Dr. Zooch Return To Flight Space Shuttle build thread- #2

[NJRick]

Wes,
IT FLIES!!!!!!!!! just did a bunch of test throws by tossing it onto my bed.....played with the elevon settings...I would say I am about medium up elevon here...if that makes any sense....but so far so good.
OK....going to paint the external tank up here.

[Dr.Zooch]

Okay, now here's a little tip... once you launch and fly it for real, and get a glide that you think is good, take some super glue and put a tiny dab in the spot where the trim screw contacts the evevon. The reason is that over time the elastic will loosen and slack. So, you'll have your elevon set where you like it. If needed, you can always crack it loose later.

[NJRick]

I would never have thought of that...thank you for the tip....I am going to do that!!...I admit..my orbiter is pretty basic....but I was surprised it actually flew. (no disrespect meant to you or your product at all Wes.....I am referencing my building skills....or lack thereof.) this kit is really a lot of fun!
I am now sanding most of the paint off of my external tank and nose cone because the spray paint basically vomited all over it....came out in huge blobs....but I think I have most of it off and we'll try this again with another paint.

Okay, now here's a little tip... once you launch and fly it for real, and get a glide that you think is good, take some super glue and put a tiny dab in the spot where the trim screw contacts the evevon. The reason is that over time the elastic will loosen and slack. So, you'll have your elevon set where you like it. If needed, you can always crack it loose later.

[Dr.Zooch]

I am now sanding most of the paint off of my external tank and nose cone because the spray paint basically vomited all over it....came out in huge blobs....but I think I have most of it off and we'll try this again with another paint.

I had some Dutchboy clear-coat do that- totally wrecked a Saturn IB.

[NJRick]

I couldn't believe what I saw when that stuff came out.......I did a test on a spare tube and I knew I had to stay pretty far away because of the volume of paint that came out...but I still messed it up anyway when I painted the tank and nose cone. It was like spray painting with a garden hose........I was able to sand almost all of the stuff off of the external tank....there is still some small residual at the the base of part of the nose cone.....you can kinda tell where the paint accumulated a bit...I tried to get most of it off....its acceptable.... but I still hear what your instructions on your rocket kits says...and it is true...it will be eithering moving too fast to be seen or stuck up in a tree somewhere so no one else will see it!! (its nto that bad actually..)

last night I painted the LOX lines and attach points a light tan. ...I have sanded the Flamefins and will glue them to the tube. I hope to hang the SRB's on the ET tonight!! I tell you, cutting the small strips of paper to add to the SRB's really makes them pop! time consuming, but worth the effort!!

this is really a neat kit!!!!! really enjoying this build!!!

I had some Dutchboy clear-coat do that- totally wrecked a Saturn IB.

[Dr.Zooch]

Super! It's the only rocket I've ever flown that gets applause from the other rocketeers when it flies.

This story is probably here someplace, but... It took me several months to work the out the bug that always made the Estes 1284 shuttle tend to go ballistic. Then I needed a test flight and was up against the wall on a parts order for the kit or some such thing- but the monthly MDRA launch was just days away. They got rained out by a tropical storm! So, I scooted over to the NOVAR launch the following weekend, joined the club just so I could do the one launch. They put me on pad #13! But it flew just fine- got applause too. I called my wife and said "IT FLIES just fine!" she said "Good... maybe now you'll start sleeping at night."

[NJRick]

HA! Pad 13 huh??? Wes, if this thing flies...I am going to applaud! (as long as my orbiter doesn't dive on the USS Intrepid....)

what was the deal with the old Estes kit? My recollection of that was that their orbiter was vacuform. I can remember gluing the elevons to a dowel and then hanging an elastic string that went from the dowel into a notch in one the Shuttle engines...at deploy, the elastic would snap out of the notch (supposed to anyways) the airelons would snap from horizontal to "up"...and it would glide back....I did get one flight with her that actually flew and landed. I remember my last two builds back in the day before a 30 year hiatus being the shuttle and the Mars lander....both were hard!!

the SRB's are on!! I am in the home stretch! You did an excellent job with this kit..I can't say enough about it...the instructions are perfect. Hope to paint the flame fins this weekend and do some detail on the Shuttle. will the SME's have an impact on its stability? I haven't hung them yet....the sheet says I might have to add some nose weight. Everything else I feel is built light..I didn't fill the wings or use CA (I was afraid it might warp them) I did use the tile wrap for the bottom of the wings...it was too neat not to use!

Super! It's the only rocket I've ever flown that gets applause from the other rocketeers when it flies.

