Pm sent.
Eggtimer TRS - Dual-Deployment Controller with GPS/RF Tracking
- Thread starter cerving
- Start date
Help Support The Rocketry Forum:
KenRico
'Just the Tip'
- Joined
- May 31, 2011
- Messages
- 2,744
- Reaction score
- 56
Whatever you do..don't put this in the Pimp Child.. as it MUST only be flown WITHOUT any tracking - when it launches you close your eyes even....
Kenny
Built the TRS in a marathon session Saturday. Didn't lose any of the "grain of rice" SMT resistors or capacitors.
One needs a head magnifier and definitely solder wick.
The EggFinder part tested out just fine so I did the other components and Atmel chip. Tried to connect via USB and
hit a dead end. I resoldered some of the joints, emailed Cris and he figured out my problem.
The serial connections on the board are miss-labelled. With the regular Egg Timer, the white wire goes to TX, the green wire goes to RX and black goes to ground. With the TRS, the board labeling is backwards, white goes to RX and green goes to TX.
Stupidhead here tried that late last night but Stupidhead failed to gather that the unit beeps for thirty seconds looking for the EggFinder LCD receiver. After the 30 seconds one can hit return in their terminal program. I went back to the
"wrong" cable connections this morning and waited 30 seconds with a variety of computers. I had emailed Cris and he discovered the discrepancy and emailed me. I did the switch and my unit connected up just fine via the USB cable.
He also emailed the 1.4L firmware. My experience with flashing that was perfect. I just changed the port speed to 115200, put the jumper on the reset terminals and used an editor to put the correct COMM port in the batfile.
AVRdude flashed it first try! Success! Kurt :blush:
One needs a head magnifier and definitely solder wick.
The EggFinder part tested out just fine so I did the other components and Atmel chip. Tried to connect via USB and
hit a dead end. I resoldered some of the joints, emailed Cris and he figured out my problem.
The serial connections on the board are miss-labelled. With the regular Egg Timer, the white wire goes to TX, the green wire goes to RX and black goes to ground. With the TRS, the board labeling is backwards, white goes to RX and green goes to TX.
Stupidhead here tried that late last night but Stupidhead failed to gather that the unit beeps for thirty seconds looking for the EggFinder LCD receiver. After the 30 seconds one can hit return in their terminal program. I went back to the
"wrong" cable connections this morning and waited 30 seconds with a variety of computers. I had emailed Cris and he discovered the discrepancy and emailed me. I did the switch and my unit connected up just fine via the USB cable.
He also emailed the 1.4L firmware. My experience with flashing that was perfect. I just changed the port speed to 115200, put the jumper on the reset terminals and used an editor to put the correct COMM port in the batfile.
AVRdude flashed it first try! Success! Kurt :blush:
- Joined
- Feb 3, 2012
- Messages
- 6,335
- Reaction score
- 5,520
For the benefit of those who have already received their Eggtimer TRS's from the Black Friday Week sale (the rest are coming this week...), there is a mistake in the User's Guide... the connection from the 3-pin serial connector to the USB cable are incorrect. I have already posted updated documentation, but the pinouts should be: Cable-Black to TRS-GND; Cable-White to TRS-RX; Cable-Green to TRS-TX.
Here's a shot of the completed project. That antenna was for testing purposes:
Kurt
Kurt
conman13
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Sep 18, 2013
- Messages
- 2,703
- Reaction score
- 77
Man that looks really nice! Cant wait to get the ones I'm assembling
If I was going to be doing a bunch of these, I'd try to come up with an SMT soldering jig. Google these three words and you'll get some pictures.
I didn't have a good smooth tweezers and very carefully used two toothpicks to manipulate the "grain of rice" parts. I don't recommend it to neophytes. Get the tiny tipped tweezers but I was used to building some SMT projects like this a long time ago. If one catches a raised pad on
the board with the component while manipulating it, "flick" and it's gone!. It took about 8 hours and I did it in a clear glass casserole pyrex dish with sides. Didn't lose anything but that's because I went very sloooooow with the tiny SMT stuff.
I will say it pays to be careful but when I thought I had a problem with the serial connection, (before I realized it took 30 to 45 seconds before the EF TRS can even recognize the USB device and that the green and white connecting wires are reverse as compared to the Egg Timer),
I re-hit the board with the 25 watt soldering pen at all the Atmel pins and the NOR gate. Also "cleaned up" some of the accessible pads.
ie. even if I didn't see a short on magnification. If there was a "little peak" in the solder, I tried to melt it down and make it "look better".
