Micro Maxx rockets from Quest

On a whim last week I ordered the Raw Fusion/Vector 1 MM starter set and the 24 pack motor deal I figured that I have a small park near my house to fly them in.Well They are a blast to launch but they have a very short life span one blew the fin can off on its second flight and the other one has lawn darted a couple times to the point of bending the BT.The good part about it though was Quest threw in all the other micros for free on the deal so I pretty much have them all I flew the tomahawk today but the plastic body seperated and is gonna need to be glued back togther.Now I think its time to buy some real MM models to launch I am figuring on a Fliskits Honest John for starters will that be able to launch off the Quest launch silo or should I make up an adapter to use it on another pad?I have to say though the piston recovery doesn't work so good only once did the streamer actaully come out and slow them down.Was good fun though I am gonna buy more for sure.
Andy

Andy:
the easiest way to make the old silo launcher work for any model you like is to put a 1/4" Z bend in the rod 1/2" from the bottom. Sort of like the rods in the pic below. this allows the rod to be swiveled around allowing models up to BT-50 to sit down on the igniter.

You can make or use just about any launch controller you have using standard micro clips. I use twisted 18ga stranded copper wire to form a support clip that allows any size model to be flown by simply moving the ckips with igniter around to fit into the motor without using a Z bent rod. same effect second photo.

I do suggest changing to a 12volt system over the 9volt battery which don't hold up very long at all.

A few suggestions:

Definitely order some of the micromax kits from Fliskits - they are incredible! While you're at it, order a 3pack of BT-2+ (mmx motor) tubes, some centering rings and some nose cones.

As for launching, get a length of music wire about the same diameter as the launch rod from your silo. You can cut it to about 1.5 to 2 feet long (mmx doesn't need as long a rod). Then mount it in a piece of 1/8" tubing (plastic, brass - doesn't matter. Now you can put the launch rod in a standard launcher. As for igniters, pry some of the mmx igniters apart and toss the black plastic part. You can use the end of a toothpick for an igniter plug and use your regular launch system to light these bad boys off (they do work better with at 4 AA batteries - C, D or even 12v is even better).

Adapt the Estes Quark and 220 Swift to mmx with a mmx motor mount (that's why you want some tubing and centering rings from Flis) or build a mmx motor adapter. If you fly these rockets with permanent mounts, I suggest attaching the nose cones with a shock cord and adding a small streamer (teflon plumber's tape works great and won't melt like mylar will).

Check out this thread:

https://www.rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?t=6398

for some ideas on building some nifty downscales of various rockets for micromax. I've built BT-5 versions of the Alpha, Red Max, and Cherokee D with mmx mounts and they fly great! In that thread, I uploaded some paper wraps that you can print out on your printer using semi-gloss paper. Using them for the body tube and fins, you only have to paint the nose cone.

Have fun - MMX models are great fun for tiny fields (you can even launch them in your backyard if you don't have too many trees!)

Someone forgot to mention something.



Allow me:

https://groups.yahoo.com/group/MicroMaxRockets/

I'm still on the fence about MM and wether I should try a set.
Whats the max altitude of them? Can they be flown safely in a front yard?

I've flown the FlisKits Honest John and a scratch-built Big Bertha microClone. I'm not sure about the exact altitude, but they leave the pad in a hurry, and because of their diminutive size, they appear to reach impressive altitudes. The Quest prebuilt MMX rockets are known as LPB- Little Plastic Bricks - for good reason. Go with FlisKits Micros.

MMX are a BLAST to build and fly, and relatively inexpensive. I'm hooked and rapidly expanding my fleet. And if Micromeister doesn't stop posting photos, my brain will explode from overstimulation.

Our Micro to the MAXX kits are true model rocket *kits*, with the same types of raw materials you'd expect to see in any convention model rocket kit. Balsa cones and adapters, paper tubes and lugs, fiber centering rings, balsa or basswood fins (some laser cut, some not), etc. Good stuff

Our motor tube sized tube is the BT-2.5 (equiv to the BT-2+). Do NOT confuse this with our BT-2 tube (this tube is too small to be used as a motor tube)

Also, for converting conventional model to micro power you can look at our full line of micro motor mounts.

