is. The hook fits the casing perfectly,with the spacer. Just as it would if the thrust ring and hook were installed per instruction only the spacer would not be needed. I was able to use the product supplied in the kit and still be able to put an Aerotech H180 or small I motor in the 29mm mount. I like using the parts that come in with the kit when the alternative is spending more$$. Of coarse if the hook failed and I lost the casing that would be spendy but I havent had a failure yet with this technique. If I decide to use the new retainer i could just clip off the clip and add the retainer.Attachment 249456
    Nice job crazyed. Couldn't agree more about using what's provided before going the alternative add-on route. I just add a wrap or two of tape or a wire twist-tie around the motor and hook for a little "insurance".

  5. #35
    Join Date
    8th October 2014
    Location
    Mesa,Az
    Posts
    689
    Quote Originally Posted by samb View Post
    Nice job crazyed. Couldn't agree more about using what's provided before going the alternative add-on route. I just add a wrap or two of tape or a wire twist-tie around the motor and hook for a little "insurance".
    Great Idea and will do.

  6. #36
    Join Date
    8th October 2014
    Location
    Mesa,Az
    Posts
    689
    This kit may be one of my all time favorites. For construction, finish and variation in motors that can be used. With the forward airframe removed This kit could easily be flown on a wide variety of F motors. At full size F50-4 , G64-4, G77R , G76-4g, G74-4(the new small G single use), H motors thru small I motors. Keeping the average impulse at 180-200. I suppose the H180 or I200 could be flown along with all the other motors for out of sight flights with the forward section removed. So many configurations and possibilities. The new Aerotech F and G single use and the DMS motors add to the possibilities--BIG FUN. And dont forget the payload sections availability. Here are a few more pics..Almost done. MIRAGE decal added and forward section. Will add a couple stripes and paint the nose cone maybe Christmas Eve. And Merry Christmas everyoneand dont forget to click on the pics for awesome full sized views especially this 1 below
    Attachment 249570Attachment 249571Attachment 249572Attachment 249573
    Last edited by crazyed; 23rd December 2014 at 09:39 PM.

  7. #37
    Join Date
    18th October 2013
    Location
    Rumney, NH
    Posts
    1,188
    Looks Nice!
    Cody Smith
    NAR JR #93698
    TRA JR #15282 TMP Certified!
    Level One- 4/19/14 LOC IV H148R
    MMMSC, KARSNH
    www.starleopard.net
    Check out my blog!

  8. #38
    Join Date
    8th October 2014
    Location
    Mesa,Az
    Posts
    689
    Quote Originally Posted by codysmith View Post
    Looks Nice!
    Thank You Kindly Cody

  9. #39
    Join Date
    8th October 2014
    Location
    Mesa,Az
    Posts
    689
    And here is a pic of the Mirage without the forward section. It looks good I think just like that. It should give some pretty cool flights on the single use F44 or F42R motors as the short version. I took the pic while I had been stripping the forward airframe. That blue painters tape sure made for some clean lines.
    Attachment 249583Attachment 249584Attachment 249582Attachment 249585

  10. #40
    Join Date
    8th October 2014
    Location
    Mesa,Az
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    689
    And here it is. Will post more if or when electronics go in. And nose cone finishing. But as it is right now its wanting a chance to fly..lol
    Attachment 249587

  11. #41
    Join Date
    20th February 2009
    Location
    Cayuga, Indiana
    Posts
    12,882
    Like it!
    L3, TRA #11847
    Tripoli Indiana #132
    Tripoli Central Illinois #59
    Central Illinois Aerospace (NAR) #527
    Chicago Rocket Mafia, "Big Bucks" Dixon
    ___________________________________

    Quiet little voices creep into my head. -- We Were Promised Jetpacks

  12. #42
    Join Date
    8th October 2014
    Location
    Mesa,Az
    Posts
    689
    Quote Originally Posted by watermelonman View Post
    My quick list of Aerotech modifications -
    No motor hook or block, retainer only instead
    Toss the square lugs, cover their cutouts with CWF and put rail buttons elsewhere on the body tube
    Throw out the mesh and use a Nomex square on the parachute
    Nice long Kevlar shock cord