Turns out all that was unneeded as all I would had to have done was switch the the green and white wires of the USB cable and wait 30 to 45 seconds before the TRS can be read from the terminal program. So it shows that the stuff is resilent. Kurt
conman13
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Sep 18, 2013
- Messages
- 2,703
- Reaction score
- 77
thanks I should be fine though. I assembled Derek's mini tracker together which was all small smt parts that are a 1/4 the size of these smt parts. It may still be smart time wise though to come up with a Jig. I will look into it.
https://www.rocketryforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=247063&d=1416508280
If one doesn't get the wire terminals from Cris, here's what they look like: https://www.ebay.com/itm/10pcs-Scre...285?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c7a207825
I like them because I can inspect the wires easily and also replace the end easily. If the wires are direct soldered to the board and one
isn't careful, they can eventually snap off at an inopportune moment. Especially with routine handling. Eventially, the soldered wire will break and if that occurs during the flight with the battery, one is sunk. Kurt
Some quick observations of the EggTimer TRS.
When in standby mode. (SAVE and FLY etc.) The 1S light will show GPS packets being received by the TRS. The HOPE module will not show any transmit activity. Hence, if one has an Android device paired with the EggFinder LCD, they will not see any position packets coming across any of the Android utilities in spite of the flashing 1S indication. Now the EggFinder LCD will be in the SAVE and FLY or CHECK STATUS mode if you've selected that. Once you push the button for launch, the device will begin displaying and streaming the packets to your Android device if paired and activate for flying. When it does this, the altitude will go to zero (0) and instead of GPS altitude, the baro altitude is streamed with 0 being field elevation and the indication is a direct read above ground level. Kind of nice, you get to see what the altimeter is reading which is likely a bit more accurate than the GPS altitude from the Maestro SIRF GPS. Also, there is a DM in the upper right that is continuity on the Drogue and Main channels. I believe when they fire, the indication changes.
One caution: If you have a switch on the pyro battery and have it switched off, DO NOT do a CHECK STATUS as the EF will halt as a falt to prevent flying without the pyro battery on. In that case you have to shut the device down and recycle. If you don't have an external power switch on the TRS (which could be in a small minimum diameter setup)
you'll have to open up the ebay to disconnect/reconnect the battery.
One other thing. If you push the EF LCD button to fly and the device doesn't do anything, wait. You can try pushing it again. If there isn't a good GPS lock the TRS will wait until is has one then activate to fly. If the FLY command is accepted, there is a quick beep you might miss. If there's a lock, the flight activation occurs quickly, if not there will be a bit of a delay. Nonetheless, the TRS "ready to fly" beep is loud and hideously effective in giving aural indication that the TRS is ready to go plus the screen on the LCD will be in the flight mode with number of satellites in view, the pyro channel continuity and readiness to display the baro altitude along with the obligatory lat/long.
The tone of the beep changes when the device goes from GPS altitude to Baro altitude. You'll hear it when you test it out.
This is a device that begs to be bench tested and it's a lot of fun to do so. One can put LEDs on the pyro channels.
the +/- is simply reverse from the pyro and main battery terminals ie. + is on the right and - is on the left. You have any LEDs lying around they can sub for ematches. Long lead in the + side. You'll notice a slight glow at all times with a pyro battery connected. It will need to be switched if prepping way in advance as an unswitched pyro battery will be drained over time.
A little additional information. If tracking the TRS with the Android app GPS Rocket Locator or another GPS mapping program, the altitude display on the Android device or laptop screen is likely going to be the GPS altitude from the Maestro Sirf module since those programs parse the GPS packet for the altitude information. I believe the Egg Finder LCD firmware decodes the additional information in the position packet that reflects the baro altitude and passes on the GPS information via the B/T link to any connected device. Any attached program like YAAC, Xastir, UIView or MapSphere probably disregard the baro altitude and just read the GPS information from the NMEA sentences.
Kurt
When in standby mode. (SAVE and FLY etc.) The 1S light will show GPS packets being received by the TRS. The HOPE module will not show any transmit activity. Hence, if one has an Android device paired with the EggFinder LCD, they will not see any position packets coming across any of the Android utilities in spite of the flashing 1S indication. Now the EggFinder LCD will be in the SAVE and FLY or CHECK STATUS mode if you've selected that. Once you push the button for launch, the device will begin displaying and streaming the packets to your Android device if paired and activate for flying. When it does this, the altitude will go to zero (0) and instead of GPS altitude, the baro altitude is streamed with 0 being field elevation and the indication is a direct read above ground level. Kind of nice, you get to see what the altimeter is reading which is likely a bit more accurate than the GPS altitude from the Maestro SIRF GPS. Also, there is a DM in the upper right that is continuity on the Drogue and Main channels. I believe when they fire, the indication changes.