This story is probably here someplace, but... It took me several months to work the out the bug that always made the Estes 1284 shuttle tend to go ballistic. Then I needed a test flight and was up against the wall on a parts order for the kit or some such thing- but the monthly MDRA launch was just days away. They got rained out by a tropical storm! So, I scooted over to the NOVAR launch the following weekend, joined the club just so I could do the one launch. They put me on pad #13! But it flew just fine- got applause too. I called my wife and said "IT FLIES just fine!" she said "Good... maybe now you'll start sleeping at night."

[Dr.Zooch]

The Estes shuttle had a bad tendency to hgo horizontal off the rod and become a land-shark. Mine did so into a freshly plowed bean field and cartwheeled spreading parts in every direction. Three weeks of work gone in about 3 seconds, July 1977- two months before I went to college and learned about aerodynamics. You'll finde a number of stories about the 1284 that end like mine. Of course, mine ends about a quarter of a century later when I bought another 1284 off ebay and took a good look at it and thought "Hmmmmm, why would this go landshark?" Needless to say- I figured out the problem and engineered an answer.

[Mushtang]

The Estes shuttle had a bad tendency to hgo horizontal off the rod and become a land-shark. Mine did so into a freshly plowed bean field and cartwheeled spreading parts in every direction. Three weeks of work gone in about 3 seconds, July 1977- two months before I went to college and learned about aerodynamics. You'll finde a number of stories about the 1284 that end like mine. Of course, mine ends about a quarter of a century later when I bought another 1284 off ebay and took a good look at it and thought "Hmmmmm, why would this go landshark?" Needless to say- I figured out the problem and engineered an answer.

That's a great story! And yet... I'm feeling a little unsatisfied.

[NJRick]

I am picturing the crash of the that NASA wingless glider that cartwheeled across Edwards runway....I think it was in the openning scene of the $6 million dollar man (OK..I am dating myself here...) After building both, there is no comparison between yours and the old Estes...your is far superior and better thought through.

The Estes shuttle had a bad tendency to hgo horizontal off the rod and become a land-shark. Mine did so into a freshly plowed bean field and cartwheeled spreading parts in every direction. Three weeks of work gone in about 3 seconds, July 1977- two months before I went to college and learned about aerodynamics. You'll finde a number of stories about the 1284 that end like mine. Of course, mine ends about a quarter of a century later when I bought another 1284 off ebay and took a good look at it and thought "Hmmmmm, why would this go landshark?" Needless to say- I figured out the problem and engineered an answer.

[NJRick]

almost finished!

[NJRick]

two more...

[luke strawwalker]

That turned out really nice Rick... I like the highlights on the tank...

Good luck with the flight! OL JR

[NJRick]

thanks Luke!! your build thread was a HUGE help! I have to complete the flamefins and the SSME's and then she's done. I really like how the small paper strips look on the SRB's....they just jump out....takes some time but I thought it was worth the effort!...you even warned in your thread about the nozzel on the Krylon paint...I tried testing it on a spare tube and found I had to stand like 3 feet back....when I went to paint the actual external tank and nose cone...I still screwed it up...the paint came out in huge blobs...so considering I had to sand much of it off and start over, I am pleased with how it turned out. I took a little artistic license on the tank..but I liked the look of the cable tray..added a little color to the tank...

This was really a fun build!!! I can't wait to fly her!

That turned out really nice Rick... I like the highlights on the tank...

Good luck with the flight! OL JR

[NJRick]

OK...we are go for main engine start up here....Wes...what a great kit!

[luke strawwalker]

thanks Luke!! your build thread was a HUGE help! I have to complete the flamefins and the SSME's and then she's done. I really like how the small paper strips look on the SRB's....they just jump out....takes some time but I thought it was worth the effort!...you even warned in your thread about the nozzel on the Krylon paint...I tried testing it on a spare tube and found I had to stand like 3 feet back....when I went to paint the actual external tank and nose cone...I still screwed it up...the paint came out in huge blobs...so considering I had to sand much of it off and start over, I am pleased with how it turned out. I took a little artistic license on the tank..but I liked the look of the cable tray..added a little color to the tank...

This was really a fun build!!! I can't wait to fly her!

Yeah, just one of those things... Krylon USED to be the Cadillac of spray paint... now it's a rusted-out Yugo...