To see our full array of kits and parts start on our site and click PRODUCTS then MICROMAXX. You will see a sub menu for Kits, Body Tube, Nose Cones, etc.

I can't speak for the Quest micromaxx models (or any others for that matter), but our models will fly anywhere from 70 feet to over 150 feet. It doesn't sound like much, but set one of these down and walk 150 feet away and you'll appreciate what folks have been talking about And, as many have said, they get off the pad in a hurry! I recommend that you get back 30 or more feet to watch the launch. Much easier to track to apogee that way.

Have fun!

What stores, other than mail order, carry the Micro Maxx line? My local hobby shops don't have it.

For the Record the Offical NAR 1/8A Altitude and 2x1/8A Cluster Altitude records both stand at 82m (269feet). These records are really limited more by the .89sec avg delay in MMX-II motors then attainable altitude as we've had several over 300 foot tracked and closed flights on the longer delay older MMX-I motors at sport flying events.

Some HEAVY 17 to 19 grams models may only get 15 to 20 feet. while the average micro model in the 7 to 14 gram range as Jim mentioned can achieve easily 70 to 150 feet. 1 - 7 gram models the sky is truely the limit, restricted by that darn short delay!

Gliders, chutes and streamer models can have very long flights some in the are for sereral minutes, Chute duration I believe is 255 seconds, streamer about 78 seconds.
Micro helicopter durations stands currently at 64 seconds.

Remember If your are currently flying a type of model rocket, IT is and can be done with micros. Our biggest limitaton as mentioned is ONE currently certified motor with a "Listed" 1 sec delay. tho in practice it's normally a good bit under a second, and no booster motor as such.
We can and do Stage and cluster micros, add electronice payloads, Nite flight illumination and even have micro altimiters and RC BG and RG working. the field is only limited by our imaginations.
clustered Nite models put out some pretty good smoke and fire as well if that's what your looking for This is a BT-20 size micro......Sorry Greylensman

Fliskits, MicroClassics, ASP, and a few other on-line manufacturers carrry Kit's,
currently only Quest direct, or better Fliskit are selling and shipping micro motors. tho you may still find a few on-line hobby shops with "some" motors. BE AWARE #5662 are the older .20Ns 1.07sec delay MMX-1 motors, while 5663 is the newer Grey cardboard casing .31Ns .89sec delay Current motor.
If you can get both...do it; they are both great little motors

Even some of Quests original RTF Little Plastic Brick (LPB's) models can be made to fly pretty darn high with a little added this or take off some of that. I use a few of the raw fusion, Vector, and other straight LPB's as test models. I've replaced all the streamers and piston plugs with Kevlar shocklines and teflon streamers. a little tape over the twistlock ensures they stay together at seperation.

You can actually make the foil streamers work by talc babypowedering them and folding them by halfs until it only wraps once around the piston stem if you don't want to mess with altering the inside of the models.

Adding small clear package material just above the LPB Saturn-V corrects the stability of the model making it a bit more fun to fly. Not much helps the tiny shuttle but a tad of nose weight does make it wobble it's way a bit more in the UP direction
Hoep these little tid bits help

shreadvector said:

Someone forgot to mention something.



Allow me:

https://groups.yahoo.com/group/MicroMaxRockets/

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Yup signed up for that last night lots of good reading over there .Definitely going to get some Fliskits kits and alot of building supplies for sure will make a nice xmas gift to myself.I am hooked on them for sure now because if only a couple block walk to the park from my house.
Andy

Oh and thanks for the tips they will be put to good use.

Micromeister said:

Even some of Quests original RTF Little Plastic Brick (LPB's) models can be made to fly pretty darn high with a little added this or take off some of that. I use a few of the raw fusion, Vector, and other straight LPB's as test models. I've replaced all the streamers and piston plugs with Kevlar shocklines and teflon streamers. a little tape over the twistlock ensures they stay together at seperation.

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Tom Lyons flew a handful of the LPBs at our last Vikings launch. If any of 'em hit 20 feet, I'd be surprised. He flew those mostly for some very young kids.

I have to say, recently here on TRF there's been an upswing in MMX comments and such. I think members like Micromeister and vendors like Jim are really helping this portion of the hobby grow by leaps and bounds. Thanks!