One caution: If you have a switch on the pyro battery and have it switched off, DO NOT do a CHECK STATUS as the EF will halt as a falt to prevent flying without the pyro battery on. In that case you have to shut the device down and recycle. If you don't have an external power switch on the TRS (which could be in a small minimum diameter setup)
you'll have to open up the ebay to disconnect/reconnect the battery.
One other thing. If you push the EF LCD button to fly and the device doesn't do anything, wait. You can try pushing it again. If there isn't a good GPS lock the TRS will wait until is has one then activate to fly. If the FLY command is accepted, there is a quick beep you might miss. If there's a lock, the flight activation occurs quickly, if not there will be a bit of a delay. Nonetheless, the TRS "ready to fly" beep is loud and hideously effective in giving aural indication that the TRS is ready to go plus the screen on the LCD will be in the flight mode with number of satellites in view, the pyro channel continuity and readiness to display the baro altitude along with the obligatory lat/long.
The tone of the beep changes when the device goes from GPS altitude to Baro altitude. You'll hear it when you test it out.
This is a device that begs to be bench tested and it's a lot of fun to do so. One can put LEDs on the pyro channels.
the +/- is simply reverse from the pyro and main battery terminals ie. + is on the right and - is on the left. You have any LEDs lying around they can sub for ematches. Long lead in the + side. You'll notice a slight glow at all times with a pyro battery connected. It will need to be switched if prepping way in advance as an unswitched pyro battery will be drained over time.
A little additional information. If tracking the TRS with the Android app GPS Rocket Locator or another GPS mapping program, the altitude display on the Android device or laptop screen is likely going to be the GPS altitude from the Maestro Sirf module since those programs parse the GPS packet for the altitude information. I believe the Egg Finder LCD firmware decodes the additional information in the position packet that reflects the baro altitude and passes on the GPS information via the B/T link to any connected device. Any attached program like YAAC, Xastir, UIView or MapSphere probably disregard the baro altitude and just read the GPS information from the NMEA sentences.
Kurt
Last edited:
- Joined
- Feb 3, 2012
- Messages
- 6,335
- Reaction score
- 5,520
The baro altitude and the deployment status are sent at the end of the NMEA data stream, the LCD receiver knows how to decode it. Your Android navigation app is just going to think it's noise and ignore it; I've tested it with a few of them with no problems. Synchronizing the baro data (which is sampled synchronously 20x/sec) with the NMEA data stream (which is basically asynchronous) was one of the more interesting design challenges in the TRS hardware and firmware.
Last edited:
Interesting, I noticed that with the EggFinder. Beep, beep, beep pretty regularly with a double beep every 5 seconds as long as there is a lock.
With the TRS, the beep of course changes tone when the baro side is locked and if I'm not mistaken, just a slight disparity in the duration between the reporting beeps. Makes sense then synchonous/asynchronous. Obviously can tell by aural tone that the baro altitude is being received even if one doesn't look at the display right away. Kurt
With the TRS, the beep of course changes tone when the baro side is locked and if I'm not mistaken, just a slight disparity in the duration between the reporting beeps. Makes sense then synchonous/asynchronous. Obviously can tell by aural tone that the baro altitude is being received even if one doesn't look at the display right away. Kurt
NorthwoodsRockets
Well-Known Member
Hi Folks,
Here's a neophyte question. I've been using a temperature between about 600 and 650 F or about 315 to 345 C. Is that too hot?
Thanks,
Matt
Here's a neophyte question. I've been using a temperature between about 600 and 650 F or about 315 to 345 C. Is that too hot?
Thanks,
Matt
- Joined
- Feb 3, 2012
- Messages
- 6,335
- Reaction score
- 5,520
Nope, that's just fine according to Kester.
NorthwoodsRockets
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the reply Chris,
Here's another basic question. I can't tell from the Assembly Manual if you are recommending using additional flux or not. Might it cause more issues than it resolves. I can imagine increased flow could lead to increased bridging. I built the basic Eggfinder without it, for whatever that means.
Thanks,
Matt
Here's another basic question. I can't tell from the Assembly Manual if you are recommending using additional flux or not. Might it cause more issues than it resolves. I can imagine increased flow could lead to increased bridging. I built the basic Eggfinder without it, for whatever that means.