    My Arreaux is an L1 4000 foot champ!
    What size rail buttons would you recommend . And to fit which rail and and how long for a Mirage
    Thanks in advance
    Ed

  13. #43
    Join Date
    14th October 2010
    Location
    Middle TN
    Posts
    698
    I would use 1010 buttons if I was building one to launch from a rail. I would put both of the on the lower section of the rocket. Just my .
    'Til next time,

    Mike Toelle

    NAR 31692 L1

    SAM 0373

  14. #44
    Join Date
    19th January 2009
    Location
    Tucson, Az
    Posts
    2,376
    Looks great! Hope you can get to launch soon. It sucks having to work weekends.
    more rockets then cents

  15. #45
    Join Date
    8th October 2014
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    Mesa,Az
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    689
    Quote Originally Posted by mwtoelle View Post
    I would use 1010 buttons if I was building one to launch from a rail. I would put both of the on the lower section of the rocket. Just my .
    thanks mike

  16. #46
    Join Date
    8th October 2014
    Location
    Mesa,Az
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    689
    Quote Originally Posted by terryg View Post
    Looks great! Hope you can get to launch soon. It sucks having to work weekends.
    Thanks Terry.. And I broke out in a mild laugh at that as I just get home from working Christmas Day.. But its all for good...Right? Anyway any tips on prep and paint for the nose cone? Some of the paint these days is pretty good. Is sanding really needed?
    Attachment 249768

  17. #47
    Join Date
    1st September 2010
    Location
    Tucson, AZ
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    1,099
    Quote Originally Posted by crazyed View Post
    Anyway any tips on prep and paint for the nose cone? Some of the paint these days is pretty good. Is sanding really needed?
    Attachment 249768
    I encourage anyone to try to flame the nose cone after washing with dish soap and water. Just take a propane torch, and quickly pass the flame over the plastic. This oxidizes the polymer, and increases adhesion significantly. Be brief, of course, and do this after you've sanded to your heart's content.
    NAR 96681
    L1 - May 29, 2014 LOC Norad ProMax, H120
    L2 - Feb 21, 2015 Fiberglassed Madcow Frenzy, J280

  18. #48
    Join Date
    19th January 2009
    Location
    Tucson, Az
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    2,376
    I have seen both Dupli-Color Prep Spray and Dupli-Color/Clear aerosol adhesion promoter recommended for plastic nose cones (available at auto parts stores). I have had plastic nose cones that the paint chipped off at first launch and others that took a power sander and a lot of effort to get the paint off (nose cones that I have converted to night flight use). I have never tried the blow torch technique but it sounds interesting.
    Last edited by terryg; 26th December 2014 at 10:06 PM.
    more rockets then cents

  19. #49
    Join Date
    8th October 2014
    Location
    Mesa,Az
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    689
    Quote Originally Posted by soopirV View Post
    I encourage anyone to try to flame the nose cone after washing with dish soap and water. Just take a propane torch, and quickly pass the flame over the plastic. This oxidizes the polymer, and increases adhesion significantly. Be brief, of course, and do this after you've sanded to your heart's content.
    I may try sanding with some steel wool? or super fine grit paper. As Terry mentioned /ive had paint chip on first impact and another that took alot of elbow grease to get the paint off for repainting. I would like to get that glass finish like the fins on this model. The torch sounds interesting.I would have to make a special trip to the depot to get one (darn lol)

  20. #50
    Join Date
    8th October 2014
    Location
    Mesa,Az
    Posts
    689
    Here is the painted nose cone.. I had silver in the storage so to save a buck decided to use it. I was going to go with orange but what the heck-The silver looks pretty good, matches the decal for color. Not to much shine but Im cool with it.. Next up--launch Jan 06,2015. yep, thats a Tuesday but me my son and son inlaw have the day off and a great desert launch site. This rocket is ready to fly!
    Attachment 250270Attachment 250271
    Last edited by crazyed; 31st December 2014 at 06:45 AM. Reason: add pic

  21. #51
    Join Date
    22nd January 2009
    Location
    Plano, TX
    Posts
    3,325
    Beautiful rocket crazyed. I think the silver looks great too. Good luck on the maiden flight and many more after that.