The nozzle is about like a fire hose... the best way I've found to use it is get WAY back, and WHIP the can past it about as fast as you can... I spray paint FAST (high speed strokes past the object I'm painting-- had guys laughing at me in mechanic's school when I was painting parts, but they had to admit it worked... BUT even my "fast" isn't fast enough... I just about have to HURL the can past the rocket while I'm painting to Krylon to go on thin...) don't even THINK about making a second pass in the same spot... give the rocket about 1/10 to 1/8 of a turn between each successive pass...

I like the Valspar paint a LOT better, but their new "twist-n-lock" cap is very nearly as bad as Krylon... Good thing is, for now, I can get Valspar brand paint at Tractor Supply with the old style nozzle, which works well.

Anyway, don't want to start a paint war... nice thing about at ET is, being coated with spray foam, it's SUPPOSED to be a little rough or pebbly (called "dry spray" or "orange peel" in the painting world...) Makes it more realistic... LOL

Later and good luck with your flight! OL JR

[luke strawwalker]

OK...we are go for main engine start up here....Wes...what a great kit!

I like your flame fins! The Merc Atlas was the first time I've done a "fade job" on the flame fins and it just makes them look 150% better! Nice job!
OL JR

[NJRick]

thanks Luke...no paint war with me...I am still learning up here...and thannks for the tip....I was just glad to get a coat down on her....but hey! on the bright side, I am able to paint so I am not complaining...I have kinda converted my garage into a paint room..I am able to use a space heater to get it up to a comfortable temp for the paint not to crack!

Yeah, just one of those things... Krylon USED to be the Cadillac of spray paint... now it's a rusted-out Yugo...

The nozzle is about like a fire hose... the best way I've found to use it is get WAY back, and WHIP the can past it about as fast as you can... I spray paint FAST (high speed strokes past the object I'm painting-- had guys laughing at me in mechanic's school when I was painting parts, but they had to admit it worked... BUT even my "fast" isn't fast enough... I just about have to HURL the can past the rocket while I'm painting to Krylon to go on thin...) don't even THINK about making a second pass in the same spot... give the rocket about 1/10 to 1/8 of a turn between each successive pass...

I like the Valspar paint a LOT better, but their new "twist-n-lock" cap is very nearly as bad as Krylon... Good thing is, for now, I can get Valspar brand paint at Tractor Supply with the old style nozzle, which works well.

Anyway, don't want to start a paint war... nice thing about at ET is, being coated with spray foam, it's SUPPOSED to be a little rough or pebbly (called "dry spray" or "orange peel" in the painting world...) Makes it more realistic... LOL

Later and good luck with your flight! OL JR

[NJRick]

thanks Luke! I keep trying up here....I was pleased how the shuttle came out....now if it would just warm up a bit up here, I can't wait to see if she flies!

I like your flame fins! The Merc Atlas was the first time I've done a "fade job" on the flame fins and it just makes them look 150% better! Nice job!
OL JR

[Giggles]

I have a question for those of you who have experience with the old Estes kit #1284. I am interested in building a scale fleet of historical US rockets. My biggest challenge is I really want them all to be the same scale. At 1/200 "ant scale," the Saturn V is not very impressive, and the Mercury Redstone is TINY. I was planning to base the scale off the 1/162 Estes Space Shuttle kit, but I have concerns after hearing stories about it flying horizontally and crashing, etc. Do any of you have suggestions on how to correct its stability? I'm not quite ready to scratch-build everything, and the shuttle as a PMC would be too heavy to glide. My second option is to get a foam shuttle glider (read indestructible) and construct the tanks to match, then base the other models on that scale. Zooch, you aren't planning any 1/100 scale releases of the shuttle perhaps? Thanks, everyone for your thoughts.

~

Giggles

[luke strawwalker]

thanks Luke! I keep trying up here....I was pleased how the shuttle came out....now if it would just warm up a bit up here, I can't wait to see if she flies!

Don't launch below 53 degrees... LOL

Sorry bad humor...

I think the ZOOCH shuttle is rated for launch in a blizzard, actually... just like Soyuz!!!

Later! OL JR

[luke strawwalker]

I have a question for those of you who have experience with the old Estes kit #1284. I am interested in building a scale fleet of historical US rockets. My biggest challenge is I really want them all to be the same scale. At 1/200 "ant scale," the Saturn V is not very impressive, and the Mercury Redstone is TINY. I was planning to base the scale off the 1/162 Estes Space Shuttle kit, but I have concerns after hearing stories about it flying horizontally and crashing, etc. Do any of you have suggestions on how to correct its stability? I'm not quite ready to scratch-build everything, and the shuttle as a PMC would be too heavy to glide. My second option is to get a foam shuttle glider (read indestructible) and construct the tanks to match, then base the other models on that scale. Zooch, you aren't planning any 1/100 scale releases of the shuttle perhaps? Thanks, everyone for your thoughts.