Thanks,
Matt
- Joined
- Feb 3, 2012
- Messages
- 6,335
- Reaction score
- 5,520
I would NOT use additional flux unless you are experienced with using it to solder SMT parts. If you've already built a working Eggfinder TX, then you already have the technique down pat.
Did some more bench work with the system. For fun, had the EggTimer TRS out in the garage with the LCD receiver
and had a "faceless" B/T EggFinder receiver in the basement paired to a laptop for use with Xastir. Dang, wished Xastir was easier for folks to use. Was able to apply the script: https://www.ece.uah.edu/~jdw/rockets/gps2aprs.txt in a plain terminal after clicking on "Enable Server Ports" under the "Interface" pull down at the top.
With the LCD one can have the baro altitude to monitor and the Xastir program records the GPS altitude.
With that .pl script running in the background it might be possible to record that incoming data to a file but that may be moot since one can download it from the device from its memory.
I had the gps2aprs.pl script (had to change.txt to .pl and edit) running and the position of the TRS came in as KC9LDH-6
The color circle means that Xastir is tracking and recording all the position packets to a .kml file and a file that Xastir can use to redraw the positions later. One can use some pulldown menus by clicking on the rocket/station and see
the packets that are already stored.
So, if one knows a linux ham radio type, there is an ability to record and save the flight. One can use the program for recording EggFinder/TRS flights without being a ham like I said, I wished it was easier. The .kml file is stored /.xastir/tracklogs.
A workable scenario would be to have the laptop/receiver locked in one's vehicle with an omni mag mount antenna on the roof and hand carry the EggFinder LCD to go after the TRS once the rocket is down. In this way one can have a means to record a flight if they so desire.
Kurt
and had a "faceless" B/T EggFinder receiver in the basement paired to a laptop for use with Xastir. Dang, wished Xastir was easier for folks to use. Was able to apply the script: https://www.ece.uah.edu/~jdw/rockets/gps2aprs.txt in a plain terminal after clicking on "Enable Server Ports" under the "Interface" pull down at the top.
With the LCD one can have the baro altitude to monitor and the Xastir program records the GPS altitude.
With that .pl script running in the background it might be possible to record that incoming data to a file but that may be moot since one can download it from the device from its memory.
I had the gps2aprs.pl script (had to change.txt to .pl and edit) running and the position of the TRS came in as KC9LDH-6
The color circle means that Xastir is tracking and recording all the position packets to a .kml file and a file that Xastir can use to redraw the positions later. One can use some pulldown menus by clicking on the rocket/station and see
the packets that are already stored.
So, if one knows a linux ham radio type, there is an ability to record and save the flight. One can use the program for recording EggFinder/TRS flights without being a ham like I said, I wished it was easier. The .kml file is stored /.xastir/tracklogs.
A workable scenario would be to have the laptop/receiver locked in one's vehicle with an omni mag mount antenna on the roof and hand carry the EggFinder LCD to go after the TRS once the rocket is down. In this way one can have a means to record a flight if they so desire.
Kurt
jus_rockets
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jan 9, 2012
- Messages
- 1,218
- Reaction score
- 12
I just got done flashing the LCD Rx and tested the TRS. I hope to fly it next Saturday, can't wait :grin:
JDcluster
Well-Known Member
I flew mine yesterday for the first time!
Worked like a charm!
The Rocket Locator App does what it says.
It feels like cheating when you know the altitude before you even get to the rocket
Mine went 4285 ft according to the TRS.
The RRC2+ said 4,177 ft.
The TRS was just there for tracking testing purposes mounted in the NC with the rubber ducky antenna mounted on the NC bulkplate facing downward.
JD
Worked like a charm!
The Rocket Locator App does what it says.
It feels like cheating when you know the altitude before you even get to the rocket
Mine went 4285 ft according to the TRS.
The RRC2+ said 4,177 ft.
The TRS was just there for tracking testing purposes mounted in the NC with the rubber ducky antenna mounted on the NC bulkplate facing downward.
JD
Nice collection!!! I don't feel so bad about the number of trackers I have now. Gotta wait for the weather to break so I can put mine to use. Kurt
jus_rockets
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jan 9, 2012
- Messages
- 1,218
- Reaction score
- 12
Thanks! I actually really enjoy assembling them. I did not have a chance this weekend to fly the TRS but it will fly next month for sure.
Here is my nosecone setup that I am working on. A centering ring with two #8 pem nuts is epoxied on top of the NC coupler and two all-threads will run from the CR to the base of the coupler. The top of the sled will not have any all-thread running thru it so no metal can attenuate the RF signal.