We're sure HOPING this aspect of the hobby takes off Greylenman!
Particually here on the eastcoast where flying space is getting so darn hard to come by. I just love the fact I can walk across the street to a tiny little 75-100 foot wide park and fly some rockets, right under the glide path for National Airport and get them back to fly again I couln't even do that with 1/4A mosquitos, Quirks and Birdie's.

It is my profound pleasure to be able in my small way to promote and further the advancement of this particular phase of the hobby i've grown to love over the past 40 some years. My Thanks goes out to Bill Stine and Jim Flis for committing the resources to bring these fantastic little motors and models to our market

I'm not sure which of the LPB's Tom was flying but most of the 3f&N rtf's get anywhere from 60 to 80 feet easily without alteration and a bit higher if you knock out some of the dead weight, Raw Fusion, Vector, Critical Mass come to mind and maybe the Tomahawk CM fit that bill, Also the altered fin "Stable" Satrun-V LPB gets about 30-40 feet.
Not huge altitudes but great fun! I've said many times out-of-sight is out of sight, be it 30, 300 or 30,000 feet The main difference is weather you have any chance of getting them back to fly again.

So far the only LPB's i have flown are the vector 1 and raw fusion and for plastic weights they flew pretty good till the lawn darted a few times and bent the BT's and the tomahawk flys pretty good too those are the only ones I have tried to fly so far.I just got back from the hobby shop with a 220 swift and a quark for a couple mmx conversions just need to order some parts from Fliskits .

Just ordered myself some bt5 motor mounts and a mini tog for myself from flis kits just need to get a bit of streamer material I saw that someone suggested plumbers tape for a streamer I will have to hit the hardware store.

luv2launch said:

Just ordered myself some bt5 motor mounts and a mini tog for myself from flis kits just need to get a bit of streamer material I saw that someone suggested plumbers tape for a streamer I will have to hit the hardware store.

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Standard White Teflon Plumbers tape works fine, but if you can get military grade from one of the industrial supply companies, you can get it in a range of widths up to 2" wide and several muted colors, Red, Orange, yellow, Green. What makes it worth while buying is it is just about double in thickness making for much easier handleing. it's is heavier but not much
I get mine in 43foot rolls from McMaster-Carr but I've seen it thru several other sources.

You can also make Teflon permanent wadding pom-poms with both types for used in larger models
Hope this helps a bit

What John said... but don't forget to powder teflon streamers - teflon plumber's tape likes to stick to itself. Oh, and I've found 1/2" teflon tape in pink and yellow at Lowes - I think yellow is designated for gas lines (but it flies just fine anyhow! )

Micromeister said:

I'm not sure which of the LPB's Tom was flying but most of the 3f&N rtf's get anywhere from 60 to 80 feet easily...

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He was just popping open some packages he had on hand. I admit that I'm not great with guesstimating altitude, but they didn't seem to climb that high to me. In fact a couple of them barely cleared the launch rod- the saucer comes to mind, but I think also the Saturn V as well.

Thank you for your comments about FlisKits involvement in the micro movement I have always been fascinated by these little guys but never really got into them as I have been a scratch builder for over 25 years now and I just couldn't find the parts to allow me to do so in the micro world.

After a fashion, I began to fabricate my own and that helped a bit. After forming FlisKits I kept seeing discussions about them, the frustrations and the successes mirroring what I had done for so many years. It was then that I considered introducing a micro line.

At about the same time, Quest was looking into stopping production on their line of kits while working to sell their stock pile of motors (and it's *still* a stock pile ). The folks from Quest and the folks from FlisKits got together and here we are

When we first introduced the "Micro to the MAXX" line of kits and parts there was a big rush for the "new stuff" and then it tapered off drastically (which we expected). Then, as hopped, interest grew as our reputation in this area grew, and the micro line has become quite strong.

If you have ANY interest or curiosity in this area I encourage you to give it a shot. If you purchase one of our kits, I assure you, you will not be disappointed

jim

graylensman said:

He was just popping open some packages he had on hand. I admit that I'm not great with guesstimating altitude, but they didn't seem to climb that high to me. In fact a couple of them barely cleared the launch rod- the saucer comes to mind, but I think also the Saturn V as well.