~

Giggles

Don't want to speak out of turn, but I can tell you this... Dr. Zooch (Wes, his alter ego) does NOT talk about "scales" particularly... everything he produces is "ant-scale", another term for "semi-scale" as we two leg folks might call it (versus his six-legged counterparts in the Class Insecta). If you ask Dr. Zooch about a particular kit's "scale", you will get a humorous answer relating to something akin to "twelve farthings per parsec" or something vague and unintelligible. This is because, unfortunately, there are more than a few folks who, while entirely welcome to be obsessed with scale perfection and 'rivet counting' every little detail on a kit, unfortunately DON'T recognize that the counterpoint is also valid, that a kit doesn't have to be perfect in every regard to be considered 'semi-scale'. For such obsessive-compulsive types, "semi-scale" is a dirty word. SO, to avoid getting into arguments with such folks the good Doctor merely calls his kits "ant-scale" and leaves it at that. (and let's be clear here-- they do some AMAZING work... if you've never seen an internats or even a NARAM level scale competition build, you aught to... the level of detail and work is AMAZING... they're LITERALLY flying museum pieces, and heartbreakingly often come back IN PIECES!) His kits aren't aimed at scale purists looking for exactly 124 corrugations around an interstage or exactly 692 rivets on a particular rocket... though of course one could ADD such things if one desired to... but his kits are built around 1) commonly available tube sizes and easily procured materials (balsa and tubes) with as many "off-the-shelf" parts as possible, with as few "special custom-made" parts as possible (which RAPIDLY drives up kit prices, even in bulk buys from outside sources) and designed to make an excellent flying rocket that won't require months of painstaking work and minute attention to detail and skills honed only through years of experience to construct and finish and fly with good results. IOW, think of them as "introductory" semi-scale rockets... They're all designed for 18mm power (I don't know of any Dr. Zooch rockets that use a "D" motor or if Wes has any plans to release any) and they're made in such a way to keep the price point down in the "very reasonable" range, especially for a semi-scale rocket with lots of detail parts. Heck a 3-4 FNC kit from Estes will usually cost more than a Dr. Zooch kit, which being a semi-scaler has lots more parts and detailing!

I'll take a stab at it and say that if you're waiting for a 1/100 shuttle from Dr. Zooch, you'll be waiting a LONG, LONG time... with a 3.31 inch tube, and given that the shuttle design itself is draggy and large, it would probably require an F motor or cluster of D's or E's at the minimum to get a decent flight. The tube sizes are NOT common, which would require a special production run and bulk buy, which gets expensive... (at least for the ET... IIRC Sandman said in a previous post that a BT-55 is "close enough" for the SRB's depending on what level of scale fidelity you're going for). The ET tank cone (and aft LH2 dome,which would be "required" for an acceptable looking kit at this large a scale) would have to be custom-made, bulk buy parts, and the orbiter would either have to be bulk-buy Guillows foamies or a re-engineered cardstock-n-balsa upscale of the existing Dr. Zooch orbiter glider... (re-engineered because of upscaling material strength issues and flight characteristics, just looking at it at first blush). All these factors contribute to making a VERY expensive kit, and one which might have a rather limited market... which makes it hard to get the return on investment and make a profit.

Your best bet for inside info on Wes's "fixes" on the Estes version would be to PM him (personal message him using the forum software-- click his name on the header of a post and then a box will pop up "send private message" click that and ask away). I doubt he wants to turn this thread into a "fixing yer Estes Shuttle" thread... LOL

Later and good luck! OL JR

PS. I have the BT-60 based "ant-scale" Saturn V, and it's a NICE looking rocket, and impressive in flight... not for its size, necessarily, but that it flies SO NICELY... and with a little work put into it, it can be made to look REALLY nice... http://www.rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?t=4439

[Giggles]

Thanks for your response, Strawwalker. I can see that I still have a lot to learn!

To be clear, I think the Dr. Zooch "semi-scale" kits are AMAZING both in their level of detail and in performance ratings. I'm NOT trying to be a scale Nazi. Really, I just want kits that are close to the same so I can show the different sizes of the rockets to my students. The Dr. Zooch Space Shuttle and Saturn V are very close, but the Mercury Redstone is at a completely different scale, which makes sense considering it is a smaller rocket.