Nice setup. Looks like you had enough room you could have used a single battery of 850mah or more to power the unit and the pyro circuit. I sometimes look at the battery as nose weight. If one needs noseweight for W/B might as well add something that can do some "useful" work. Kurt
Kurt
JDcluster
Well-Known Member
I'm using a 2S 1000 mah battery to power the computer side of the TRS.
GPS units are notorious for consuming battery life.
I ran the antenna out the bottom through the bulkhead.
I also packed foam on both sides of the mounting plate.
JD
GPS units are notorious for consuming battery life.
I ran the antenna out the bottom through the bulkhead.
I also packed foam on both sides of the mounting plate.
JD
I really like this design! I was thinking of ways of building a glue-less nosecone a la the sticky Jart thread for my 3" FG Adventurer 3, but didn't love the idea of threaded rod running up through the center. This is an elegant way around that, but I can't quite make out how the sled is attached to the pem nuts? I imagine there's a bulkhead plate, through which the two rods run, and engage the sled with batteries and switches?
RocketHunter
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jun 15, 2013
- Messages
- 390
- Reaction score
- 3
So I've been trying to get my TRS unit set up. It connects to the LCD perfectly, and everything seems to be working like it should.
Next, I went to try to program it with the USB cable. I downloaded all the requisite programs, plugged the TRS unit in, and turned it on. I get the 45 seconds of slow beeping, then the Flight Settings screen. I hit Ctrl-Y, and successfully got through the master reset.
After restarting it, and going through the 45 seconds of beeping, the Flight Settings screen shows up, but I don't get the 30 seconds of fast beeping anymore; instead, it goes right to 1 second long beeps, and hitting enter does nothing and I can't change any of the settings. I verified with the LCD that the battery had sufficient voltage as it almost seems like a low battery fault, and no matter how many times I retry it I get the same outcome, with it even unresponsive to doing a master reset again.
Any ideas as to what is going on? I'm stumped.
Next, I went to try to program it with the USB cable. I downloaded all the requisite programs, plugged the TRS unit in, and turned it on. I get the 45 seconds of slow beeping, then the Flight Settings screen. I hit Ctrl-Y, and successfully got through the master reset.
After restarting it, and going through the 45 seconds of beeping, the Flight Settings screen shows up, but I don't get the 30 seconds of fast beeping anymore; instead, it goes right to 1 second long beeps, and hitting enter does nothing and I can't change any of the settings. I verified with the LCD that the battery had sufficient voltage as it almost seems like a low battery fault, and no matter how many times I retry it I get the same outcome, with it even unresponsive to doing a master reset again.
Any ideas as to what is going on? I'm stumped.
jus_rockets
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jan 9, 2012
- Messages
- 1,218
- Reaction score
- 12
Thanks! I should be able to get everything wired tonight.
Nice setup. Looks like you had enough room you could have used a single battery of 850mah or more to power the unit and the pyro circuit. I sometimes look at the battery as nose weight. If one needs noseweight for W/B might as well add something that can do some "useful" work.
Thanks! There is plenty of room for even another altimeter.
Thanks for the suggestion I will change the computer side battery to a 800mah lipo.
Here are some more pics of the setup.
Man, nice setup to avoid the "parallel all-thread" to the antenna problem! No metal interference here.:gavel::grin: Kurt
- Joined
- Feb 3, 2012
- Messages
- 6,335
- Reaction score
- 5,520
Our Groundhog Day sale is still going on... ends Feb 5th.
o Eggtimer Flight Computers - $30 (regular $35)
o Eggfinder TX GPS Tracker - $60 (regular $70)
o Eggtimer TRS Flight Computer/GPS Tracker: $74 (regular $90)
o Eggfinder Starter Set (TX & RX): $80
o Eggfinder LCD Starter Set (TX & LCD): $110
o Eggtimer TRS Starter Set (TRS & LCD): $125
Cris Erving
Eggtimer Rocketry
www.eggtimerrocketry.com
o Eggtimer Flight Computers - $30 (regular $35)
o Eggfinder TX GPS Tracker - $60 (regular $70)
o Eggtimer TRS Flight Computer/GPS Tracker: $74 (regular $90)
o Eggfinder Starter Set (TX & RX): $80
o Eggfinder LCD Starter Set (TX & LCD): $110
o Eggtimer TRS Starter Set (TRS & LCD): $125
Cris Erving
Eggtimer Rocketry
www.eggtimerrocketry.com
Similar threads