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LOL Grey! I'm thinkin you may need to have your internal theodolite calibrated but 20-25 feet for the UFO sound pretty close... I guess things do look a lot smaller on an open flat grassy great outdoors field.

We tired to launch a Micro LPB saucer under an 18' peak Park PicnicShelter with an old type MMX-1 motor as part of a awards picnic once, assuming it wouldn't make it to the top. We were so wrong... not only did it hit the peak of the roof it was still under thurst bounding back to the concrete deck and breaking.
I have an 80' Wild Cherry tree in my back yard, it was measured the last time we had it pruned. I regularly have the upper 1/4 decorated with Various LPB's flown by the neighborhood or visiting grand kids.
I've had a model just clear the launch rod. That's about 9" LOL!!!! it was a 21 gram skydart... now that was disappointing.
The lack of good flight performance is the main reason Quest stopped production of the LPB sets, Bill was very upset with what the China manufacturers did to the original designs he sent them which in some cases tripled the mass of the model, the Saucer is a good example.

When some of us started scratch building micros, limiting lift-off weight was the very first consideration. Now we've steadly moved the mass and diameter up and back down again so that it's pretty well established just about any configuration can be flown with "decent" perfromance within 5 to 10grams range. Lighter is always better, but 19gram single motor models can get 10-15 feet
Another interesting thing is as Jim mentioned earlier; it's better to view Micro flights for 30-50 feet away. Becuase of this, we've discovered models with T3 (.375") diameters are easier to see on the pad and in the air While minimum dia. T2+ (.281") can and well get you the very best altitudes, they are much more easily lost during recovery.
hope these little blurbs help folks with new building plans.

So has Quest stopped making mmx motors?

I believe that is the case, though Jim could tell us better than anyone. However, I understand there is a HUGE stockpile still to go through- I was told not to worry, build 'em and fly 'em. The motors will be there.

Gregor said:

So has Quest stopped making mmx motors?

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That's not the correct question: the Question should be are Micro Maxx motors available? The answer to which is Yes.
MMX motors are currently in stock in VAST quantity ready for purchase.
At the moment Quest is not currently producing additional motors to be added to the couple million already in storage.
Additional production depends on increased demand As with Estes motor production, and like the current lack of Most Booster motors becuase of low sales...if folks don't buy the stored stock...new production doesn't happen.

So I'll Ask:
Have you purchased your case (12 -6pks) of MMX-II #5663 motors for 2008 Yet?

I've just finished my first micro with 2nd on the way, so I've only bought 2-6packs so far. More to come though, I believe I feel an addiction coming on!

We don't really believe you with out a picture.

It took something as unique as the Nanite to draw me in. Now that I'm here, well I'm just glad this part of the hobby is less expensive than those 4 inchers I've been working on!

BTW, the wings really are smooth. I've just got the camera set at the lowest resolution so it would stay under 100k. I would like to know how to post nicer pics, but thats for another thread about a whole other hobby.

Beautiful Nanite, Gregor! let us know how she flies.

I know I'm hooked on MMX- I watch these guys flying HPR, and I now think about how many MMX motors i could buy for the price of one reload.

Gregor said:

It took something as unique as the Nanite to draw me in. Now that I'm here, well I'm just glad this part of the hobby is less expensive than those 4 inchers I've been working on!

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Not to hijack this thread, but how did the build go? For a MttM model, it is by far the most complex we've put out there...

The build went really well, instructions were great. Being a novice, one of the challenging parts included gluing things straight and perpindicular. Just eyeballed everything and am pretty happy with the results. The wing, the tail and the stabilizer look right to me anyway. Also, although I tried to leave only a slight amount of tension in the rubber, I'm still a little concerned about the "snap" when the wing slides forward. I haven't had the nerve to pull it all the way back and let it go. Just pulling it halfway back and letting go produces a loud thwack. I'm hoping the thread moving through the lugs will slow the slide down a little. I used wood glue throughout(sparingly as suggested) with a tiny dab of thin ca on the lugs. Lastly, it was my first attempt at sanding airfoils. I'm sure I did a pretty rough job there, but the proof will be in the glide! Just waiting on motors to test it out. Complex or not, it has been a great introduction to micro.