  22. #52
    Join Date
    8th October 2014
    Location
    Mesa,Az
    Posts
    689
    Quote Originally Posted by samb View Post
    Beautiful rocket crazyed. I think the silver looks great too. Good luck on the maiden flight and many more after that.
    Thank You Sam
    I was sitting downstairs this morning listening to the rain (which wasnt supposed to be here till this evening/put a stop to my rib smoking/ And realized i still needed to tether the two sections. I used 8' of loc Precision shock cord. 1st flights in this configuration and then we will consider the electronic dual deploy.
    Is 8' enough? I staggered the attachment to help prevent them from hitting each other on the way down.
    Attachment 250294Attachment 250295

  23. #53
    Join Date
    19th January 2009
    Location
    Tucson, Az
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    2,376
    I think I used 10 ft and I would recommend using swivels on the ends of the cord used to attach the two sections together. That way when all the cords become tangled (and they will) it makes it easier to untangle them.
    more rockets then cents

  24. #54
    Join Date
    20th February 2009
    Location
    Cayuga, Indiana
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    12,882
    I don't believe I would tether them at all. The weight and thus descent rate for the sections should be similar. Also, I'm guessing without dual deploy you will be flying fairly low. The sections are likely to come down together and be easy to find.
    L3, TRA #11847
    Tripoli Indiana #132
    Tripoli Central Illinois #59
    Central Illinois Aerospace (NAR) #527
    Chicago Rocket Mafia, "Big Bucks" Dixon
    ___________________________________

    Quiet little voices creep into my head. -- We Were Promised Jetpacks

  25. #55
    Join Date
    8th October 2014
    Location
    Mesa,Az
    Posts
    689
    Quote Originally Posted by terryg View Post
    I think I used 10 ft and I would recommend using swivels on the ends of the cord used to attach the two sections together. That way when all the cords become tangled (and they will) it makes it easier to untangle them.
    At which connection points would I put the swivels.?

  26. #56
    Join Date
    8th October 2014
    Location
    Mesa,Az
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    689
    Quote Originally Posted by dixontj93060 View Post
    I don't believe I would tether them at all. The weight and thus descent rate for the sections should be similar. Also, I'm guessing without dual deploy you will be flying fairly low. The sections are likely to come down together and be easy to find.
    Yes ,I might give it a try on the F52-T at only a 700' projected altitude without the tether to see how it goes.

  27. #57
    Join Date
    19th January 2009
    Location
    Tucson, Az
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    I used heavy duty fishing swivels on the ends of the cord tying the two sections together. When it got tangled up (usually after several fights) I would then unhook the swivel and untangle the cords and then reconnect them the next flight. This probably not needed for G flights, but with H and I flights I found the two pieces drifted apart (particularly on windy days). Keep it simple on initial flights to learn the chute packing techniques for this design.
    more rockets then cents

  28. #58
    Join Date
    14th September 2014
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    362
    Adding wight to the forward section tends to increase stability as it moves the CG further forward of the CP. Only thing you have to contend with is the thrust to weight ratio. H motor in the 180n range ought to be able to handle it. Having said that, one thing to remember when you put a larger (heavier) motor in is, the CG moves rearward towards the CP which can make the rocket unstable. Look to keep the CG, center of gravity/mass, forward (towards the pointy end) of the CP, center of pressure, by about >1.5 times the dia of the diameter. Some prefer 2x.

  29. #59
    Join Date
    8th October 2014
    Location
    Mesa,Az
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    689
    Yes sir, I think the MIRAGE has a good degree of being "overstable" so minor changes in the weight distribution should not be a problem. But I will not take any changes and safety for granted.

  30. #60
    Join Date
    1st September 2010
    Location
    Tucson, AZ
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    1,099
    Quote Originally Posted by crazyed View Post
    Yes sir, I think the MIRAGE has a good degree of being "overstable" so minor changes in the weight distribution should not be a problem. But I will not take any changes and safety for granted.
    Indeed it is- mine would weathercock pretty easily. Mantis launch pad was barely enough to hold it though. Poor thing didn't survive long enough to see rail buttons.

    NAR 96681
    L1 - May 29, 2014 LOC Norad ProMax, H120
    L2 - Feb 21, 2015 Fiberglassed Madcow Frenzy, J280

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