All this came about because I received an Estes Saturn V (the 1/100 version) for X-mas, and now I am intrigued by scale modeling. So now the challenge of finding a Space Shuttle to match or just forget about matching and get whatever rockets perform best. Still not sure what I'm going to do...

[luke strawwalker]

Thanks for your response, Strawwalker. I can see that I still have a lot to learn!

To be clear, I think the Dr. Zooch "semi-scale" kits are AMAZING both in their level of detail and in performance ratings. I'm NOT trying to be a scale Nazi. Really, I just want kits that are close to the same so I can show the different sizes of the rockets to my students. The Dr. Zooch Space Shuttle and Saturn V are very close, but the Mercury Redstone is at a completely different scale, which makes sense considering it is a smaller rocket.

All this came about because I received an Estes Saturn V (the 1/100 version) for X-mas, and now I am intrigued by scale modeling. So now the challenge of finding a Space Shuttle to match or just forget about matching and get whatever rockets perform best. Still not sure what I'm going to do...

Oh, I hear ya... can you tell I've thought about the same thing a few times myself??

Didn't mean to imply *you* were a "scale Nazi" as you put it... ("rivet counter" probably sounds better, even though your term might be more accurate in some cases!) I was just trying to pass on some information that might help you... In fact in the Dr. Zooch Saturn V build thread I posted someone asked the exact question you did, about scale, and got the "77 rods= 1 furlong" response (or whatever) that Wes deflects such arguments with... I've seen some of the arguments myself, and they're NOT pretty... (why didn't you include the gibbet-flibbering port-side rear access hatch on the booster interstage between corrugations 337 and 352?? You just represented it with a hatch outline printed on the wrap... why you COULD have cut it out of cardstock and glued it on to give it depth, but then your location is 1/32 of an inch too high and the gibbet-flibbering hatch is 2% oversize, and between corrugations 332 and 347, which is incorrect" type stuff...) You should have seen the fur flying over the "flame fin haters" who think only CLEAR fins should be in kits! (yeah, clear fins are cool, although Wes doesn't like them, and he makes VALID reasons for why they're a BAD IDEA in a kit you're trying to keep the price affordable on... they require special materials (clear plastics or acetate or whatever, clear tubes (or make your own from clear sheet plastic), and special adhesives, all of which drive up the complexity of the build, getting away from the 'target demographic' of the kits, and drives up price, away from the 'target price' of the kit... PLUS, there's NOTHING that says you can't get stuff from the hobby shop to make your OWN clear-fin units to replace the flame fins... (another project I've been tinkering with). Still the "haters" want to argue incessantly over it.

The Zooch Shuttle and Saturn V aren't really THAT close in size... they both use the 1.637 inch diameter BT-60 for the main kit tube (the S-IC/S-II on Saturn V, and ET on the shuttle) and of course these parts were VERY different diameters on the actual vehicles (396 inches (33 feet) on the Saturn V, and 331 inches (~28.5 feet) on the Shuttle ET. Doing the math, 396/1.637=241.9, or about 1/242 scale for the Saturn V, and 331/1.637=202.19, or about 1/202 scale for the shuttle. Not a huge difference, but big enough!

Thing is with the 1/100 scale, while it makes it VERY easy to scale things (just move the decimal 2 places to the left... IE 396 inch S-IC needs a 3.96 tube in 1/100 scale) it also makes VERY LARGE scale models... the larger the model, the more power it needs to fly, obviously, and the MORE ROOM it takes up IN DISPLAY. Also, the larger the model, the MORE DETAIL it demands to look right. Yes, it's also more impressive, but it's also more expensive, more complex to build, and more risky to fly (that it comes back intact).

That's why I'm doing a scratchbuilt BT-80 based Saturn V that will be the same "ant-scale" as the stock Zooch Saturn I/IB's that I already have (that are themselves in scale with the Zooch Soyuz, which is nice... later I can do a scale Russian Proton or even an Energia/Buran in the same scale if I want to) and I'm also planning to do the "never built" Saturn variants like the C-8 "Nova" rocket (among others) in a nice, convenient scale, that is big enough to look good, but doesn't require "mega-detailing" (super-detailing is enough!) and that won't take up an entire room to display...

A shuttle at this size (roughly 1/158 scale) would use a stock BT-70 tube for the ET, and the boosters would be pretty darn close to a Series 085 tube from Semroc, which is only .024 oversize, which is down in the noise for most purposes (other than NARAM/internats scalers). Still need custom nosecones, but turning your own isn't THAT hard... and CAN be done with a simple electric drill... Of course the orbiter would be a bit more difficult, but tweaking the scale of a paper-model orbiter (I have the super-detailed printout "skins" for the specific orbiters on my hard drive and even managed to rework a copy of them in Paint into Drax's "Moonraker 5" from the Bond film "Moonraker" earlier in this thread, so "upscaling" it to the 1/100 equivalent wouldn't be hard at all... just requires reworking things a bit to get the glide right on the larger orbiter... I've also been toying with the same idea to make a Soviet "Buran". Of course the paper modeling website http://www.papermodelers.com/ also has links to TONS of great cardstock rockets and shuttle models that could be similarly adapted.

Yes, it's a lot of work... but anything worth doing usually is...

Later and good luck! OL JR

[Dr.Zooch]

Zooch, you aren't planning any 1/100 scale releases of the shuttle perhaps? Thanks, everyone for your thoughts.

~

Giggles

Nope

[Zetoyoc]

Nope

I for one am glad.. that would be one BIG ant

-Z

[NJRick]

If I could help..I would...but what you are looking for is way beyond my abilities....sounds like an awesome idea though if you could do it....as for the ol Estes kit...I built that one over 30 years ago..it was the last rocket I flew before heading off to college and not flying them again until this past summer...I remember I really struggled with it...I recall the Estes shuttle was made of vacuform...I think I flew mine one time..I actually started it before the first shuttle launch...lost interest in it...then watched the actual shuttle go up for the first time on TV...and brought it back out and worked to finish her....it did not go balistic and I was able to get her to glide..but I think Dr. Zooch's kit has much better detail and the build was much more straight forward and better thought out. I think the Zooch has more detail as well. I can't wait to fly mine!

I have a question for those of you who have experience with the old Estes kit #1284. I am interested in building a scale fleet of historical US rockets. My biggest challenge is I really want them all to be the same scale. At 1/200 "ant scale," the Saturn V is not very impressive, and the Mercury Redstone is TINY. I was planning to base the scale off the 1/162 Estes Space Shuttle kit, but I have concerns after hearing stories about it flying horizontally and crashing, etc. Do any of you have suggestions on how to correct its stability? I'm not quite ready to scratch-build everything, and the shuttle as a PMC would be too heavy to glide. My second option is to get a foam shuttle glider (read indestructible) and construct the tanks to match, then base the other models on that scale. Zooch, you aren't planning any 1/100 scale releases of the shuttle perhaps? Thanks, everyone for your thoughts.

~

Giggles

[NJRick]

sorry for the bump.....but I was finally able to get my Shuttle on the pad...I tried one flight back in March and on the ascent, I think the rudder was loosened.....the Shuttle simply rolled all the way back down because the rudder was flapping around.....easy fix...and waited several months for light wind conditions....this evening I managed to get her back on the pad and she flew!!! I used a B6-2....Shuttle deployed and snap rolled about 4 times during a dive and then, as if John Young took over the controls...suddenly leveled off and glided in a gentle circle around the booster and landed perfectly!! .....I think a C6-3 would be an ideal engine for this bird.

[luke strawwalker]

sorry for the bump.....but I was finally able to get my Shuttle on the pad...I tried one flight back in March and on the ascent, I think the rudder was loosened.....the Shuttle simply rolled all the way back down because the rudder was flapping around.....easy fix...and waited several months for light wind conditions....this evening I managed to get her back on the pad and she flew!!! I used a B6-2....Shuttle deployed and snap rolled about 4 times during a dive and then, as if John Young took over the controls...suddenly leveled off and glided in a gentle circle around the booster and landed perfectly!! .....I think a C6-3 would be an ideal engine for this bird.

WAY cool!!! Sounds like a neat flight!

The rudder busted loose on my orbiter before the first flight as well... had to return to the shop to glue it back... just sorta keeled over when I bumped it, didn't fall completely off...

Later! OL JR

[JStarStar]

sorry for the bump.....but I was finally able to get my Shuttle on the pad...I tried one flight back in March and on the ascent, I think the rudder was loosened.....the Shuttle simply rolled all the way back down because the rudder was flapping around.....easy fix...and waited several months for light wind conditions....this evening I managed to get her back on the pad and she flew!!! I used a B6-2....Shuttle deployed and snap rolled about 4 times during a dive and then, as if John Young took over the controls...suddenly leveled off and glided in a gentle circle around the booster and landed perfectly!! .....I think a C6-3 would be an ideal engine for this bird.

Sounds like a replay of "Space Cowboys."

"What do you say we just drop the nose?"